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New Eden Open Prizes at Risk?

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raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#61 - 2013-02-04 19:01:36 UTC
Darth Gustav wrote:
Pretty glad I saw this as a scam when it was originally announced.


muahahahahahah yeah dude, me too, but then i saw this guy coming up with this

CCP Bro said:

http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=73485

"The biggest misconception I see out there is the following: “CCP is only hosting this tournament to make some quick cash off the PLEX entry fee. This is not true in any way, shape, or form."

and suddenly it seemed 100% legit . I was like Yeah, keep telling that to urself Bro... ROFL :D
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#62 - 2013-02-04 19:08:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Darth Gustav
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Tyrrax Thorrk wrote:
Not to be a **** to CCP or anything but it's pretty pathetic that prizes still haven't been paid out.

I'm guessing CCP will be eating the 10k own3d is reneging on, so good for you but really this should've been sorted months ago.


You may have missed the news article explaining that Own3d owes a lot of people money but the explanation is likely in the OP. Hope that helps.


Apparently, since they took the PLEX for entry fees for a contest they agreed to pay out for, CCP owes some people some money too.

The money for the prizes should have been placed in an escrow-style fund before the tournament, let alone in time for the obligatory payout. This is business 101. In fact, the prize money should have been in place before CCP accepted any PLEX whatsoever as an entry fee.

Isn't there some kind of international business law to cover false advertisement of a loss leader? It seems to me that CCP's responsibility is extremely plain here. They took money in the form of PLEX as an entry fee for a contest with an advertised prize payout. What do they think, they can just not pay?

As mentioned above, we were absolutely assured that CCP was not just doing this to stimulate their sale of PLEX. That appears pretty misrepresentative to my lowly consumer eyes now, though, unless CCP is extremely forthcoming with the afore-promised prize money.

Sorry about your business partner, CCP. The debt's still real, though.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
The Invited
#63 - 2013-02-04 19:28:28 UTC
Inquisitor Kitchner wrote:
raven666wings wrote:




How many wings does your raven have?





Also did you even win anything?

My Raven was equipped with the following:

HIGH
06 x Cruise Missile Launcher I
01 x SMALL TRACTOR BEAM 1
01 x SALVAGER I

MEDIUM
04 x LARGE SHIELD EXTENDERS
01 x 'HYPHNOS' ECM
01 x MEDIUM SHIELD BOOSTER

LOW
01 x EMERGENCY DAMAGE CONTROL
01 x ARMOR KINETIC HARDENER I
01 x ARMOR THREMIC HARDENER I
02 x WARP CORE STABILIZER I

DRONES
02 x WARRIOR I DRONES
03 x HAMMERHEAD I DRONES

UPGRADES
01 x ROCKET FUEL CACHE PARTINTION I
01 x BAY LOADING ACCELERATOR I

Watch me live for all your Empyrean news and analysis!

raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#64 - 2013-02-04 19:33:40 UTC
Im sure that under either Icelandic or International laws it is illegal for any service providing company (be it entertainment or any other kind) to entice costumers into buying their product using a contest with unfullfilled rewards (scam). If this turns out to be the case here with CCP not honoring their agreeement i believe all the people who are entitled to receive their money rewards are in the right to press charges with the authorities to try and get their share.
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#65 - 2013-02-04 19:44:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Darth Gustav
raven666wings wrote:
Im sure that under either Icelandic or International laws it is illegal for any service providing company (be it entertainment or any other kind) to entice costumers into buying their product using a contest with unfullfilled rewards (scam). If this turns out to be the case here with CCP not honoring their agreeement i believe all the people who are entitled to receive their money rewards are in the right to press charges with the authorities to try and get their share.

Further, I think all the contestants who bid with PLEX to enter a fraudulent tournament would be entitled to their monies back, too. This has the potential to cost CCP a whole lot more than what they seem to be refusing to pay out in prize money.

That's why I'm so baffled that a multimillion dollar corporation would even appear to renege on such a skimpy amount of prize money. It just makes no sense when you look at the potential cost of this blunder.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#66 - 2013-02-04 19:56:27 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
Yeah any company that is in stable financial position will ever pull this out to their costumers/employees, by the novel they are making outta this one is lead to misjudge that they are also in bankruptcy like 0wn3d. I even went and topped their account with 10k

raven666wings wrote:
2013.02.04 14:36:37 Player Donation -10.000,00 ISK [r] raven666wings deposited cash into C C P's account


Wonder whats holding them back from paying up now
Demolishar
United Aggression
#67 - 2013-02-04 19:57:46 UTC
They should pay the reward using a percentage of the entry PLEX.
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#68 - 2013-02-04 20:03:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Darth Gustav
Demolishar wrote:
They should pay the reward using a percentage of the entry PLEX.

They already said in the Dev Blog about the New Eden Open that the entry PLEX were being used to rent production equipment and build a set.

Their business partner Own3d was to provide the prize money. For both companies, this was likely a loss leader.

So, again, too bad about CCP's business partner. Roll

But their obligation to their paying customers seems absolutely unambiguous.

Their apparent failure to meet that obligation just looks cheap and tacky. Straight

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#69 - 2013-02-04 20:39:29 UTC
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Tyrrax Thorrk wrote:
Not to be a **** to CCP or anything but it's pretty pathetic that prizes still haven't been paid out.

I'm guessing CCP will be eating the 10k own3d is reneging on, so good for you but really this should've been sorted months ago.


You may have missed the news article explaining that Own3d owes a lot of people money but the explanation is likely in the OP. Hope that helps.


No, I don't think it does.

It doesn't matter who is in the wrong. It's CCPs name at the top of the contest page and it's CCP who took the fees. It is CCP that will suffer if these prizes are not awarded.

Mr Epeen Cool
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#70 - 2013-02-04 20:44:33 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
LOL GO Mr Epeen :DDD

Mr Epeen - 1 CCP - 0
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#71 - 2013-02-04 21:18:31 UTC
Confess I didn't read that news article to the full extent but i'll try not to miss the one that's gonna state that CCP owes a lot of ppl money.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#72 - 2013-02-05 00:00:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Mara Rinn
An interesting thing about dissolving a business and paying out creditors is that the administrator needs to pursue debtors, then handle the creditors in order of priority. Sometimes it takes a while to settle debts, and sometimes creditors only get a partial payout (e.g.: 50 cents to the dollar).

It might be possible that CCP wants to wait for such a payout before digging into its own pockets for the prize funds (since one party of a joint project paying out the obligation to creditors might be construed as the debt obligation being met, I am no corporate lawyer but I have seen this happen).

Just hang in there, prize winners. Trust CCP to do the right thing by you, and post to let them know the you are trusting them to do the right thing, wish them lick with the settlement, etc. You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#73 - 2013-02-05 00:24:38 UTC
Mara Rinn wrote:
You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.


Sadly, corporate entities are more akin to Dung Beetles than flies. And you know what you need to catch them, don't you?

Mr Epeen Cool
Molinator Agnon
Oruze Cruise
#74 - 2013-02-05 01:08:26 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
Mara Rinn wrote:
You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.


Sadly, corporate entities are more akin to Dung Beetles than flies. And you know what you need to catch them, don't you?

Mr Epeen Cool

Logical fallacies?
Revajin
Doomheim
#75 - 2013-02-05 03:44:24 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
Mara Rinn wrote:
You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.


Sadly, corporate entities are more akin to Dung Beetles than flies. And you know what you need to catch them, don't you?

Mr Epeen Cool


I think you need to read up on Dung Beetles.
Nwimie Sklor
Ronin Cartel
GaNg BaNg TeAm
#76 - 2013-02-05 16:12:17 UTC
well its 9 days after CCP responded in this thread and still nothing. not evan a courteous eve mail to let players involved know whats happening. Infact ZERO contact with players since the tournament. I for one am VERY dissapointed in CCP's slow action and zero contact. I fully understand somethings cant happen over night , but to be kept upto date would atleast be polite.

tornament was great and fun but the after care for players appalling to say the least.

+1 slightly disgruntled eve player.
Teardrop Butterfly
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#77 - 2013-02-06 15:44:09 UTC
Gogela wrote:
[quote=BadAssMcKill]Then you get these **** degenerates like the CEO of OwnedTV. Contracts are only honored in-so-much as they can technically be enforced. If you don't have verification enforcement clauses with them on every little thing they will find a loophole and **** you on a contract. In this case, the CEO saw the ship was going down in July at the LATEST. That did not effect business as usual. They still created contracts... promised people their due payments... etc... However, it's my contention that the decision was made in July that OwnedTV would no longer honor their financial obligations. Instead, the pay is increased for the executives to drain every last drop of capital from the company. In the meantime, OwnedTV pions are oblivious and continuing to work thinking they have a job. Partners continue to fulfill their obligations and produce content or whatever for OwnedTV thinking they are going to be compensated. All that work and effort is put forth while OwnedTV promises it's a glitch in the payment system or some other nonsense, when OwnedTV's executives know damn well they aren't going to pay for it. In bankruptcy, those obligations are nullified as the company's few remaining assets are liquidated and only the preferred AAA shareholders (again, the executives only) are compensated. People holding non-preferred securities, creditors, employees, and partners are left holding the bag. It's a scam. ...and it's technically legal.


Whenever one of my clients is a business partner of a company like this I present a winding up petition against it, force it into compulsory liquidation and ensure that an insolvency practitioner I have a good relationship is appointed by the Official Receiver.

I then get the IP to make applications under sections 212 onwards of the Insolvency Act to make the directors (executives) personally liable for the debt for fraudulent or insolvent trading and have my client bankrupt them on principle afterwards in order to take their houses to pay off the debt from any available equity. I then sit back and wait to see how long they are disqualified from being a director for, and whether the IP/OR wishes to try and bring criminal sanctions against them involving custodial sentences.

...

Lol
I like explosions.
Pak Narhoo
Splinter Foundation
#78 - 2013-02-06 15:53:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Pak Narhoo
Mara Rinn wrote:
Just hang in there, prize winners. Trust CCP to do the right thing by you, and post to let them know the you are trusting them to do the right thing, wish them lick with the settlement, etc. You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.


Ugh Here we go again. 8 month's of bumping a thread to get the winners of a contest their prize.
(I'm referring to a reward some people won a fanfest or 2 ago which took CCP 8 month's, minus a week, to deliver.)

Edit: sad thing is that they're not to blame this time. They trusted the wrong guys. So typically.... EVE.
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#79 - 2013-02-06 16:02:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Jake Warbird
Pak Narhoo wrote:


Edit: sad thing is that they're not to blame this time. They trusted the wrong guys. So typically.... EVE. CCP

I think it's a decent fix,no?

e:Also,go Darth!

Sugar Von MurdererTits : Jake Warbird gets my vote for most intriguing and attractive male character in Eve.
CCP Dolan
C C P
C C P Alliance
#80 - 2013-02-06 16:12:17 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Dolan
An announcement has been made here regarding the prizes for the New Eden Open.

CCP Dolan | Community Representative

Twitter: @CCPDolan

Gooby pls