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Ewar idea
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Zetak
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-05-02 11:20:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Zetak
Hi guys!

The reason I'm writing is because an interesting idea (at least to meBlink) popped to my mind. It is about ewar. Specifically target painting, dampening, disrupting and scrambling. As we all know, any ewar item you use takes precious mid slot items, which renders a lot of ship bad in pvp, it requires a lot of sacrifice in terms of dps, module use and tank, or just needs heavy gang support. I often see comments about a lot of ships that they suck because if they put on ewar for pvp they have little to no defense, or they cannot use range and tracking enhancement modules, or they have to give up some other essential module.

I've always considered ewar modules offensive dedicated items and i never understood the mid slot placing of these items.

If i could, I would move some (web and scramble surely) or all of the ewar items with the exception of ECM from mid slot to high slot. If you think about it it makes sense, because it would allow players to use Electronic warfare in pve more often, without sacrificing some or lot of efficency of the ships, in pvp you would not fly a glasscannon ewar ship. I would dare say that a lot of ship would be more viable in pve missions, and a lot of pve ships in pvp. I would keep mid slots to cap, shield, speed, drone, AB/MWD and turret enhancement dedicated.

I think it would benefit the game... Or maybe not, but it is not my place to decide.

Yours sincerely:
Zetak
Drake Doe
88Th Tax Haven
#2 - 2013-05-02 12:30:33 UTC
Gimps most setups of every ship class, other than CBCs to an extent -1

"The homogenization of EVE began when Gallente and Caldari started sharing a weapon system."---Vermaak Doe-- "Ohh squabbles ohh I love my dust trolls like watching an episode of Maury with less " Is he my Dad " but more of " My Neighbor took a dump on my lawn " good episode! pops more corn" ---Evernub--
Ix Method
Doomheim
#3 - 2013-05-02 12:41:55 UTC
Given this, why would anyone ever armour tank?

Travelling at the speed of love.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#4 - 2013-05-02 13:39:19 UTC
Drake Doe wrote:
Gimps most setups of every ship class, other than CBCs to an extent -1



Even them. Only ships that would actually be able to fit tackle and full DPS would be marauders and maybe a handful of BS.
Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
High Bear Nation.
#5 - 2013-05-02 14:13:44 UTC
alot of the new frigs have open high slots as well.

i do not like this personally. i wish there was a better way tho. look at the retribution. for the longest, it only had 1 mid and thats GOT to be propulsion. now, its changed for the better, but we only get either a web or a point.
move it to low, u gimp armor tank. keep it mid, u gimp shield tanks.

its a trade off.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#6 - 2013-05-02 15:51:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Zan Shiro
Zetak wrote:
in pvp you would not fly a glasscannon ewar ship. I would dare say that a lot of ship would be more viable in pve missions, and a lot of pve ships in pvp. I would keep mid slots to cap, shield, speed, drone, AB/MWD and turret enhancement dedicated.



Scorpion/widow say hi. These are e-war bs' that can attempt to do dps torp fit. Unless partial to officer multspecs (and an associated DS fit shield tank this allows to be fit) they do this one of 2 ways.

Option 1: ghetto armour tank with a reduced ecm strength tank mix. 1600 plate (or 2), eanm, dcu and if only single plate 4th low optional (usually a jam boosting mod). this ship tanks by jams and the ghetto armour there in case that fails. And it relies heavily on all those people it just bridged in (if a widow) or in the gang to either RR it and/or kill stuff really fast to not take fire as much.


Option 2: straight up tank by jam. Jam boosts lows and rigs. No attempt at any tank at all. If the RNG gods hate it and the gang bit off more than it can chew, scorp/widow is going boom if it can't gtfo.


See when people bring up the related why can't we have e-war BS' jsut like caldari does....they tend to forget ccp gives and takes. Yes we have scorp/widow. And all its tradeoffs to run e-war. then I look at thier yard and go man I like the redeemer way more as is. Then I go I know I have this crazy idea....I jam and the redeemer pops what I jam for the whole mixed fleet composition idea. this way stuff dies, and we take less damage in the process.



Also not bringing e-war and other odd ball ships into pve is a player choice. many follow that lead lemming off of pirate bs/t3/marauders cliff. All in the chase of that isk per hour dragon.

Others I know run off the wall combos. I ran with a corpie whose 10/10 setup was a huginn and muninn. Huginn did its its e-war thang to make the muninn tear stuff up. Could he get better isk per hour tengu and mach spamming? Probably. He already having sidelines making biliions a month was just looking to make pve interesting. And fix sec standing, that at the time and until changed is on a 15 minute tick, 1 rat per tick. If he killed 10 or 100 bs in 15 minutes in system, only rat 1 counts.
Zetak
State War Academy
Caldari State
#7 - 2013-05-03 06:01:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Zetak
Danika Princip wrote:
Drake Doe wrote:
Gimps most setups of every ship class, other than CBCs to an extent -1

Even them. Only ships that would actually be able to fit tackle and full DPS would be marauders and maybe a handful of BS.


True. But don't forget that many ship got, or will get reduction in high slots, even bs-s. My thinking were focused around that when you do missions, you could fit some ewar.
In pvp some frigs cruisers or specialized t2 ships could have more relaxed fittings in terms of defense and slot layout. it would tone a bit down the dps i think. Also on the sidelines I would add that it is a bit unfair to shield tankers that every ewar is dumped to the mid slots. even to armor tankers.

Quote:
Given this, why would anyone ever armour tank?


I see your point there. but then again, with the exception of some narrow line of ships, why would anyone shield tank in pvp for instance? I understand that if you want shield tank go for gang, but it is really meh. After some thinking I agree that some ewar should remain in mid slot, but imho at the bare minimum, web and scramble definitely should move to high slot.
And why would anyone armor tank? Well because there are a lot of payers who theorycraft awsome fits, and great veteran armor tanker players always find a way to work things out for the better.