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What Launchers?

Author
Niddengolliah
Limit Everyone Nowhere Kingdom
#1 - 2012-12-18 01:10:03 UTC
I am completely new to missile launchers. The most I've ever used them was on a Kestrel to do some missions.
But I really want to get more into them, as my future goal in EvE is a stealth bomber, I love how they look and I love playing glass cannons in most games!

But, of course, I need practice with the missiles to begin with and I am thinking of doing some missions to see how much range and damage I can pull against different targets. But I'd really like to narrow down my options a bit, as trying EVERYTHING would require an awfully long wait time in a station training the skills!

I have already narrowed down the three systems that could possibly work on a Caracal - the testing ship of my choice:
1. Rapid LMLs - I probably have the most experience with Light Missiles, but playing with them in EFT doesn't seem to provide good DPS, and their only advantage is easy fitting.
2. HAMs - my corpies say that these have very lame range and you need to keep moving to get in range and begin hitting things. They do seem to provide nice DPS though.
3. HMLs - I really like the idea of very long range missile platforms, but I heard that these got nerfed a fair bit, so they aren't nearly as awesome any more.

The big question I have here is which of these is best at dealing with Frigate - Cruiser sized ships? I have no idea how the explosion velocity/size affects the damage projection, and all I know is that Light Missiles are great at killing frigates and seem to kill destroyers just as easily.


Remember, I am just trying to learn here, so no need for profanities, I know that I am a n00b :D.



For now... >:D
Cephelange du'Krevviq
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#2 - 2012-12-18 01:29:13 UTC
Light missiles (whether from Light or Rapid Light launchers) are the best for engaging frigate sized targets and applying damage.

HMLs used to be a decent all-around choice for engaging both frigates and cruisers, since HAMs did not used to benefit from the support skills that helped them apply more damage to small, speedy targets.

HMLs have lost some overall flight time, but are still decent for kiting.

HAMs are better due to two things: they are now affected by all of the support skills (same as HMLs were/are), and the fitting requirements have been reduced.

With the cruiser "tiercide" that came about with Retribution, a Caracal is a very viable hull now. It has 4 low slots, which help you put in more damage mods, or others as needed. It can also fit a full rack of HAM launchers.

This article may help a bit, but keep in mind it is outdated, since Guided Missile Precision now benefits missiles it didn't before. This explains it a bit better, especially the section under "Calculating missile damage."

Hopefully this helps; don't hesitate to ask for clarification.

"I am a leaf on the...ah, frak it!"

Caitlyn Tufy
Perkone
Caldari State
#3 - 2012-12-18 09:38:45 UTC
Niddengolliah wrote:
1. Rapid LMLs - I probably have the most experience with Light Missiles, but playing with them in EFT doesn't seem to provide good DPS, and their only advantage is easy fitting.


I'll stop you here. One this that's drastically different between missiles and guns is that angular velocity doesn't matter at all. If the target is in range and can't run out of missile range in time, the missile will hit 100% of the time. This means that if a frigate is close to the Battleship and the battleship fires a torpedo, the torpedo will ALWAYS hit. However, missiles have two extra stats that define how much damage they'll do: explosion radius and explosion velocity. Basically, the larger the radius of explosion and the slower the explosion velocity, the less damage they'll apply to small targets. This means that a torpedo with its extreme explosion radius will only apply full damage to battleships, whereas it will apply a small fraction of it to a frigate.

If you compare rockets/light missiles to heavy/heavy assault ones, you'll notice they have a much smaller explosion radius and much faster explosion velocity. This means they're exceptionally strong against small targets (drones and frigates), while lacking the sheer firepower of the heavier missiles. In turn, the heavier missiles hit harder on larger targets (cruisers, for instance), but lack the explosion radius and velocity to hit frigates or drones with full power.

If we apply that to our cruiser: a rapid missile launcher Caracal will be an anti-frigate hunter, that will have less potential dps, but will deal it much more consistently, while the heavy missile or the heavy assault missile Caracal will be an anti-cruiser platform, ment to hit the targets of its own size at the expense of being weaker against frigates or drones.
Xuse Senna
Nocturnal Romance
Cynosural Field Theory.
#4 - 2012-12-18 10:08:50 UTC
Snowball Launchers ;)

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/7501/mindgamesceptionfinaldr.jpg

Rancor Kane
Geuzen Inc
#5 - 2012-12-18 10:55:28 UTC
Caitlyn Tufy wrote:
Niddengolliah wrote:
1. Rapid LMLs - I probably have the most experience with Light Missiles, but playing with them in EFT doesn't seem to provide good DPS, and their only advantage is easy fitting.


I'll stop you here. One this that's drastically different between missiles and guns is that angular velocity doesn't matter at all. If the target is in range and can't run out of missile range in time, the missile will hit 100% of the time. This means that if a frigate is close to the Battleship and the battleship fires a torpedo, the torpedo will ALWAYS hit. However, missiles have two extra stats that define how much damage they'll do: explosion radius and explosion velocity. Basically, the larger the radius of explosion and the slower the explosion velocity, the less damage they'll apply to small targets. This means that a torpedo with its extreme explosion radius will only apply full damage to battleships, whereas it will apply a small fraction of it to a frigate.

If you compare rockets/light missiles to heavy/heavy assault ones, you'll notice they have a much smaller explosion radius and much faster explosion velocity. This means they're exceptionally strong against small targets (drones and frigates), while lacking the sheer firepower of the heavier missiles. In turn, the heavier missiles hit harder on larger targets (cruisers, for instance), but lack the explosion radius and velocity to hit frigates or drones with full power.

If we apply that to our cruiser: a rapid missile launcher Caracal will be an anti-frigate hunter, that will have less potential dps, but will deal it much more consistently, while the heavy missile or the heavy assault missile Caracal will be an anti-cruiser platform, ment to hit the targets of its own size at the expense of being weaker against frigates or drones.


This:

though with the propper skills (which you'll need anyway if you want to become a crack SB pilot) you can hurt any frigate that isn't able to outrun you with HAM's for deacent damage.

TP's and webs are your friends.

Akuma Tsukai
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#6 - 2012-12-18 11:59:26 UTC
With at least 1 TP fitted you wont have to worry about what size of missiles you shoot at whom. At all. I kill spider drones and rogue drones interceptors with my raven Lol Yep, thats shooting a 5m ship with a 10m missile i presume Shocked
Long story short unlike guns, missiles care only about speed (the slower you target - the better) and sig radius (bigger - better).
Also i would like to point out that missiles scale much more with supporting skills than their guns counterpart.
Aptenodytes
Reckless Abandon
#7 - 2012-12-18 13:22:34 UTC
Niddengolliah wrote:
my future goal in EvE is a stealth bomber, I love how they look and I love playing glass cannons in most games!

SB's are awful for missions. If your plan is to do other funky things with your SB then that's fine. But just in case your future plans involve doing missions in a SB, you might want to change them, ASAP!
Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-12-18 18:05:04 UTC
For a stealth Bomber you just need Torpedoes



Whilst your playing around in missile ships in general, there are other ways for a HML cruiser to deal with frigates/drones
Target Painter --> Increases the effective size of your targets Signature (making it easier to hit)
Stasis Webifyer --> Reduces the overall speed of your target (effectively leaving it in your missiles explosion radius for longer)
A tech 2 launcher will also allow you to use precision missiles ..



A frigate that is webbed, painted and being shot at with Precision Heavy Missiles is about to have a bad day.
Niddengolliah
Limit Everyone Nowhere Kingdom
#9 - 2012-12-18 19:03:17 UTC
Thanks for all the responses! I think I'll try out the LMLs first and then train up HAMs, I love blasters and these seem to be the missile equivalent :D.

And no, I will NOT use an SB in missions, I am not THAT new :D