Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Harbinger is buffed. Yeah it has -25 cpu but one turret takes 26.3 with max skills so its actually a little buff. Drone bay increase is actually a big deal, and small capacitor recharge nerf is more than compensated with 1 less turret, same as cpu. And it also does more damage then before, 5% more dps per BC level is 25% damage boost, 1 turret less from 7 is 14,2% nerf so in total its over 10% damage buff for Harbinger. The 2% increase in mass is really not a big deal and with shield tank EHP lost is really not that bad, its less than 1.5k with great skills and some low implants. Harbinger shield tanked is 200ms slower than Cane and since its mass is "nerfed" less that difference is gonna be a little smaller now. Dont complain its slow if you put 2x1600 plates on it. And you can shield tank it, it has the same slot layout as Hurricane and even has more EHP. It also has a great damage projection. 10% damage boost is huge, and the nerfs are pathetic. Actually the 1.3 cpu "buff" may actually help some fits to use 2% implant instead of 3%.

Hurricane cookie cutter AC fit is still the same as before you only lose one neut. That is definitely a nerf, but really not a big one. As with the Harbinger the mass hit is not that a big deal, and it actually has a little bigger EHP buffer even when shield tanked (less than 1k even with max skills). The arty cane got fked but that was before this and it was deserved, so really AC fit Hurricanes are pretty much the same.

Caldari i dont fly so i wont comment, but i actually like repair amount boost on Gallente, especially with a cap boost their BC got. They are great solo/small gank ships. As for "still dual weapon system on cyclone CCP fail" no one forces you to put guns in those spare slots, put something else in it. You have an option to squeeze a little more dps with guns if you want, its not like you have to fill your lows with gyrostabilizers.

Either your race has too few options and you're being restricted to a single role, or you have too many options and it takes too long to be good at them all. You can't have it all buddy.

Besides, if you look at BSs and T2 ships, every race needs drones, missiles and their racial turret skills at some point or other; the Eris and Lachesis have missile bonuses after all.

Well, not loving the shield nerf, but I suppose anyone who flies one will say the same:)

One suggestion though, how about reducing it to 6 launchers but giving it a +10% per level damage boost, with associated fitting changes of course. Much the same as you did the Harbinger.

This would be a dps nerf to anyone with lvl 1-3 in BC. DPS at BC 4 is exactly the same, and it is a small (about 3%) boost at BC5.

That would allow a utility high slot for practical use. Letting a ship often used for PvE have space for a tractor beam is insanely convenient, or a Scan Probe launcher when using one in a wormhole!! Not to mention making a gang link more viable in a ship with a bonus to them.

Just leave them the way they are? Is that too difficult? We have trained into where we want to be. I trained into a hurricane, now that ship is useless. The only viable alternative for a Minmatar pilot in a BC class vessel is the Cyclone. The shift from Hurricane to Cyclone is as dramatic as jumping from Amarr to Caldari. If any other race wants to switch to the other BC in their race it is not as dramatic.

Cyclone - Shield, Missiles (drones)
Hurricane - Armor, Guns

All I'm asking is don't force us to try and do both by making one complete crap, AND making both ships complete opposites.

Neither one are going to be complete crap.

-Liang

You should just train shield tanking....

See how that sucks?

In other words, this guy isn't pro enough to being flying Minmatar. Get good at all weapons or GTFO of my superior race.

so a ship that already has to give up dps lows to fit a gang link now also has to drop turrets/launchers...

are you serious?

as it is now, the only real on grid boosting BC would be the drake... doing 200dps.

if CCP, wants people to stop using alts to off grid boost, they need to let on grid boosting be a matter of fitting the damn thing and turning it on... the way i see it, links shouldn't even cost cap to use. if they screw up on grid boosting from the get go like this, why would anyone "play" an on-grid booster? crap dps, no point, no mobility... all you do is warp in with the fleet and hope no one notices you are firing light missiles at drones, instead of HMs or HAMs.

due to cpu limitation on the drake its already hard to fit a link, along with the extra tank you will need because you will be primary. so to top it off, not only we lose dps, we even lose PG and CPU...

great.

and the rest of the gang also loses the utility highs for RR... which we NEED.

honestly if this changes go live with the removal the ling highs, this is the worst rebalancing ever. they want to nerf the drake, remove the 5% resist per lvl, remove the drone bay, those things wont affect the ship as much as loosing the high.

and yeah maybe there's 2 people out there who fit neuts in that high, but they re giving up a lot of tank to do it. not to mention the damn thing better be a med neut or noone will notice it, which makes a cap booster in the mids almost mandatory. if a few players want to fly a drake like that let them.


and this is pvp side only, on pve the drake was a very cool gang ship to slowly do WHs and lvl 4s with a small fleet of noobs with meta mods... with no utility high spider drakes and all their teaching potential is gone... am i supposed to ask a new player to train all the way up to a tengu to be of any use? oh wait he should train a logistics and spend the entire time a primary....

right.

Many gallente pilots train both.

I don't quite get the restriction on the drake for kinetic missiles. It's not like any other race has limits such as only tungsten bonus or only multifrequency etc.

Just trying to understand the reasoning.