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change hi-sec exploration. make it mean something more...with one simple fix

Author
Somnorific
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-03-01 14:33:04 UTC
tech 3's should not be able to enter ded 1-4's(namely 3 and 4's)
watch the whole dynamic of exploration change for the better of the exploration community. IMO

Please post negative ripple effects of this proposed change.
Thx
St Mio
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2013-03-01 15:42:36 UTC
As long as there is ISK in high-sec exploration, older players with SP and ISK are going to farm the sites. If they can't use T3 ships, they'll just use faction fit T2 or pirate cruisers and you're back where you started, except the problem will be Gilas and Ishtars instead of Tengus.

Banning T3s from high-sec sites is just treating the symptoms instead of the cause.

I agree with the change though, it's silly to put them in the same restriction category as T1 cruisers.
Orlacc
#3 - 2013-03-01 16:48:55 UTC
I like when folks who have hardly played have new and exciting ideas for changes to the game.


Let's make it even easier in high-sec!

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."

Prekaz
The Exchange Collective
Solyaris Chtonium
#4 - 2013-03-01 16:57:56 UTC
Somnorific wrote:
tech 3's should not be able to enter ded 1-4's(namely 3 and 4's)
watch the whole dynamic of exploration change for the better of the exploration community. IMO

Please post negative ripple effects of this proposed change.
Thx



Suggesting that your idea would change "the whole dynamic" of exploration is probably the most arrogant thing I've read today. It would have zero impact on "the dynamic" of anything. It would change which ships older pilots use to blow through these sites at a breakneck pace, but I doubt that would be much comfort to the people trying to clear them in their meta-fit T1 cruisers.
Tierius Fro
Coronado's Cross
#5 - 2013-03-01 19:25:43 UTC
The dynamics of exploration were fundamentally changed when the current scanning mechanic was introduced along with wormholes. It made scanning much more simple and quicker to do. Wormholes added content and CCP has tweaked it, like revamping 4/10’s. Exploration used to be a niche career. It was still hit or miss, jackpot oriented, but required more dedication and fewer players were doing it.

In the previous mechanic finding a good site was a matter of patience and persistence. In the current mechanic finding a good site is simply a matter of luck and timing; that is, have you stumbled upon a site before the multitude of other explorers have found it. In the previous mechanic you dropped multi-spec probes and knew right away what kind of sites were in the system, and could target a specific type, but then usually had to spend lots of time to nail it down. In the current mechanic you spend time moving from system to system until you stumble across a site, which can be scanned very quickly.

How do you fix it? Does it even need fixing? I don’t know. I do know I explore much less than I used to, and exploration was once my bread and butter. Perhaps my focus has changed because as a player I have evolved and moved into different areas.

http://ridingevewormhole.blogspot.com/

Somnorific
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-03-01 19:39:08 UTC
I was feeling disgustipated this morning. It was a brief post more geared towards shock. My apologies if I offended.
Not sure what my age has to do with it however, if I've been scanning for 2 months not much to it...considering im flying. Imicus w/frig 5 and all the scan bells n whistles (no dsp) with my faction geared T1 alt following.
Its become ridiculous lately. If I see a tengu in system, I know to just move on to the next...
something has to change I feel-
since the explore profession has been introduced I am wondering if the scan sites have been added to compliment the now over abundance of scanners.
Also, as it stands I don't feel the mechanics of allowing t3 and t1 into the same site works well or plays fairly for the newer players .
so in closing, more sites geared for particular level of ships...t1,2,3 ...that would be swell.
Prekaz
The Exchange Collective
Solyaris Chtonium
#7 - 2013-03-01 20:06:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Prekaz
Somnorific wrote:

Its become ridiculous lately. If I see a tengu in system, I know to just move on to the next...
...
Also, as it stands I don't feel the mechanics of allowing t3 and t1 into the same site works well or plays fairly for the newer players .


This is a personal problem, not a game system problem.
TheSkeptic
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-03-01 21:50:12 UTC  |  Edited by: TheSkeptic
Somnorific wrote:
plays fairly for the newer players


News flash... EVE is not fair

Also... because I don't have the skills to fly a titan, they should be removed from game.

...

Kodama Ikari
Thragon
#9 - 2013-03-01 21:55:02 UTC
you'll be happy to know that just recently ccp changed hisec explo so 1/10's and 2/10's are no longer static plexes, findable through exploration, and do not allow tengus.
Mnemosyne Gloob
#10 - 2013-03-02 03:57:13 UTC
Discussed in another thread - yes i think it is out of whack when you see what rewards you can pull in, but the problem is not 'tengus', but too easy scanning.
Bullitbait
Perkone
Caldari State
#11 - 2013-03-02 13:52:56 UTC
Mnemosyne Gloob wrote:
Discussed in another thread - yes i think it is out of whack when you see what rewards you can pull in, but the problem is not 'tengus', but too easy scanning.


Actually, the problem is overcrowding of high-sec. Come out to null and there are better sites, less competition, and tbh less risk as you know who to be wary of.
Somnorific
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2013-03-02 21:07:27 UTC
the problem is and, is not overcrowding of hi-sec.
and this is also not a personal problem as someone posted.
I also understand those with t3's resentment of my statements.
the problem is ultimately lack of content for the growth of the explorer profession due to dynamics possible unforeseen when this profession was developed and born.

What I have proposed is simple and quite logical. Perhaps those running systems with their DSP 70% advantages and t3's racing for the overseer, looting and being on their merry way wont agree with me, of course they wont. Just as similarly, me at such a disadvantage will not agree with them.

What is wrong with adding more content geared towards individualized ships?
Its human for those at the top to say everything is just fine as is.
as well as to berate the person, with so few SP who suggests such blasphemy.

I want to explore. I also want to run combat plexes that have a chance at juicy prizes. In the relative safety of hi sec.
Those have become very very rare for me these days.(as luck alone would have it? no, not just luck there are other factors)
As such the lowly player i am, I can scan down 5 sigs to 100 as fast as the best of em. But here I am still at a disadvantage due to other factors.

I personally think I bring truths to the discussion. I see no negative arguments thus far as to why more specialized and individualized content cannot be added to a great dynamic of this game.
I simply see the usual SP ego warriors at work here.

Or how about this- make every damn signature in the game truly random, dynamically so. That would be just as fine with me as well.
As exploration stands now, luck plays less of a roll than what ship you fly. No bueno.
Somnorific
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-03-02 21:11:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Somnorific
Quote:
Actually, the problem is overcrowding of high-sec. Come out to null and there are better sites, less competition, and tbh less risk as you know who to be wary of.



I will be in null eventually. That is one of the ultimate goals of our newish corp.
For now and a while to come, I live in hi sec.
Radhe Amatin
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2013-03-03 06:11:37 UTC
Nulls sec is better off course...but wait u need a s*** load of SP to do some sites in there (combat ones).

U know CCP can always change the ships allowed through acceleration gates...they can make high sec combat site to allow only t1 ships if they wanted...but since 90% of the high sec explorers are ultra carebears with tech 3 or tech 2 who never leave high sec and 10% explorers , like my self, who are restricted to high sec combat sites because of low SP not because we don`t wanna go to low/null.

BTW low sec exploration is way better then high sec...been doing some low sec mag/radar sites ..can`t wait for my skills to get better to start the combat one.

Jita Mcpricechekr
Doomheim
#15 - 2013-03-04 01:31:19 UTC
So, you are adverse to doing anything to earn these goodies and think CCP should hand feed you increased payouts in what is already a pretty lucrative activity unless you're a complete idiot?

-Do you bother to find systems that are less frequented by other explorers? if you want to scan around Jita, you can expect fierce competition - get off your lazy a$$ and find some better places to explore. I've lived in 3/4 faction spaces and had no trouble identifying systems that were more worth my time than others in each of them.

-You want the safety of hisec. In Eve there are upsides and downsides with every decision. You choose to stay in hisec, you choose to deal with increased competition and lower payouts that come with it. Grow a pair, lowsec is readily accessible to all and much less traveled by explorers.

-Do you really think banning T3's from sites will deter the more experienced explorers from running those sites better,faster,smarter than you anyway? Good luck with that....crap idea

-Want to get rid of T3's in hisec? Easy answer is to nerf the drops there and/or buff the lowsec drops. If the value proposition and risk:reward clearly favor lowsec, people will go there. I like this option, as hisec payouts are way too high and confusing nubs into thinking they should be entitled to rare drops every other system, with no risk. Roll

-Low SP does not preclude anyone from venturing into lowsec...especially if you're only looking for PVE....lame excuse


TLDR....do some research, find better places to scan...htfu
Zoltan Lazar
#16 - 2013-03-04 02:25:37 UTC
My caracal with T1 light missiles beats tengus through 3/10s 100% of the time. I've literally never been beaten through a 3/10, even when there was two of them and one of me.

4/10s, tengus do do better than a drake, but they should, they cost a lot more, are pimped a lot more, and require a lot more SP.
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2013-03-04 02:39:00 UTC  |  Edited by: sabre906
You don't actually know what you're whining about. You think it's t3s, but once they're banned, it'll be something else. The issue is too many ppl in highsec chasing after too few plex. Someone else will get it first, period.

Change spawn rates according to population.
Jita Mcpricechekr
Doomheim
#18 - 2013-03-04 02:53:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Jita Mcpricechekr
sabre906 wrote:

Change spawn rates according to population.


fail explorers are still fail explorers...this will not fix the "issue" at all. This is an even worse idea than the OP. This would just result in threads from the same people asking "why are the XXX mod i got from my local ded variant worth half what they were?" A change like this would need to either be accompanied by a nerf to the drops or the market will simply autocorrect and we'll end up will more drops that are worth the same total amount anyway.

To address the OP's issue, you need to find a way to attract a good number of HS explorers elsewhere. nerfing ded 3's & 4's would be a good place to start, though I'm disinclined to make changes to a game with the soul purpose of supporting players who do not want to put any work in or make any tradeoffs.
Ethan Swiftblade
Albireo Solem
Pan-Intergalatic Business Community
#19 - 2013-03-04 07:28:26 UTC
You think High-sec exploration sux? You should really try out a radar or mag in c3/c4 wormholes and see how are those, its way less than you make from HS exploration, with a lot more SP needed, and a lot more dangerous....

I do think that nerfing 3/10 and 4/10 but increasing the number of k-space sigs will solve the issue instead of banning one type of ship, which btw are not the best ones if you want to contest a site.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#20 - 2013-03-04 07:28:55 UTC
Somnorific wrote:
tech 3's should not be able to enter ded 1-4's(namely 3 and 4's)
watch the whole dynamic of exploration change for the better of the exploration community. IMO

Please post negative ripple effects of this proposed change.
Thx


DSP's are a bigger problem then T3's, it's way to easy to jump from system to system and hand pick sites without much scanning. Force people to actually spend time scanning, and let them fly the ships they trained fore.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.

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