Player Features and Ideas Discussion

1) It'll never get the 7th turret slot the Machariel has, not without the removal of drones, and even if it did, that would completely invalidate most of your post as you'd be giving up that 2nd utility high.

2) It'll be significantly more agile than the typhoon, with a higher acceleration. In a shield fit, this could be further improved.

3) It's 6 mids, allowing you to feasibly stack which ever form of EWAR you have on a single target, you could trash the optimal range of a beam apoc to 10-20km using 2x tracking disruptors - whilst having 50km fall-off with 800mm AC's (barrage), or use 2 tracking computers to boost that fall off to +100km - imo it's borderline OP, but I suppose that's a hard fact for some to realise, especially those fixated on point blank DPS. Far from pigeon holing it into a shield fit, it FINALLY allows the tempest to DO SOMETHING MEANINGFUL when fitted with armour, as apposed to a a poor mans *insert another 5 mid armour tanking battleship here*

4) And no, you could fit a smartbomb or lockbreaker in that 2nd high if you wanted to as well. But that doesn't allow you to come close to making up the utility of what you could get with an additional mid.

How does this "invalidate most of [my] post"? I had one paragraph and a sentence about it, and when I mentioned the 7th turret slot, I mentioned that it would be the only thing worth not fitting a neut over.


I want the ship to be fast and agile on it's own, not something that requires a shield fit to do that. My vision for the tempest is a fast, agile, hard-hitting ship whose tank isn't exactly the best, one that can be fit for either shield or armor. This is perfectly in line with the Minmatar philosphy. See: the Stabber.


It's been a while since I've tested it out, but I'm pretty damned sure that's not possible without a ship bonus that the Tempest lacks. They nerfed TD's pretty hard a while back. They're still useful in some situations (1-v-1's, when you can get them), but they're less than ideal in most.


The Tempest can already hit to 40km with barrage. How is that point-blank? Also, how useful is a 70km falloff when you can't warp disrupt your opponent from that far out? Sure, it's useful in fleets, but again it seems to be trying to limit the Tempest's role, and one of the great things about the ship has always been its utility and the ability to be fit for multiple roles. Additionally, an arty Maelstrom or an AC Tornado do it better at that range; the Mael has the alpha, and the Tornado has matching range and more DPS.

1) Your entire post is based around the idea that 2 utility high slots is actually valuable. It isnt, as you've just demonstrated.

2) Compare the stats I've suggested with the other attack battleships. It'll have higher acceleration (lower mass) and better agility (see agility mod) - With the increased fall off and it's focus on med range, being the fastest (without trading slots for speed mods) doesn't seem like a balanced trade off.

3) Well you should test it out or at least look at the stats before forming an (incorrect!) opinion on TD's. Within a fleet, extra ECCM, TC's, SB's etc becomes even more important.

4) Your complaint focuses on point blank DPS being anemic - this is only true when it's armour tanking. AND even so, the point of the above isn't to turn it into another megathron. And also, the Tempest only out damages the Mealstrom when fitted with torps (!)

5) A 6 mid tempest could fit more tackle, more TC's, more webs/scrams/mjds/eccm etc etc - basically, far more options than a high slot, and in a fleet situation, it'll have far more damage projection with extra tc's or sbs. There aren't really diminishing returns in regards to mid slot usage, there are just too many ways it can be used. And currently, there are just too many BETTER ships with 5 mids to try to force the Tempest to compete with in symmetric ways.

6) Going to 7/6/6 pigeon holes it FAR LESS as a shield tanker, when compared to 8/5/6 as an armour tanker - because not only does that extra mid slot have, even though you still don't want to admit it, have significant value as an armour tanker, the high slot is zero sum in regards to shield or armour performance. (Unless you want to some how argue that shield tankers don't use utility high slots?)

It becomes unargably better at both armour (mid range damage projection) and shield roles because that additional high slot can really only be used by a couple of things.

Who actually flys the hurricane anymore? Eitherway, the concept of a "Glorified battlecruiser" is bad. A battlecruiser is really a battleship without the tank or the EHP - without the real speed, acceleration or agility there just isn't any point - and if it was good enough, I'd bet that would trample pretty hard on the two battlecruisers already for-filling that role right now.

With how much damage at that 40 km? Check and comapre witht he damage the apocalypse can deal at that same range. Or even the abaddon..... Hint will make you want to repack your temepst if you wanted a ship to fight near 40 km range.

One of the smartest posts in the entire thread.

i dont really like the idea of the web bonus plus the 8% rof is a bit odd

on top of that if need a camping BS i think minmatars are totally the wrong race

for me the right direction for the tempest is speed agility and a better damage bonus like i said before 5% rof 7,5% damage (and this shoul apply to all the minmatar double damage bonused ships like the cane and ruppie that at the moment are really ridiculous compared to the blooming of 10% bonuses)

Just from cursory EFT warrioring, when both fit for dual LSE, the Tempest comes in with ~220 more DPS (800mm's), or 170 more DPS (dual 425mm's), ~25km more range, ~20% more EHP and is 300m/s slower without overheating, while aligning 5 seconds slower.

Frankly, i don't see the Fleet Cane getting used at all simply because the Tempest does the same thing roughly as well for less money. It's not so much that the Tempest is good as it is that the Fleet Cane is rather underwhelming, especially in comparison to the Navy Brutix, which can be armor buffered for ~110k EHP (about 50% more than the Tempest with a Dual LSE, 2x CDFE 2x Em screen settup) and over 1000 DPS while still going as fast as the Tempest.

This really highlights the main problem with making BS into Fat BC's, you step on BC toes.

Minmatar Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+5% bonus to Large Projectile Turret rate of fire 10% bonus to Large Projectile Turret rate of fire
+5% bonus to Large Projectile Turret damage 7.5% bonus to Large Projectile Tracking

Slot layout: 8H 7H (-1), 5M, 6L 7L (+1); 6 turrets , 4 launchers
Fittings: 16000 PWG(+500), 550 CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 7000(+46) / 7300(+1089) / 6800(+259)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second) : 5400(+87.5) / 1154s / 4.68
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 120 130 (+5) / .12 / 101050000(-2250000) / 16.81s(-.37s)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 75 / 75
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 67.5km(+5k) / 100 / 7
Sensor strength: 20 Ladar Sensor Strength(+1)
Signature radius: 360(+20)

Change to 10 % RoF and 7.5% tracking bonus, lose a high, gain a low, add in a little more speed.

This change would give it some flavor over the current offerings. With the Armageddon being nuet bonused now, who needs to bring the Tempest for the job? I could see some 1200 Arty fits working with this as well as better application for the 800's giving it a better difference between the Mael and the Nado.

changes in bold

Ok its odd that I can agree. I just do not agree that being a t1 hull is automatically exclusive to web bonus since the geddon got a neut bonus.


I am just tryign to find a role that is not massively outdone by the tornado, maesltrom, megathron, hyperion, armageddon and hurricane, and web was somethign none of them could do