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[Retribution 1.1] Combat Battlecruisers

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Extraterra
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1261 - 2013-01-16 16:07:48 UTC
Zagdul wrote:
Brutix:
Battlecruiser skill bonuses:
5% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret damage
7.5% Hybrid Turret Optimal Range (or tracking)
Fixed Bonus:
99% reduction in the CPU need of Warfare Link modules
Slot layout: 7 H, 5 M (+1), 5 L, 7 turrets
Fittings: 1200 PWG (+50), 435 CPU (+10)
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 4000 / 4000 / 5000(+117)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / average cap per second): 3000(+656.25) / 789s(+164s) / 3.8 (+0.05)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 155 / 0.704(+0.0352) / 12250000 (-1,000,000) / 8.1s (-0.2)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 50 / 50
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 55km / 200 / 7
Sensor strength: 18 Magnetometric
Signature radius: 305 (+5)
Cargo capacity: 475 (+75)


I agree with this ... Better then a useless armor rep bonus
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#1262 - 2013-01-16 16:09:45 UTC
Extraterra wrote:
Zagdul wrote:
Brutix:
Battlecruiser skill bonuses:
5% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret damage
7.5% Hybrid Turret Optimal Range (or tracking)
Fixed Bonus:
99% reduction in the CPU need of Warfare Link modules
Slot layout: 7 H, 5 M (+1), 5 L, 7 turrets
Fittings: 1200 PWG (+50), 435 CPU (+10)
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 4000 / 4000 / 5000(+117)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / average cap per second): 3000(+656.25) / 789s(+164s) / 3.8 (+0.05)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 155 / 0.704(+0.0352) / 12250000 (-1,000,000) / 8.1s (-0.2)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 50 / 50
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 55km / 200 / 7
Sensor strength: 18 Magnetometric
Signature radius: 305 (+5)
Cargo capacity: 475 (+75)


I agree with this ... Better then a useless armor rep bonus


Stop trying to make it a ******** shield blaster kiter.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Extraterra
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1263 - 2013-01-16 16:17:22 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Extraterra wrote:
Zagdul wrote:
Brutix:
Battlecruiser skill bonuses:
5% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret damage
7.5% Hybrid Turret Optimal Range (or tracking)
Fixed Bonus:
99% reduction in the CPU need of Warfare Link modules
Slot layout: 7 H, 5 M (+1), 5 L, 7 turrets
Fittings: 1200 PWG (+50), 435 CPU (+10)
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 4000 / 4000 / 5000(+117)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / average cap per second): 3000(+656.25) / 789s(+164s) / 3.8 (+0.05)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 155 / 0.704(+0.0352) / 12250000 (-1,000,000) / 8.1s (-0.2)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 50 / 50
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 55km / 200 / 7
Sensor strength: 18 Magnetometric
Signature radius: 305 (+5)
Cargo capacity: 475 (+75)


I agree with this ... Better then a useless armor rep bonus


Stop trying to make it a ******** shield blaster kiter.


Ok switch the extra Med Slot to Low Slots ... but no Armor Rep Bonus Please :) .. its bull****
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#1264 - 2013-01-16 16:19:01 UTC
Tier 3 BC are getting a general mobility nerf. That has been hinted at for a while.
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#1265 - 2013-01-16 16:40:40 UTC
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Tier 3 BC are getting a general mobility nerf. That has been hinted at for a while.


how about dropping them down from highest tier weapons and giving them ~attack cruiser capacitor
Extraterra
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1266 - 2013-01-16 18:05:36 UTC
Sinigr Shadowsong wrote:
IMO 2 Gallente Combat BC sharing same obsolete armor repair bonus is bad idea. Brutix would make great ship if it have another bonus. Giving it armor resists would make it to "Amarrish". What do you think of following second bonuses?

1) Increase maximum armor amount by X% per level (Pretty much like current armor T3 defensive bonuses).
2) Reduce penalty from armor modules and rigs by X% per level.
3) Mobility bonus (MWD Capacitor cost, AB duration cycle, MWD speed bonus etc).
4) Tackling bonus. It would be handful to have something like "Increase the range of Warp Disruptors and Warp Scramblers by X% per level" since brutix is slow armor ship with extremely close-range weapons so it might help to get in melee.
5) Drone damage bonus so it will be all-gank ship.

Now to Ferox. Medium-size turret sniping just doesn't work. The fact that player fit 250mm on Ferox might be caused by that Ferox is actually a "Noob Trap". New player see nice-looking ship, read description and bonuses and decide that it will work as sniping ship. Actually, what targets would you expect to be shot by medium rails?



+1 for 1) Increase maximum armor amount by X% per level (Pretty much like current armor T3 defensive bonuses)
+1 for 4) Tackling bonus. It would be handful to have something like "Increase the range of Warp Disruptors and Warp Scramblers by X% per level" since brutix is slow armor ship with extremely close-range weapons so it might help to get in melee.
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#1267 - 2013-01-16 18:43:54 UTC
Hakan MacTrew wrote:
When did this thread change to being about drones and not the changes to tube BC lines?
There are plenty of Drone threads already.

Also, it probably got missed a couple of pages ago, but I suggested dropping the resist bonus on the Drake in favour of a missile.velocity bonus, like the other caldari missile boats.

Does anyone have opinions in that, for or against?


A rof bonus and a bonus to missile velocity would be excellent on the drake. Passive tanking is fine for this one. It makes sense that the ships that are designed for closer range combat and brawling have the bonus to resists making the progression for rail pilots obvious.

Merlin --> Moa --.> Ferox --> Rokh. (Hybrid weapon system - resist bonus for closer range work)

Kestrel --> Caracal --> -Drake --> Raven (should all have a rof bonus and a velocity bonus for missiles - shield systems not so important as range and kiting should be a large part of the tank).

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Seleucus Ontuas
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1268 - 2013-01-16 18:59:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Seleucus Ontuas
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey everyone. I'm working on the next version of the BC changes now, but in the meantime two quick things to update.

Since we've announced it in CCP Seagull's Devblog, I can let you all know that the Combat BC balance pass is scheduled for the Retribution 1.1 patch on February 12th.

To reiterate, the skill split will not be happening in this patch. That change is currently scheduled for our major summer expansion.

We're also in the process of putting these changes on a public test server for you guys to play with them. Expect more news on that in the next day or so. There will definitely be changes between this posted design and what releases in 1.1, but for now the test server will have the same versions as this thread's OP. When we update the designs we'll get those onto the test server as well asap.


Well, that's actually faster than I was expecting for the BCs, will the Attack BCs also be going out with this patch? Also, any news on TDs, TCs and TEs affecting missiles?

With that said, please, do not give us two Gallente BCs with a self-rep Bonus. Just keep the self-rep bonus on the Brutix and give the Myrmidon a 5% Hybrid Turret bonus along with the 10% bonus to Drones. And if want people to use 250mm Rails on the Ferox, you need to give it more PG.
Nat Howe
Ball Punching Ninja Midgets
Cynosural Field Theory.
#1269 - 2013-01-16 19:10:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Nat Howe
Quote:

also IMO give the myrm a ful 125m3 drone bandwith :( its soooo niche as it is. It's too slow even nano'd, its range sucks with autos or blasters, and its only good as uber buffer or double/tripple tanked brawler. so not versatile.




Giving the Myrmidon 125mbit of bandwidth would make 2 ships useless:

Ishtar and Dominix.[/quote]


Not really... The myrm isn't going to tank or have the highslot versatility of the domi, and it wont sig tank like an Ahac.

Really its an achieved median between the two, seeing as its still slow and the ishtar isnt'. its relatively large sig for a BC sized tank whereas the domi is a beast.

Also should add, its really really SP heavy to fly a myrm @ skill. You gotta haz the armor skills, the drone skills, the gunnery skills, and all the supplementals.

a drake for example just requires shield and missile
a Cane just requires guns and armor/shield (navi helps if the later)
and the harby just really needs some armor and gunnery laz's.

its by far the most SP dependent of any T2 BC, it should reflect that. not be left on the way side barely flown and relatively fleet useless. I dun know any corp in blackrise that really flys them consistently or counts them as an integral part of any fleet comp.
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#1270 - 2013-01-16 19:13:03 UTC
Seleucus Ontuas wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey everyone. I'm working on the next version of the BC changes now, but in the meantime two quick things to update.

Since we've announced it in CCP Seagull's Devblog, I can let you all know that the Combat BC balance pass is scheduled for the Retribution 1.1 patch on February 12th.

To reiterate, the skill split will not be happening in this patch. That change is currently scheduled for our major summer expansion.

We're also in the process of putting these changes on a public test server for you guys to play with them. Expect more news on that in the next day or so. There will definitely be changes between this posted design and what releases in 1.1, but for now the test server will have the same versions as this thread's OP. When we update the designs we'll get those onto the test server as well asap.


Well, that's actually faster than I was expecting for the BCs, will the Attack BCs also be going out with this patch? Also, any news on TDs, TCs and TEs affecting missiles?

With that said, please, do not give us two Gallente BCs with a self-rep Bonus. Just keep the self-rep bonus on the Brutix and give the Myrmidon a 5% Hybrid Turret bonus along with the 10% bonus to Drones. And if want people to use 250mm Rails on the Ferox, you need to give it more PG.


For the sake of balance it would have to be a 5% bonus to drones to go alongside a 5% bonus to hybrids.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#1271 - 2013-01-16 19:23:48 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Tier 3 BC are getting a general mobility nerf. That has been hinted at for a while.


how about dropping them down from highest tier weapons and giving them ~attack cruiser capacitor


Confirming that a paper tiger with no tiger is worth flying.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#1272 - 2013-01-16 19:30:35 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Tier 3 BC are getting a general mobility nerf. That has been hinted at for a while.


how about dropping them down from highest tier weapons and giving them ~attack cruiser capacitor


I'm a bit confused by this, you want to remove the option of battleship sized weapons from the T3 BC's and cut their cap!

What would be the point of owning/flying them.



Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1273 - 2013-01-16 19:38:02 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Stop trying to make it a ******** shield blaster kiter.


In case you haven't noticed yet it's what this ship is now if you want to keep "mobility" and deliver some dps before you miserably die kitted by everything able to run guns/mwd for 2min.
Gank mining barges and freighters it's mostly at what this ship is good for, NICE !! -meaning that crap rep bonus is already an unused bonus so, let me ask you please, stop asking CCP to make this ******* ship the bullshit it is because of some nerds infantile trauma.

With 5mids 5 lows, and if it keeps that awful active armor rep you can choose mobility dps AND tackle at cost of tank (shield) or armor graveyard fits (5 lows it's enough) and fill your mids with webs scrams painters mwd or whatever crap.

Of course we have no clue about active tanking changes but it's not news flash CCP neither, and as far as I'm concerned I'm not convinced at all this tanking mode will ever be viable enough for anything else than graveyard camps, specially using overheat mechanics.


removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#1274 - 2013-01-16 19:45:54 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Tier 3 BC are getting a general mobility nerf. That has been hinted at for a while.


how about dropping them down from highest tier weapons and giving them ~attack cruiser capacitor


Confirming that a paper tiger with no tiger is worth flying.

-Liang



Just saying maybe they should have to work with some fitting constraints, rather than being able to fit the largest tier of whatever. Also I'd be fine if everyone stopped flying them, they're pretty horrible.
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#1275 - 2013-01-16 19:58:19 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Liang Nuren wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Tier 3 BC are getting a general mobility nerf. That has been hinted at for a while.


how about dropping them down from highest tier weapons and giving them ~attack cruiser capacitor


Confirming that a paper tiger with no tiger is worth flying.

-Liang



Just saying maybe they should have to work with some fitting constraints, rather than being able to fit the largest tier of whatever. Also I'd be fine if everyone stopped flying them, they're pretty horrible.


They have a great many constraints already - ranging from fitting to being very fragile to being very weak to smaller ships. Honestly, if you think they're pretty horrible why aren't you campaigning for a boost? Oh right - it isn't exactly how you want everyone else to play the game.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#1276 - 2013-01-16 20:05:31 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Liang Nuren wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Tier 3 BC are getting a general mobility nerf. That has been hinted at for a while.


how about dropping them down from highest tier weapons and giving them ~attack cruiser capacitor


Confirming that a paper tiger with no tiger is worth flying.

-Liang



Just saying maybe they should have to work with some fitting constraints, rather than being able to fit the largest tier of whatever. Also I'd be fine if everyone stopped flying them, they're pretty horrible.


They have a great many constraints already - ranging from fitting to being very fragile to being very weak to smaller ships. Honestly, if you think they're pretty horrible why aren't you campaigning for a boost? Oh right - it isn't exactly how you want everyone else to play the game.

-Liang



wgat. I think they're way overpowered, and that even if you nerf them a little bit down from their ridiculous current state, having a cruiser with 8 bonused battleship guns might always end up being overpowered. delete tbh.
androch
LitlCorp
#1277 - 2013-01-16 20:19:11 UTC
why do the battlecruisers need changes? they are fine the way they are, and last patch you guys already nerfed the hurricanes powergrid, now youre going to further bastardize it? are you trying to force me to unsub?
I'm Down
Macabre Votum
Northern Coalition.
#1278 - 2013-01-16 20:25:41 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey everyone. I'm working on the next version of the BC changes now, but in the meantime two quick things to update.

Since we've announced it in CCP Seagull's Devblog, I can let you all know that the Combat BC balance pass is scheduled for the Retribution 1.1 patch on February 12th.

To reiterate, the skill split will not be happening in this patch. That change is currently scheduled for our major summer expansion.

We're also in the process of putting these changes on a public test server for you guys to play with them. Expect more news on that in the next day or so. There will definitely be changes between this posted design and what releases in 1.1, but for now the test server will have the same versions as this thread's OP. When we update the designs we'll get those onto the test server as well asap.



You still haven't addressed the problems that the skill changes will make to cloning, clone cost, upgrades and the possible skill losses from players who die after the changes with out dated clones thanks to the potential 6 million addtional skill points.
Hakan MacTrew
Konrakas Forged
Solyaris Chtonium
#1279 - 2013-01-16 20:26:35 UTC
androch wrote:
why do the battlecruisers need changes? they are fine the way they are, and last patch you guys already nerfed the hurricanes powergrid, now youre going to further bastardize it? are you trying to force me to unsub?

YEAH! Their so fine, only a few get used because they are more equal than the others... We don't want tiericide to make these abandoned hulls useful...

PS: I can has your stuff?

Friends
Hakan MacTrew
Konrakas Forged
Solyaris Chtonium
#1280 - 2013-01-16 20:27:58 UTC
I'm Down wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey everyone. I'm working on the next version of the BC changes now, but in the meantime two quick things to update.

Since we've announced it in CCP Seagull's Devblog, I can let you all know that the Combat BC balance pass is scheduled for the Retribution 1.1 patch on February 12th.

To reiterate, the skill split will not be happening in this patch. That change is currently scheduled for our major summer expansion.

We're also in the process of putting these changes on a public test server for you guys to play with them. Expect more news on that in the next day or so. There will definitely be changes between this posted design and what releases in 1.1, but for now the test server will have the same versions as this thread's OP. When we update the designs we'll get those onto the test server as well asap.



You still haven't addressed the problems that the skill changes will make to cloning, clone cost, upgrades and the possible skill losses from players who die after the changes with out dated clones thanks to the potential 6 million addtional skill points.

What, 6 months of warning isn't enough for people to go and update their clone?

Friends