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[Odyssey] Module Rebalancing Part One: RSBs and TEs

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Turgon Barash
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#221 - 2013-03-27 07:06:24 UTC
Ganthrithor wrote:
Hellakhanasos wrote:
Venustas Blue wrote:
If your fighting at 0, say in scram & Webb range to be doing affective damage, theres no way to disengage say if your off gate. Unless your ****** fit with stabs or possibly AB fit and able to burn out. The more powerful ship or better counter fit ship will always win. You will not have the ability granted to kiting ships to disengagde by either burning away, or causing the hostile to lose point by pulsing MWD on cross axis so they burn out of range & lose point, allowing you to warp out. There's little skill in fighting at 0 (scram/Webb) range, nerfing TEs kiting ability, wich is an art and skill its self would be yet another mistake by CCP, and a great loss as far as skill goes for the game.
There is counters to kiting ships, & as far as minnie ships go, they have already been nerfed enough, dont ruin it by overstepping a reasonable current mark & success. This proposed change to TEs needs to be scrapped. All it would do is subject eve to yet a other nerf of making the game ever easier, this does not inspire anybody to become better within tactics and situational awareness, it only acts to dumb it down, even giving more reason to blob, and there should be no further reason given to blobbing WHAT SO EVER. Should be promoting skill and fun gfs instead.
Sometimes it becomes very apparent CCP are out of touch with the game and its tactics, this is as good as any example.
A resounding NO to TE nerf from me.


After sifting through the turd of many prior posts over the last couple of pages. This is more of less spot on.


Yeah basically this.


THIS^^


As far as TE nerf goes you are just boosting TDs againe ( i thought you nerfed them why boost them now) and we still dont have anything against rockets/missiles like we have TDs for turrets.The most kiters i engage this days are in kestrels,hookbills or raptors in frig classes,talwars and coraxes in dessies,caracals none of this ships fit turrets as far as i know and i all see them sporting one or two TDs or RSDs.With this the only thing you are truly gona nerfe further down is solo play like its not been pounded to ground enough already.

I guess you'll have to change general description of minmatar ships now no more speedy,agile ships made for hit and run tactics to sitting ducks mediocre at everything excelling at nothing. Twisted


I see blobs and missiles everywhere.Shocked

While your at it nerfe lazorz too (scorch) when is the last time anyone saw someone fit beams when you can have awesome range with pulse and scorch + better tracking and rofP
Sean Sonnach
4S Corporation
The Initiative.
#222 - 2013-03-27 07:09:54 UTC
Put simply, all I see is gallente blaster boats loosing what little range they have.
That is NOT a balanced change.
If the aim is to reduce the Minnie ship pvp dominance then this significant side effect should not be overlooked.

I would propose that the DEV thinking of implementing this chance consider a balancing compensation measure for the people who use TE and Blaster boats (and even the targeted minnie ship users).

To the DEV:
If you insist on fixing what is not broken I would suggest the introduction of a low slot module that is itself more dedicated to range than tracking(in addition to the new mainly tracking TE). This will leave the pilot choice, as the pilot who fits a TC has with scripts. It might be argued that the TE is currently overpowered considering it has 2 effects at once, but this nerf will destroy the choice in fitting ships.

I personally have invested a lot of skill points in blasters and shields, confident that CCP could only improve blasters. This really is bad news if you go ahead with it.

Also why are we nerfing the recently balanced ships? I thought the plan was ship re-balancing? not module re-balancing? if there is a perceived problem with certain ships and their optimal/falloff why not just tweak these individually in the much anticipated SHIP re-balance?

I will not go on but there is still plenty on my mind, but please deal with the above at present, they are my foremost thoughts on this matter.
Roman Sichko
Grandfather's in armchair
#223 - 2013-03-27 07:16:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Roman Sichko
cannons - nice dps, any type damage, need tracking but good falloff.
rockets - nice dps, any type of damage, don,t need tracking, nice range.
blasters - nice dps - and that is only one nice side. Bad optimal bad falloff, only kin-term damage. Used many capa. And now innovation!!! - NERF OPTIMAL. - good work guys!!Lol
Volstruis
Kybernauts
Kybernauts Clade
#224 - 2013-03-27 07:16:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Volstruis
Minmatar Speed Nerf!

Coming SoonTM
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#225 - 2013-03-27 07:21:12 UTC
Ap01110n wrote:


Shields have never been dominant in anything but small scale hit and run tactics (except for Tengus which is a separate issue altogether). For the past 2+ years its been all amarr armor (or maels just to counter abaddons incredible buffer).
.


You should make a more out of touch statement, because Maelstroms, Munnins, Rokhs, and Tengus were pretty much THE dominating doctrines used around 0.0.


Also the number of people in this thread assuming that all weapon ranges are nerfed 33% is amazing, I can't comprehend how you can't understand whats going on, but the collective loss of range in most cases ends up being around 1-2km optimal and a 2-4 km in fall off and suddenly everybody is screaming about how they're being forced into this tiny ball.

You're all sheep, i swear to go the ability to tie your shoes on your own in the morning must escape you.


The change is good, you could even say the change isn't strong enough to make the changes that CCP hopes for but that you're all whiners who throw a temper tantrum when your particular play style is in any way changed from what you're used to.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
Roman Sichko
Grandfather's in armchair
#226 - 2013-03-27 07:30:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Roman Sichko
It you don't understand friend, that a bad for matar, yes, but it a death for gallente.
stagz
Perkone
Caldari State
#227 - 2013-03-27 07:30:51 UTC
The TE nerf is to much
This damages small gang and skirmish play style far to much
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#228 - 2013-03-27 07:31:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaju Enki
Casha Andven wrote:
Ganthrithor wrote:
Hellakhanasos wrote:
Venustas Blue wrote:
If your fighting at 0, say in scram & Webb range to be doing affective damage, theres no way to disengage say if your off gate. Unless your ****** fit with stabs or possibly AB fit and able to burn out. The more powerful ship or better counter fit ship will always win. You will not have the ability granted to kiting ships to disengagde by either burning away, or causing the hostile to lose point by pulsing MWD on cross axis so they burn out of range & lose point, allowing you to warp out. There's little skill in fighting at 0 (scram/Webb) range, nerfing TEs kiting ability, wich is an art and skill its self would be yet another mistake by CCP, and a great loss as far as skill goes for the game.
There is counters to kiting ships, & as far as minnie ships go, they have already been nerfed enough, dont ruin it by overstepping a reasonable current mark & success. This proposed change to TEs needs to be scrapped. All it would do is subject eve to yet a other nerf of making the game ever easier, this does not inspire anybody to become better within tactics and situational awareness, it only acts to dumb it down, even giving more reason to blob, and there should be no further reason given to blobbing WHAT SO EVER. Should be promoting skill and fun gfs instead.
Sometimes it becomes very apparent CCP are out of touch with the game and its tactics, this is as good as any example.
A resounding NO to TE nerf from me.


After sifting through the turd of many prior posts over the last couple of pages. This is more of less spot on.


Yeah basically this.


This.
CCP you are dumbing down the game. May I ask why?


So balancing the nano faceroll and making more then 7 ships viable, including armor tanking, is dumbing down the game....

Keep up the good work CCP, you are doing an exelent job with this changes, the game will be in a much better state after this patch. Yes the nano facerollers will cry and fill the forums with tears, but that was expected, just think of it as an indication that you are doing a good work.

The Tears Must Flow
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#229 - 2013-03-27 07:32:44 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
Grath Telkin wrote:
Ap01110n wrote:


Shields have never been dominant in anything but small scale hit and run tactics (except for Tengus which is a separate issue altogether). For the past 2+ years its been all amarr armor (or maels just to counter abaddons incredible buffer).
.


You should make a more out of touch statement, because Maelstroms, Munnins, Rokhs, and Tengus were pretty much THE dominating doctrines used around 0.0.


Also the number of people in this thread assuming that all weapon ranges are nerfed 33% is amazing, I can't comprehend how you can't understand whats going on, but the collective loss of range in most cases ends up being around 1-2km optimal and a 2-4 km in fall off and suddenly everybody is screaming about how they're being forced into this tiny ball.

You're all sheep, i swear to go the ability to tie your shoes on your own in the morning must escape you.


The change is good, you could even say the change isn't strong enough to make the changes that CCP hopes for but that you're all whiners who throw a temper tantrum when your particular play style is in any way changed from what you're used to.


Except several of us are also discussing ships e.g. the SFI that lose about 30-40 DPS in their standard operating regime, where they don't have all that much DPS to begin with. The ship goes from being just barely viable as a kiter to being completely useless because its DPS and tank are too weak to brawl with and it can't kite because its DPS is easy to shrug off.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#230 - 2013-03-27 07:34:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaju Enki
stagz wrote:
The TE nerf is to much
This damages small gang and skirmish play style far to much


Because small gang and skirmish play equals nano faceroll.

The Tears Must Flow
Nomad I
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#231 - 2013-03-27 07:34:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Nomad I
Nerfing Remote Sensor Boosters s a bad idea, because it's the counter for dampeners. This is creating a huge advantage for dampeners.

The of TE nerf equals the low range weapons so that there is in relationship to the speed of the ships no huge difference, but damage and trracking. Long range weapons like med railsguns are getting nerfed and are not longer usefull at all.

Even when I'm hating kiting gangs, because they want no fight, it was a option in this game. I dont like the development that all ships are getting more and more equal.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#232 - 2013-03-27 07:36:43 UTC
Vaju Enki wrote:
stagz wrote:
The TE nerf is to much
This damages small gang and skirmish play style far to much


Because small gang and skirmish play equals nano faceroll.

Yeah! Death to kiting! All ships should brawl at < 10 km!

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#233 - 2013-03-27 07:39:02 UTC
brb buying all the railguns

<3

.
PAPULA
The Chodak
Void Alliance
#234 - 2013-03-27 07:41:19 UTC  |  Edited by: PAPULA
CCP Fozzie wrote:

Name OldFalloff NewFalloff OldOptimal NewOptimal
Tracking Enhancer II 30 20 15 10
Let me know what you think!

Wow Fozzie, you're nerfing this game ultra hard, i wonder what will happen with EVE when all players leave.

What's too much is too much.

STOP NERFING EVE !

This is my only currently active char, but i will let it expire soon because eve is getting ultra bad.
I'll go and play some other much better games than eve will be after these nerfs.
Katsami
Holy Amarrian Battlemonk
Crimson Inquisicion
#235 - 2013-03-27 07:49:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Katsami
My prime question is why this wasn't the first change on the bucket list when ship re-balancing was first started up?

A change like this effectively invalidates a large amount of the work you just did one expansion ago. This isn't some small change. It takes a number of ships that were borderline to begin with and throws them over the cliff.
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#236 - 2013-03-27 07:49:35 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Vaju Enki wrote:
stagz wrote:
The TE nerf is to much
This damages small gang and skirmish play style far to much


Because small gang and skirmish play equals nano faceroll.

Yeah! Death to kiting! All ships should brawl at < 10 km!


Yeah! Nano ships should "brawl at 20 km" will doing the huge dps that real brawlling ships should do, all of this will going at 2500km/s.

Some of you guys are bias as hell, Nano ships are broken beyond belief, making most ships of the game useless, armor tanking useless, etc.

I can't wait for this patch.

The Tears Must Flow
Hannott Thanos
Squadron 15
#237 - 2013-03-27 07:51:38 UTC
PAPULA wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:

Name OldFalloff NewFalloff OldOptimal NewOptimal
Tracking Enhancer II 30 20 15 10
Let me know what you think!

Wow Fozzie, you're nerfing this game ultra hard, i wonder what will happen with game when all players leave.

What's too much is too much.

STOP NERFING EVE !

This is my only currently active char, but i will let it expire soon because eve is getting ultra bad.
I'll go and play some other much better games than eve will be after these nerfs.

Ha. Aha. Ah aha. Hahahaha. We are better off then. Give me your stuff?

Loving the changes!

while (CurrentSelectedTarget.Status == ShipStatus.Alive) {

     _myShip.FireAllGuns(CurrentSelectedTarget);

}
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#238 - 2013-03-27 07:52:03 UTC
PAPULA wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:

Name OldFalloff NewFalloff OldOptimal NewOptimal
Tracking Enhancer II 30 20 15 10
Let me know what you think!

Wow Fozzie, you're nerfing this game ultra hard, i wonder what will happen with game when all players leave.

What's too much is too much.

STOP NERFING EVE !

This is my only currently active char, but i will let it expire soon because eve is getting ultra bad.
I'll go and play some other much better games than eve will be after these nerfs.


It's a buff to EvE Online, not a nerf. Their's more then Nano ships in this game, using speed shouldn't be the only viable tactic. Alot of ships will be viable again, armor tanking will be viable again.

The Tears Must Flow
Dez Affinity
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#239 - 2013-03-27 07:52:46 UTC
People are overreacting this isn't the death of blasters~ kiters~ anything but missiles~ but this does seem to be an unnecessary or misdirected nerf.
PAPULA
The Chodak
Void Alliance
#240 - 2013-03-27 08:00:44 UTC
Hannott Thanos wrote:
PAPULA wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:

Name OldFalloff NewFalloff OldOptimal NewOptimal
Tracking Enhancer II 30 20 15 10
Let me know what you think!

Wow Fozzie, you're nerfing this game ultra hard, i wonder what will happen with game when all players leave.

What's too much is too much.

STOP NERFING EVE !

This is my only currently active char, but i will let it expire soon because eve is getting ultra bad.
I'll go and play some other much better games than eve will be after these nerfs.

Ha. Aha. Ah aha. Hahahaha. We are better off then. Give me your stuff?

Loving the changes!

My stuff will go to > /dev/null
You may not have my stuff.