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[Odyssey] Module Rebalancing Part One: RSBs and TEs

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Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#821 - 2013-03-30 21:19:43 UTC
Rroff wrote:
I mean when was the last time you saw someone complaining about TEs seriously? infact there are so many things that need addressing before TEs should even be a thought on someones mind.

Getting bored of complaining about this stuff now tho for all the great changes lately theres been a few like this creeping in - just gonna keep playing til it goes too far (probably around the time command ship changes come into effect) and then find another game to play.

Every time winmatar were on topic, TE were accused of a fair amount of their OPness. There must some tracks of this in the hurricane nerf thread in fact.

Also, can I have you stuff ? :D
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#822 - 2013-03-30 21:37:19 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Fozzie
Just posting to say that I'm keeping an eye on this thread over the holiday weekend, we're not ignoring it. I'll be making some more substantial replies once work starts up again.

Also Micheal Harari I love how you think the two threads on T1 logistics ships in Retribution now count as "every other new thread" I create. How's life in a world with support frigates going? Have they killed off all solo pvp in the game yet as you predicted?

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Zircon Dasher
#823 - 2013-03-30 21:40:19 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Just posting to say that I'm keeping an eye on this thread over the holiday weekend, we're not ignoring it. I'll be making some more substantial replies once work starts up again.

Also Micheal Harari I love how you think the two threads on T1 logistics ships in Retribution now count as "every other new thread" I create. How's life in a world with support frigates going? Have they killed off all solo pvp in the game yet as you predicted?


YAY updates!


also: LOLOLOLOLOL

Nerfing High-sec is never the answer. It is the question. The answer is 'YES'.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#824 - 2013-03-30 21:41:19 UTC
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
Rroff wrote:
I mean when was the last time you saw someone complaining about TEs seriously? infact there are so many things that need addressing before TEs should even be a thought on someones mind.

Getting bored of complaining about this stuff now tho for all the great changes lately theres been a few like this creeping in - just gonna keep playing til it goes too far (probably around the time command ship changes come into effect) and then find another game to play.

Every time winmatar were on topic, TE were accused of a fair amount of their OPness. There must some tracks of this in the hurricane nerf thread in fact.

Also, can I have you stuff ? :D


To be fair I only started playing the game I think after the time winmatar came out on top if its what I think your referring to, as I said before tho I completely agree there are some setups where TEs could do with rebalancing but I'm also of the opinion that overall its a heavy handed way to fix something that on some ships has a much bigger impact than on others i.e. some ships literally the viability of using them can come down to the difference of 1-2km of damage projection.

If I do quit it will probably be with a bang so you'd have to loot my wrecks.
PAPULA
The Chodak
Void Alliance
#825 - 2013-03-30 22:04:07 UTC
Goldiiee wrote:
the TE II was giving all ships a buff,

Same with large shield extender, it gives buff to all ships, it should get removed from game.
Major Killz
inglorious bastards.
#826 - 2013-03-30 22:12:26 UTC
PAPULA wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:
the TE II was giving all ships a buff,

Same with large shield extender, it gives buff to all ships, it should get removed from game.


Ha ha ha!

Wise words Confucius. Lets see them try to beat that logic. Ha.


- killz

[u]Ich bin ein Pirat ！[/u]
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#827 - 2013-03-30 23:06:55 UTC
Major Killz wrote:
PAPULA wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:
the TE II was giving all ships a buff,

Same with large shield extender, it gives buff to all ships, it should get removed from game.


Ha ha ha!

Wise words Confucius. Lets see them try to beat that logic. Ha.


- killz

Your absolutely right, and I was totally wrong, TE II were not OP. Everyone that is disagreeing with this nerf is completely correct in their belief that short range weapons should have a longer effective range than scrams, neuts, webs, or any other potential counter measure. After all, how else am I supposed to use Autocannons and Blasters if not at the absolute outside range of their influence? I was wrong in thinking that anything that has high damage, fast ROF should have an effective counter. After all there is no other weapon system in EVE that can hit from outside the range of web and scram influence, right?

It makes so much more sense from this point of view. Really?

And BTW, LSE are coupled with Sig bloom, Armour Plates are coupled with mass bloom, Cloaks with lower reaction time, longer range weapons take more CPU and PG to prevent coupling them with huge tanks, everything has a downside; and TE? What is the downside to having increased range?

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
Dez Affinity
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#828 - 2013-03-30 23:34:40 UTC
Goldiiee wrote:
Major Killz wrote:
PAPULA wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:
the TE II was giving all ships a buff,

Same with large shield extender, it gives buff to all ships, it should get removed from game.


Ha ha ha!

Wise words Confucius. Lets see them try to beat that logic. Ha.


- killz

Your absolutely right, and I was totally wrong, TE II were not OP. Everyone that is disagreeing with this nerf is completely correct in their belief that short range weapons should have a longer effective range than scrams, neuts, webs, or any other potential counter measure. After all, how else am I supposed to use Autocannons and Blasters if not at the absolute outside range of their influence? I was wrong in thinking that anything that has high damage, fast ROF should have an effective counter. After all there is no other weapon system in EVE that can hit from outside the range of web and scram influence, right?


Let's remove long range ammo instead on short range weapons?? I'm a genius.

I noticed that there are no short range laser weapons or missile launchers. This is cool.

Your points are awful, sorry bro.
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#829 - 2013-03-30 23:40:59 UTC
Dez Affinity wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:
Major Killz wrote:
PAPULA wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:
the TE II was giving all ships a buff,

Same with large shield extender, it gives buff to all ships, it should get removed from game.


Ha ha ha!

Wise words Confucius. Lets see them try to beat that logic. Ha.


- killz

Your absolutely right, and I was totally wrong, TE II were not OP. Everyone that is disagreeing with this nerf is completely correct in their belief that short range weapons should have a longer effective range than scrams, neuts, webs, or any other potential counter measure. After all, how else am I supposed to use Autocannons and Blasters if not at the absolute outside range of their influence? I was wrong in thinking that anything that has high damage, fast ROF should have an effective counter. After all there is no other weapon system in EVE that can hit from outside the range of web and scram influence, right?


Let's remove long range ammo instead on short range weapons?? I'm a genius.

I noticed that there are no short range laser weapons or missile launchers. This is cool.

Your points are awful, sorry bro.

Yes you are. A genius, that is. :)

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#830 - 2013-03-31 00:32:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
Goldiiee wrote:

And BTW, LSE are coupled with Sig bloom, Armour Plates are coupled with mass bloom, Cloaks with lower reaction time, longer range weapons take more CPU and PG to prevent coupling them with huge tanks, everything has a downside; and TE? What is the downside to having increased range?


Thats not an entirely silly way to look at it, a lot of (sort of) comparable low slot modules have a penalty of some sort. Much prefer it (depending on the penalty) than a fairly big lop at the current stats.

Another possible alternative tho it doesn't really address the issues where it hits smaller ships as they would likely be expensive is to keep the current T2 stats on deadspace variants of the module.
PAPULA
The Chodak
Void Alliance
#831 - 2013-03-31 00:43:00 UTC
Power Diagnostic has no negative effects.
Oh, wait it needs to be nerfed right now.
Major Killz
inglorious bastards.
#832 - 2013-03-31 00:47:28 UTC
PAPULA wrote:
Power Diagnostic has no negative effects.
Oh, wait it needs to be nerfed right now.


BOOSH!

[u]Ich bin ein Pirat ！[/u]
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#833 - 2013-03-31 00:48:22 UTC
PAPULA wrote:
Power Diagnostic has no negative effects.
Oh, wait it needs to be nerfed right now.

You mean other than losing a low slot to accomidate for PG requirements? Really is it that hard to understand? or is this just your nature?

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#834 - 2013-03-31 00:53:26 UTC
Goldiiee wrote:
PAPULA wrote:
Power Diagnostic has no negative effects.
Oh, wait it needs to be nerfed right now.

You mean other than losing a low slot to accomidate for PG requirements? Really is it that hard to understand? or is this just your nature?

I am imagining you going through every item in ship mods, line by line, right now looking for another example.Sad

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
MystLynx
Lulzsec Space
#835 - 2013-03-31 01:23:47 UTC  |  Edited by: MystLynx
Goldiiee wrote:
PAPULA wrote:
Power Diagnostic has no negative effects.
Oh, wait it needs to be nerfed right now.

You mean other than losing a low slot to accomidate for PG requirements? Really is it that hard to understand? or is this just your nature?



Well, you are not serious when saying TE should be nerfed because it has backsides? Must be a troll. Or you're just... Nah im not gonna say that.


"NERF GYROS, MFS, HS, BCS, DC, GUNS, MISSILES, NEUTS, SBs, PROBE LAUNCHERS, NERF EVERYYYYYYYYYTHIIIIIIIIIIIIIING!"

This forum should get a no brain restriction.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#836 - 2013-03-31 03:25:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Have they killed off all solo pvp in the game yet as you predicted?


every change CCP has made since 2003 has killed off all solo PvP and CCP only cares about blobs (and only Goonswarm/the NC/BoB/(insert whatever alliance controls CCP here) fields large fleets)

this change will also be the nth final nail in the coffin of solo PvP just like every other change made to anything in eve anywhere

let me tell you about all the remote sensor boosters I use when I go soloing (which I don't, because CCP killed it off, see)

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Kleen Enkook
Mal Reynolds' Pool of Recruits
#837 - 2013-03-31 06:55:28 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Just posting to say that I'm keeping an eye on this thread over the holiday weekend, we're not ignoring it. I'll be making some more substantial replies once work starts up again.

Also Micheal Harari I love how you think the two threads on T1 logistics ships in Retribution now count as "every other new thread" I create. How's life in a world with support frigates going? Have they killed off all solo pvp in the game yet as you predicted?


I have to say, sir, that a CCP employee berating/trying to make fun of a player (ie customer) is not entirely professional behaviour. If I was your boss, I'd probably have a conversation with you about that. But I'm not, so carry on.
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#838 - 2013-03-31 07:44:00 UTC
Kleen Enkook wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Just posting to say that I'm keeping an eye on this thread over the holiday weekend, we're not ignoring it. I'll be making some more substantial replies once work starts up again.

Also Micheal Harari I love how you think the two threads on T1 logistics ships in Retribution now count as "every other new thread" I create. How's life in a world with support frigates going? Have they killed off all solo pvp in the game yet as you predicted?


I have to say, sir, that a CCP employee berating/trying to make fun of a player (ie customer) is not entirely professional behaviour. If I was your boss, I'd probably have a conversation with you about that. But I'm not, so carry on.


If you "had a talk" with an employee over that then you would be a freaking terrible boss.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Michael Harari
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
#839 - 2013-03-31 08:01:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Michael Harari
CCP Fozzie wrote:
How's life in a world with support frigates going? Have they killed off all solo pvp in the game yet as you predicted?


No, people just went right into the cruisers.

Edit: My bad, I guess it was only the early stages of tiericide where you considered how changes would affect solo/small gang pvp.
Naomi Knight
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#840 - 2013-03-31 08:52:20 UTC
PAPULA wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:
the TE II was giving all ships a buff,

Same with large shield extender, it gives buff to all ships, it should get removed from game.

TE isnt getting removed , so you fail hard, little butthurt arent you?