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POSes: I am a small portion of the community

First post First post
Author
GeoffWICE
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1741 - 2013-01-17 22:28:55 UTC
silens vesica wrote:
silens vesica wrote:
The very first thing I want done:


Corporate roles management update:
Make managing Corporate Roles not unlike managing an IT network.


  • Permissions to resources are set in categories: "Look at"; "Use"; "Configure"; "Reset"
  • Anything which can be done, any corporate action, and role, and resource (such as POS') has permsissions associated with it.
  • Permissions can be bundled into sets.
  • Sets can be assigned to Groups.
  • Groups can contain Players.



Forgot to mention:

  • Groups can be nested.


Seriouisly - just go talk to your IT folks - they'll be able to easily explain how it's done and the philosophy behind it. This alone would make the current incarnation of POS' very much easier to bear.


this!

as a network admin myself, this would be awsome.

just incase you cant be bothered asking you IT people here it is.

A G DL P

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AGDLP

converted to EVE speak.

corp members
corp groups/aliance groups
station/pos groups
permissions
Zel Hashred
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1742 - 2013-01-17 22:29:59 UTC
Pelea Ming wrote:
Considering I have personally known well over 100 corporations between null sec, wormholes, and yes, even high sec, that use poses, and have used them myself, I agree that something needs to be fixed! CCP does NOTHING but ***** about how wormholes aren't being properly populated and exploited, and the biggest[/] reason for this is the fact that POSes, as they now stand, require too much attention, research, effort, work, etc to [b]try to keep them relatively secure (compared to stations, or even the modular eggs) from corp thieves and all, and to have all that effort fail at a MUCH higher rate then the other to consistently FORCES this that CCP does want to change to NOT change.

CCP, get off your asses, and instead of complaining your player base isn't living up to your expectations, run your game as fits your player base!

make changes to POSes!



I like and agree with this one
Celly Smunt
Neutin Local LLC
#1743 - 2013-01-17 22:30:03 UTC
Silvonus wrote:
POS are some of the oldest code, and were never fully developed from the start. Most players understand this, we are not expecting miracles but we do want to see some concrete development happening. POS have been talked about for years as needing fixes, and while there are many areas of the game that also need improving, none is more glaring than POSs. The time is ripe for change.

The arm of POSs is far reaching, affecting nearly every area of the game in one form or another. This is what I feel CCP is worried about when potentially overhauling the entire system. POS affect nearly all of industry, life in null and w-space and corporation management. It is nearly impossible to separate POS from any of these (and more) systems. The risk that something would go wrong is high, even for the slightest of changes. Since the effects are wide, this also has the potential of being the most powerful fix/expansion ever especially if linked to systems like sovereignty, industry and CREST.

Here is what I see are the major areas of EVE that need to be developed:
  • POS and other player controlled structures
  • Industry, production and group mining (ring)
  • Nullsec sovereignty
  • Corporation management

  • Yes, there are more things, but those in my opinion are the largest ones bringing EVE into a “complete” state with no major areas lacking. Now, of those areas, industry is already tied significantly to POS, and while it does not need to be released at the same time as POS, having a new POS backbone to tie into would help it significantly. Nullsec sovereignty is a thorny path. It works currently but has a lot of room for improvement. A POS revamp has the potential not to just affect how we think of POS right now, that is a stick in the bubble, but rather extend onto other player owned and controlled structures, such as I-Hubs, stations, and whatever else we could imagine, which could be then tied into new sov mechanics and methods to maintain and control areas. Corporation mechanics are already so closely tied with POSs, that separating one form the other is hard to do and trying to fix one and not the other only prolongs the issue.

    CCP, you want to have themed expansions? How about this for a theme: “Build your empire.”

    Task half the teams to work on Corporation management and UI, and the other half to POSs. Nothing draws players into game more than being able to claim a piece of land (or in this case, space). Not just something that has your name on it in the corner, but something that you as a player build. You gathered the resources, you teamed up with other players, you fought off those who would compete with you and you prevailed. And these aren't just vanity homes to display pictures, these are the workhorses and the backbone of your military might, your production chain to control the market, the bastion where you live.

    CCP, we know you can pull this off. You pulled off a beautiful interface with planetary interaction in Tyrannis, you've delivered content in Apocrypha on an unprecedented scale, you've paid attention to the details in Crucible and Inferno, you've shown us that you can make a game like none other. The path to greatness isn't easy, but only those who dare the most difficult road reap the greatest rewards.


    dammit... that's a GOOD post

    Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator.

    Andski
    Science and Trade Institute
    Caldari State
    #1744 - 2013-01-17 22:30:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
    In two short years playing this game, I've done more with POS than I care to speak about. I've set up staging POS, tech mining POS, deathstars and dickstars, etc and the only thing I haven't done is set up a reaction farm, because it makes me want to gouge my eyes out. Believe me when I say that I don't do it out of enjoyment, because it isn't enjoyable, but simply because somebody needs to do it. Having to pan the camera around to move green boxes into place is miserable and that needs improvement. I can tolerate the two 30 minute timers for putting up a large tower, since I can just set a stopwatch, but having to place each little green box for each gun in place, fly up to each group of guns to shove ammo into them (hope you're using lasers with T1 crystals) prior to onlining is a bit ridiculous. You're talking about spending 2-3 hours on a single large tower setup.

    And then there's the fact that POS guns don't pose a threat of any sort to supercaps, a few of which will defang a full deathstar POS in minutes. Then comes more fun: bringing in carriers WITH UNBONUSED HULL REPS to fix everything up and having to online everything once again.

    Twitter: @EVEAndski

    "It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

    The Zerg Overmind
    Rule Reversal
    #1745 - 2013-01-17 22:31:21 UTC
    +1 for module POSes
    Akyla Dey
    Sebiestor Tribe
    Minmatar Republic
    #1746 - 2013-01-17 22:32:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Akyla Dey
    87 pages right now...

    CCP, have you noticed that no one's in here saying "you know what, I think it's fine", or "I'd rather you work on something else instead"? Even with the Unified Inventory debacle there were proponents of it from the player base. Most every major issue that's come up in this game has had people on both sides. This one does not. There may be people that don't care or that it doesn't affect, but everyone who uses POSs, even tangentially or on a limited basis is in favor of this. Please take note.
    Hedion's oracle
    Naari LLC
    #1747 - 2013-01-17 22:33:19 UTC
    The POS's ,fix them Evil

    Error: Working As intended

    mynnna
    State War Academy
    Caldari State
    #1748 - 2013-01-17 22:35:38 UTC
    Andski wrote:
    In two short years playing this game, I've done more with POS than I care to speak about. I've set up staging POS, tech mining POS, deathstars and dickstars, etc and the only thing I haven't done is set up a reaction farm, because it makes me want to gouge my eyes out. Believe me when I say that I don't do it out of enjoyment, because it isn't enjoyable, but simply because somebody needs to do it. Having to pan the camera around to move green boxes into place is miserable and that needs improvement. I can tolerate the two 30 minute timers for putting up a large tower, since I can just set a stopwatch, but having to place each little green box for each gun in place, fly up to each group of guns to shove ammo into them (hope you're using lasers with T1 crystals) prior to onlining is a bit ridiculous. You're talking about spending 2-3 hours on a single large tower setup.

    And then there's the fact that POS guns don't pose a threat of any sort to supercaps, a few of which will defang a full deathstar POS in minutes. Then comes more fun: bringing in carriers WITH UNBONUSED HULL REPS to fix everything up and having to online everything once again.


    This man? He's one of those enablers a POS revamp would help, and by helping him, help the rest of us.

    Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal

    IrJosy
    Club 1621
    #1749 - 2013-01-17 22:37:37 UTC
    Akyla Dey wrote:
    87 pages right now...

    CCP, have you noticed that no one's in here saying "you know what, I think it's fine", or "I'd rather you work on something else instead"? Even with the Unified Inventory debacle, there were proponents of it from the player base. Most every major issue that's come up in this game has had people on both side. This one does not. There may be people that don't care or that it doesn't affect, but everyone who uses POSs, even tangentially or on a limited basis is in favor of this. Please take note.


    This affects EVERYONE. Every Null sec player has used a PoS for staging. EVERY wormholer has used a PoS to live out of. (almost) Every tech 2 module/ship is invented in a PoS. Every player has purchased a ship/module created from a BPO/C that was more than likely researched in a PoS. PoS are used and have a HUGE affect on just about every aspect of the game.
    David Matsuda
    School of Applied Knowledge
    Caldari State
    #1750 - 2013-01-17 22:38:19 UTC
    POSes directly or indirectly affect so many player groups and aspects of life in New Eden it's hard to think of anyone who wouldn't benefit immensely from a complete overhaul. I completely agree with the majority of posters in this thread - start with the low hanging fruit, work on it in the background, iterate and introduce new features as gradually as you must, but please do it. There's enough material in there for a full themed expansion, and it would be one of the better ones at that.

    I have read this forum every day for two years now, and this is seriously the first issue important enough to post for.
    Gogela
    Epic Ganking Time
    CODE.
    #1751 - 2013-01-17 22:38:44 UTC
    Adding a few notes about why POS numbers might look like they do and why it's a bad idea to judge based on that:

    1) POS's are a corp level asset. ...so I can't just set up a POS of my own accord if I'm in another corp. By design, there will be far fewer people interfacing with POS's in the logs... however everyone in the corp benefits in some way from a corp POS.

    2) POS's are a pain in the a** to set up and maintain. Now, the IDEA of a POS is awesome! I still remember first going into nullsec being guided by the hand by a snigg vet and led to their little pirate gate camper POS waypoint. "This is a safe-safe spot." bookmark it." So we have our own secret base in a system with no stations?! That's awesome! Now that I know how to set them up, I know I don't want to bother with it. Too much hassle and too much risk of being killed by my own creation. This turns off a lot of would-be POS owners.

    3) The differences between "my" POS and "A" POS are negligible.

    4) Need sov to anchor.

    There are a lot of would-be POS owners out there that haven't set one up simply because of the above issues. Fix even a few things and you'll see the number of POS owners rise. Everyone wants their own station... they just don't want a busted up buggy time-sink. See "small holding".

    Signatures should be used responsibly...

    Mochodan Jawbone
    Pator Tech School
    Minmatar Republic
    #1752 - 2013-01-17 22:40:31 UTC
    M-POS + 1
    Tanzor
    Caldari Provisions
    Caldari State
    #1753 - 2013-01-17 22:41:46 UTC
    Adding my name to the petition to fix PoS's

    Lots of good idea here on how to improve them and make them more manageable.

    +1 for the security fixes. We've all heard the stories of people cleaning out PoS's based on the poor implementation of roles and such.

    IMHO a small amount of work by CCP could reap big rewards.

    Dear CCP: Don't disregard this issue because you believe it only affects a "small minority". Think of it as a chance to improve something that would make it worthwhile enough that the "majority" will begin to use it and sing your praises for addressing.
    Heimdallofasgard
    Ministry of Furious Retribution
    Fraternity.
    #1754 - 2013-01-17 22:43:49 UTC
    OI!

    Capsuleers!

    What do you think this is? GD?!
    The Djentleman Paulson
    Dreddit
    Test Alliance Please Ignore
    #1755 - 2013-01-17 22:44:40 UTC
    please fix poses they are obnoxious
    Celly Smunt
    Neutin Local LLC
    #1756 - 2013-01-17 22:46:36 UTC
    Ion Breeze wrote:
    Art issues? Why not just canabalize the current POS structures and the ones in DED complexs and the like...

    I imagine people would not flip out over the "new" pos system if it still used the same old art assets for a single expansion cycle... as long as the functionality changes for the better...




    Why not add some immersion and backstory into it by allowing some explorer to locate an older structure that has (insert component here) still attached to it that while damaged, could be made functional again for use with the new POS system?
    reverse engineered or something
    or even just a forgotten vault that contained a modular station component BPO or BPC, you know, something to get explorers into it too.
    special data cores or schematics that allow a POS platform to be built with a fluidic type interconnect mechanism so that modules can be placed in different locations without some type of wiring nightmare to get the lights on in the thing.

    someone mentioned exploring into Jovian space recently in an unrelated thread, so what would be wrong with someone (not a single person of course cause that would be daft) actually managing to make it to Jove space and unlocking the secrets of their stations?
    bringing back a small piece of tech that revolutionizes the way our POSes are today?, something that makes us able to live in our own place in space.

    if not a someone?, how about a corp?, an NPC corp makes a wonderful breakthrough, ect ect and is willing to share the tech with all of EVE.
    There are almost no boundaries or limits to where that storyline could lead and to the effect it would have or "could" have on all aspects of life in New Eden.


    Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator.

    Doc Fury
    Furious Enterprises
    #1757 - 2013-01-17 22:46:37 UTC
    It's as if... they don't play...their own...GAME!


    /you will read this in Shatner's voice







    There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.

    Lord Zim
    Gallente Federation
    #1758 - 2013-01-17 22:47:17 UTC
    Andski wrote:
    In two short years playing this game, I've done more with POS than I care to speak about. I've set up staging POS, tech mining POS, deathstars and dickstars, etc and the only thing I haven't done is set up a reaction farm, because it makes me want to gouge my eyes out.

    I keep thinking of setting up a reaction farm, and I keep having flashbacks from the last time I set some up, and I just end up wanting to biomass my character instead, it's that bad.

    Kind of the same goes for the PI interface, but that's another issue for another 100+ page thread when CCP manages to go "it only affects a small portion of the playerbase".Roll

    Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

    RIP Vile Rat

    Kenneth Skybound
    Gallifrey Resources
    #1759 - 2013-01-17 22:49:30 UTC
    Yes! A thousand times YES!

    Poses have so many issues. Security. Usage rights. Tedium in installation. Storage. Click Fests.

    Poses need improving. They are our homes - who'd choose to live in a broken home where the toilet only flushes when there's a prime number of plug sockets turned on? That's what it's like!
    Relgast
    Losi Laboratories
    #1760 - 2013-01-17 22:50:38 UTC
    WH life and POS's are my most important aspects of eve. I have been sticking around mainly to see POS's revamped. Please ccp, dont let us down!