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CCP. Put an end to station games! (example solution included)
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Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#1 - 2012-12-07 13:49:55 UTC
Station games still appear to be a problem. People now just hang around with a suspect flag in a easy to kill ship, then as soon as they get engaged, dock and undock in a PvP ship, then kill their aggressor. This seems to be a bit of an exploit of the system.

Station games have always been a problem but now, they are fixable! Really!

The solution I believe is relatively simple. Don't just make it so attacking stops you docking, make it so that getting into a limited engagement stops you docking for a short time. This way if you have a suspect flag, and someone shoot you, you can't dock, which lets face it is more realistic.
Anyone without a suspect flag it would not be making a difference to, as they would be the aggressor, so would not be able to dock anyway.
Why would concord allow you to shoot a suspect, but then when you do the station lets that suspect in providing it a safe haven?
Seems a bit unfair to allow the criminal in, but the good citizen fighting the suspect is given a temporary docking ban.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#2 - 2012-12-07 13:53:24 UTC
Why shouldn't I be able to dock just because some other guy shot at me? I didn't aggress, so I shouldn't be penalized for it. You on the other hand could learn to not take the bait and aggress your target when you've got an actual chance of killing him.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#3 - 2012-12-07 13:59:12 UTC
Destination SkillQueue wrote:
Why shouldn't I be able to dock just because some other guy shot at me? I didn't aggress, so I shouldn't be penalized for it. You on the other hand could learn to not take the bait and aggress your target when you've got an actual chance of killing him.

You can't have the chance of killing someone that can just dock as soon as they get hit. So this just means if a suspect is near a station, it makes the flag pointless. The whole idea of the flag was to encourage PvP in high sec.

And the reason you shouldn't be allowed to dock in that case is because you are flagged as suspect. Meaning you did something wrong and concord allows you to be shot. Why would they then protect you by allowing you to dock?

People dock and undock all the time taking shield damage, then docking, and it just seems a bit pointless.
With all the new changes, CCP should be making it so these flags actually make sense and cause a problem. At the moment, the suspect flags are pretty hard to use, as people just dock and wait for it to drop.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#4 - 2012-12-07 14:12:28 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Station games still appear to be a problem. People now just hang around with a suspect flag in a easy to kill ship, then as soon as they get engaged, dock and undock in a PvP ship, then kill their aggressor. This seems to be a bit of an exploit of the system.


That's not an exploit, that's a TARP!

You fell for it.

You also started the station games by engaging him on a station. It's best not to play a game yet if you don't know all the rules.


I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#5 - 2012-12-07 14:32:12 UTC
War Kitten wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Station games still appear to be a problem. People now just hang around with a suspect flag in a easy to kill ship, then as soon as they get engaged, dock and undock in a PvP ship, then kill their aggressor. This seems to be a bit of an exploit of the system.


That's not an exploit, that's a TARP!

You fell for it.

You also started the station games by engaging him on a station. It's best not to play a game yet if you don't know all the rules.



lol, I know the rules. And I don't play station games purely for the reason that docking is so easy. I was interested to see if the suspect system had changed anything, but it hasn't.
I can't understand how people waste their entire lives sitting around docking and undocking, and just thought that since CCP took 1 step toward making high sec PvP more fun, they might want to take a second step that actually affects it.
A lot of the changes the seem to have made in retribution appear at a glance to be good, but when you look into them, they change almost nothing.
Bounties and flagging will change nothing about the way people play so high sec is going to be just as dull as ever.

I don't know why you're getting your high and mighty tone with me by the way. Let's face it, people that play station games are just your average carebears. Not willing to take a real risk with PvP. So throw some of your hate at them for a change.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#6 - 2012-12-07 14:51:57 UTC

I'm sorry... but you're solution is broken....

I can prevent a Suspect from docking for Five minutes just by shooting at him? No....

Transferable Weapons Flags that inhibit docking, jumping, and ejecting from ships was the silver bullet to station/gate games.....

You, shooting some random Suspect on a station (who perhaps stole something rather than shot anyone) should NOT prevent that person from docking, jumping, etc... In fact, I think that suspect was more than justified docking, swapping ships, and taking you out... And I applaud them for it!

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#7 - 2012-12-07 15:01:19 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

I'm sorry... but you're solution is broken....

I can prevent a Suspect from docking for Five minutes just by shooting at him? No....

Transferable Weapons Flags that inhibit docking, jumping, and ejecting from ships was the silver bullet to station/gate games.....

You, shooting some random Suspect on a station (who perhaps stole something rather than shot anyone) should NOT prevent that person from docking, jumping, etc... In fact, I think that suspect was more than justified docking, swapping ships, and taking you out... And I applaud them for it!


Well luckily for me I didn't get killed :p My mate not so lucky.
If the suspect can just dock up and jump, then what's the point in the suspect flag?
Remember the suspect flag is also what is used for these brand new tradeable Kill rights, so it make then utterly useless.
Unless you manage to catch someone in a belt or next to a planet, or really quickly grab them 15k from a gate, they mean nothing.

Seriously, I thought players on this game wanted more PvP, not less. My mistake I guess.

I retract my suggestion in favour of current carebearing and return to industry. Good day.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
hungrymanbreakfast
Fixers Corporation
Pillars of Liberty
#8 - 2012-12-07 15:28:14 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

I'm sorry... but you're solution is broken....

I can prevent a Suspect from docking for Five minutes just by shooting at him? No....

Transferable Weapons Flags that inhibit docking, jumping, and ejecting from ships was the silver bullet to station/gate games.....

You, shooting some random Suspect on a station (who perhaps stole something rather than shot anyone) should NOT prevent that person from docking, jumping, etc... In fact, I think that suspect was more than justified docking, swapping ships, and taking you out... And I applaud them for it!


Well luckily for me I didn't get killed :p My mate not so lucky.
If the suspect can just dock up and jump, then what's the point in the suspect flag?
Remember the suspect flag is also what is used for these brand new tradeable Kill rights, so it make then utterly useless.
Unless you manage to catch someone in a belt or next to a planet, or really quickly grab them 15k from a gate, they mean nothing.

Seriously, I thought players on this game wanted more PvP, not less. My mistake I guess.

I retract my suggestion in favour of current carebearing and return to industry. Good day.


Bye. I could exlpoit the crap out of this with ganks if that was the case. Also if u want to kill something thats humping a station TRY TO ALPHA IT.
Learn the game mechanics... They really did fix station games mostly since they now have transferred timers on logistics.
Now I can kill their logi ships instead of watching them dock and undock with a fresh shield.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#9 - 2012-12-07 15:34:38 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

I'm sorry... but you're solution is broken....

I can prevent a Suspect from docking for Five minutes just by shooting at him? No....

Transferable Weapons Flags that inhibit docking, jumping, and ejecting from ships was the silver bullet to station/gate games.....

You, shooting some random Suspect on a station (who perhaps stole something rather than shot anyone) should NOT prevent that person from docking, jumping, etc... In fact, I think that suspect was more than justified docking, swapping ships, and taking you out... And I applaud them for it!


Well luckily for me I didn't get killed :p My mate not so lucky.
If the suspect can just dock up and jump, then what's the point in the suspect flag?
Remember the suspect flag is also what is used for these brand new tradeable Kill rights, so it make then utterly useless.
Unless you manage to catch someone in a belt or next to a planet, or really quickly grab them 15k from a gate, they mean nothing.

Seriously, I thought players on this game wanted more PvP, not less. My mistake I guess.

I retract my suggestion in favour of current carebearing and return to industry. Good day.


As a well seasoned PvP'er, I can tell you that catching a person on a gate is not as hard as you make it sound... it really helps if you have a friend ready to tackle on the other side!
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#10 - 2012-12-07 15:37:19 UTC
hungrymanbreakfast wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

I'm sorry... but you're solution is broken....

I can prevent a Suspect from docking for Five minutes just by shooting at him? No....

Transferable Weapons Flags that inhibit docking, jumping, and ejecting from ships was the silver bullet to station/gate games.....

You, shooting some random Suspect on a station (who perhaps stole something rather than shot anyone) should NOT prevent that person from docking, jumping, etc... In fact, I think that suspect was more than justified docking, swapping ships, and taking you out... And I applaud them for it!


Well luckily for me I didn't get killed :p My mate not so lucky.
If the suspect can just dock up and jump, then what's the point in the suspect flag?
Remember the suspect flag is also what is used for these brand new tradeable Kill rights, so it make then utterly useless.
Unless you manage to catch someone in a belt or next to a planet, or really quickly grab them 15k from a gate, they mean nothing.

Seriously, I thought players on this game wanted more PvP, not less. My mistake I guess.

I retract my suggestion in favour of current carebearing and return to industry. Good day.


Bye. I could exlpoit the crap out of this with ganks if that was the case. Also if u want to kill something thats humping a station TRY TO ALPHA IT.
Learn the game mechanics... They really did fix station games mostly since they now have transferred timers on logistics.
Now I can kill their logi ships instead of watching them dock and undock with a fresh shield.

The point is they don't need to use logi.
Think about it. You see someone nearby and buy his killrights, activating his suspect status. He just docks.
That's the whole of their tradeable killrights system put in the bin.
I'm not just talking about the guys that live and breathe station games, I'm saying in general, being able to dock once in combat seems it would pull away from what CCP were aiming to do with the new criminal system.

Anyway, it's clear you guys don't like it and will just continue to tell me its me not knowing about the game I've been playing since 2007 so this isn't going to get anywhere is it? Basically you have no arguable side to this so you resort to "you don't know how to play eve noob!"
If you are happy to not be able to use any of the purchasable kill rights and leave high sec PvP as boring as it is, then fair enough.

I can has close thread now?

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#11 - 2012-12-07 15:44:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
As a well seasoned PvP'er, I can tell you that catching a person on a gate is not as hard as you make it sound... it really helps if you have a friend ready to tackle on the other side!

Sure, if you have a squad set up at a gate to specifically catch someone. But I'm not talking about planned PvP and camps. I'm talking about the spur of the moment PvP that this new criminal system was designed to bring in. It simply doesn't work as it stands.
If you have better suggestions about how to make the new PvP better, feel free, but simply saying "you know nothing I R GR8 at PvP!" is no way to help improve gameplay.
A friend of mine was looking forward to the new bounty system and the new PvP, but he's decided enough is enough waiting for promised new features and getting these half baked ideas.

Personally as a heavy industry player, it barely affect me, I just thought it would be nice to get a back and forth of ideas over the new system going. I forgot that the 90% of the posts on eve forums are "I don't like your idea just cos, and you are a noob"

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#12 - 2012-12-07 16:01:33 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:

The point is they don't need to use logi.
Think about it. You see someone nearby and buy his killrights, activating his suspect status. He just docks.
That's the whole of their tradeable killrights system put in the bin.
I'm not just talking about the guys that live and breathe station games, I'm saying in general, being able to dock once in combat seems it would pull away from what CCP were aiming to do with the new criminal system.

Anyway, it's clear you guys don't like it and will just continue to tell me its me not knowing about the game I've been playing since 2007 so this isn't going to get anywhere is it? Basically you have no arguable side to this so you resort to "you don't know how to play eve noob!"
If you are happy to not be able to use any of the purchasable kill rights and leave high sec PvP as boring as it is, then fair enough.

I can has close thread now?


1.) Station games historically refer to people undocking logistics ships and carriers to rep ships on a station. Until Retribution, repping did not Transfer Weapons flags, so these Logistics ships were essentially immune to counter attacks, because they would dock up anytime they took significant damage. And the reps they apply were often significant enough to allow an aggressing ship on station to deaggress and dock or perhaps even keep fighting...

2.) If you buy killrights on someone, and they dock up and wait out the suspect timer, the killright is not "used up". Unless their ship is destroyed, the killright will be available again.

3.) Buying killrights on a person does NOT guarantee you that kill. It gives you the right to attempt the kill, but you need to be fully aware of ways they may escape. This includes warping off, jumping through a gate, docking, etc.... These are all the standard methods of escape any ship in EvE can use when being attacked.... and inhibiting these options to earn you a kill is essentially what PvP is founded upon.

4.) The ability to dock or jump when attacked is extremely important to this game. To inhibit it upon attack would break EvE worse than removing local completely, worse than removing concord, worse than just about anything else suggested in this forum.... Trust me, it would be BAADDD!!!!
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#13 - 2012-12-07 16:11:13 UTC

Let me try to explain something:

Most PvP in EvE is Non-consensual. As such, it is important to all people that don't want to be engaged methods to escape. The current methods are: Warp Away, Jump through a Gate or WH, Or Dock up. Warping away is inhibited by modules, and Jumping/Docking are inhibited by location (i.e. you can only do this in certain locations). Since you can't actually see what is outside of a Station or what's on the other side of a gate before you undock/jump, you are essentially blindly going into potential harm. If you then enable a Camper to inhibit you from redocking or jumping with their guns, you just created a situation where you blindly undock/jump and, if unlucky, are completely S.O.L.

Currently, if you jump/undock into a group of waiting hostiles, you can power back to gate and escape (potentially) or redock. This gives you options to survive, which is very important.

Do you somehow think it would be better if, when you undock, I could prevent you from redocking and destroy your ship, and there is nothing you could do about it?
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#14 - 2012-12-07 16:16:00 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:

The point is they don't need to use logi.
Think about it. You see someone nearby and buy his killrights, activating his suspect status. He just docks.
That's the whole of their tradeable killrights system put in the bin.
I'm not just talking about the guys that live and breathe station games, I'm saying in general, being able to dock once in combat seems it would pull away from what CCP were aiming to do with the new criminal system.

Anyway, it's clear you guys don't like it and will just continue to tell me its me not knowing about the game I've been playing since 2007 so this isn't going to get anywhere is it? Basically you have no arguable side to this so you resort to "you don't know how to play eve noob!"
If you are happy to not be able to use any of the purchasable kill rights and leave high sec PvP as boring as it is, then fair enough.

I can has close thread now?


1.) Station games historically refer to people undocking logistics ships and carriers to rep ships on a station. Until Retribution, repping did not Transfer Weapons flags, so these Logistics ships were essentially immune to counter attacks, because they would dock up anytime they took significant damage. And the reps they apply were often significant enough to allow an aggressing ship on station to deaggress and dock or perhaps even keep fighting...

2.) If you buy killrights on someone, and they dock up and wait out the suspect timer, the killright is not "used up". Unless their ship is destroyed, the killright will be available again.

3.) Buying killrights on a person does NOT guarantee you that kill. It gives you the right to attempt the kill, but you need to be fully aware of ways they may escape. This includes warping off, jumping through a gate, docking, etc.... These are all the standard methods of escape any ship in EvE can use when being attacked.... and inhibiting these options to earn you a kill is essentially what PvP is founded upon.

4.) The ability to dock or jump when attacked is extremely important to this game. To inhibit it upon attack would break EvE worse than removing local completely, worse than removing concord, worse than just about anything else suggested in this forum.... Trust me, it would be BAADDD!!!!


While killrights isn't a guaranteed kill, at the moment it's pretty much blind luck if you manage to get someone. Its definitely not the game altering mechanic CCP bigged it up to be.

Why would it be so bad to not be able to dock in high sec? if you are aggressed while having a supsect flag? bearing in mind if you have a suspect flag, then you must have done something that concord considers to be less than legal.
Why should the aggressor, (who has done absolutely nothing bad and is simply capitalising on the fact that a thief or a pirate has jumped on grid) be disallowed entry to a station, while the pirate/thief can do as they please? Surely you can see the logic here is highly flawed.

If they implemented this, it would be a 30-60 second timer preventing a player who was the target of a legal attack in a 0.5+ system from docking. Other than thieves and pirates, I can't see how anyone else would be affected, so it certainly wouldn't be worse than the removal of concord.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#15 - 2012-12-07 16:22:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

Let me try to explain something:

Most PvP in EvE is Non-consensual. As such, it is important to all people that don't want to be engaged methods to escape. The current methods are: Warp Away, Jump through a Gate or WH, Or Dock up. Warping away is inhibited by modules, and Jumping/Docking are inhibited by location (i.e. you can only do this in certain locations). Since you can't actually see what is outside of a Station or what's on the other side of a gate before you undock/jump, you are essentially blindly going into potential harm. If you then enable a Camper to inhibit you from redocking or jumping with their guns, you just created a situation where you blindly undock/jump and, if unlucky, are completely S.O.L.

Currently, if you jump/undock into a group of waiting hostiles, you can power back to gate and escape (potentially) or redock. This gives you options to survive, which is very important.

Do you somehow think it would be better if, when you undock, I could prevent you from redocking and destroy your ship, and there is nothing you could do about it?

Bearing in mind I would only be affected if I was on a suspect timer, yes I think it would be better.
I don't think jumping would need to be prevented necessarily as you can't switch ships by jumping.

When you undock, you have time to redock before being attacked, and that shouldn't change so you wont undock and be insta-dead. This is simply to be fair to the bounty hunter.

Think about this.
Bounty hunter jump onto grid, pirate jumps onto grid.
Bounty hunter engages pirate.
Pirate docks.

Now the bounty hunter is forced to warp away or risk that the pirate can now undock in a ship better suited to the situation, since the bounty hunter is not allowed to dock.

It makes absolutely no sense from a concord point of view, as this means the bounty hunter is being given no rights while the pirate is given asylum.

EDIT: Just to clarify - I would fully agree with your point of view if the target in question was an innocent character, but they aren't. And that was caused by their own actions, not by accident. They did something bad to get a suspect flag and should pay the price for that.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Seranova Farreach
Biomass Negative
#16 - 2012-12-07 16:28:30 UTC
i thought the new flags stopped people jumping and docking if recently fired upon a player?

[u]___________________ http://i.imgur.com/d9Ee2ik.jpg[/u]
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#17 - 2012-12-07 16:31:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Seranova Farreach wrote:
i thought the new flags stopped people jumping and docking if recently fired upon a player?

If you fired upon a player yes. This is the other way around. The idea is to prevent a suspect docking if they are fired upon legally in high sec.
Alternatively I suppose they could make it so if you fire on a suspect, you can still dock.
The general idea is to stop someone who is legally firing on someone being penalised more than someone who is a thief/pirate and still has a suspect flag.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#18 - 2012-12-07 16:55:01 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Seranova Farreach wrote:
i thought the new flags stopped people jumping and docking if recently fired upon a player?

If you fired upon a player yes. This is the other way around. The idea is to prevent a suspect docking if they are fired upon legally in high sec.
Alternatively I suppose they could make it so if you fire on a suspect, you can still dock.
The general idea is to stop someone who is legally firing on someone being penalised more than someone who is a thief/pirate and still has a suspect flag.


Reasons you may have a suspect flag in Highsec: You stealing from a can/wreck, remote assisting a suspect, remote assisting someone as a neutral third party, by shooting someone in lowsec and traveling to highsec, or by having killrights activated on you.

Reasons you cannot dock/jump after you attack someone: When fighting, it forces you to commit to the battle. Otherwise, you would sit on station, shoot suspects, and dock up the moment something doesn't go your way... This would be a bad game mechanic and abused like mad!

Reason why you're changes don't actually work like you imagine: A suspect can still swap ships from an orca, or a SMA, etc....

Reasons why a suspect should be allowed to dock: They haven't committed to the current fight.... If they fire back, they can't dock... So use that to your advantage... A commitment to a fight is a choice they make when on a station or gate... it is NOT something you force on them... And they aren't forcing you to shoot them either.... You have the option to hold off the engagement until you are ready for it and they are not... That is how you should do it....
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#19 - 2012-12-07 17:03:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Seranova Farreach wrote:
i thought the new flags stopped people jumping and docking if recently fired upon a player?

If you fired upon a player yes. This is the other way around. The idea is to prevent a suspect docking if they are fired upon legally in high sec.
Alternatively I suppose they could make it so if you fire on a suspect, you can still dock.
The general idea is to stop someone who is legally firing on someone being penalised more than someone who is a thief/pirate and still has a suspect flag.


Reasons you may have a suspect flag in Highsec: You stealing from a can/wreck, remote assisting a suspect, remote assisting someone as a neutral third party, by shooting someone in lowsec and traveling to highsec, or by having killrights activated on you.

Reasons you cannot dock/jump after you attack someone: When fighting, it forces you to commit to the battle. Otherwise, you would sit on station, shoot suspects, and dock up the moment something doesn't go your way... This would be a bad game mechanic and abused like mad!

Reason why you're changes don't actually work like you imagine: A suspect can still swap ships from an orca, or a SMA, etc....

Reasons why a suspect should be allowed to dock: They haven't committed to the current fight.... If they fire back, they can't dock... So use that to your advantage... A commitment to a fight is a choice they make when on a station or gate... it is NOT something you force on them... And they aren't forcing you to shoot them either.... You have the option to hold off the engagement until you are ready for it and they are not... That is how you should do it....


EDIT: Oh and you have the option to hold off, but the suspect flag only lasts 15 mins, so they have that long to wait you out then they are free as if they have done nothing wrong at all.

Yes, being able to dock mid fight would be abused, but its only fair since the bounty hunter did nothing wrong. It would only be possible to do to someone that performed one of the illegal actions you have just stated.
If you have a suspect flag on you, you don't deserve the protection of concord and as such should not be allowed the use of their facilities to hide until everyone forgotten you are a thief.
The point is, why bother to have the suspect flag if they still get the protection of stations? Other than the few noobs who didn't realise what they were doing and got obliterated, it's not done anyone any favours.
They put this suspect flag in as a solution to the lack of bounty hunting and mercenary roles. The solution did not work. So suggest a better solution.
This is just an example solution, as I've always been of the view that if you've got nothing constructive to say, don't say anything. Be constructive. How would you further encourage high sec PvP against legal target and open up a merc/bounty hunter path?

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#20 - 2012-12-07 17:18:28 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Seranova Farreach wrote:
i thought the new flags stopped people jumping and docking if recently fired upon a player?

If you fired upon a player yes. This is the other way around. The idea is to prevent a suspect docking if they are fired upon legally in high sec.
Alternatively I suppose they could make it so if you fire on a suspect, you can still dock.
The general idea is to stop someone who is legally firing on someone being penalised more than someone who is a thief/pirate and still has a suspect flag.


Reasons you may have a suspect flag in Highsec: You stealing from a can/wreck, remote assisting a suspect, remote assisting someone as a neutral third party, by shooting someone in lowsec and traveling to highsec, or by having killrights activated on you.

Reasons you cannot dock/jump after you attack someone: When fighting, it forces you to commit to the battle. Otherwise, you would sit on station, shoot suspects, and dock up the moment something doesn't go your way... This would be a bad game mechanic and abused like mad!

Reason why you're changes don't actually work like you imagine: A suspect can still swap ships from an orca, or a SMA, etc....

Reasons why a suspect should be allowed to dock: They haven't committed to the current fight.... If they fire back, they can't dock... So use that to your advantage... A commitment to a fight is a choice they make when on a station or gate... it is NOT something you force on them... And they aren't forcing you to shoot them either.... You have the option to hold off the engagement until you are ready for it and they are not... That is how you should do it....


EDIT: Oh and you have the option to hold off, but the suspect flag only lasts 15 mins, so they have that long to wait you out then they are free as if they have done nothing wrong at all.

Yes, being able to dock mid fight would be abused, but its only fair since the bounty hunter did nothing wrong. It would only be possible to do to someone that performed one of the illegal actions you have just stated.
If you have a suspect flag on you, you don't deserve the protection of concord and as such should not be allowed the use of their facilities to hide until everyone forgotten you are a thief.
The point is, why bother to have the suspect flag if they still get the protection of stations? Other than the few noobs who didn't realise what they were doing and got obliterated, it's not done anyone any favours.
They put this suspect flag in as a solution to the lack of bounty hunting and mercenary roles. The solution did not work. So suggest a better solution.
This is just an example solution, as I've always been of the view that if you've got nothing constructive to say, don't say anything. Be constructive. How would you further encourage high sec PvP against legal target and open up a merc/bounty hunter path?


Look at it this way... A suspect flag means the pilot did something shady, and so Concord won't jump in to "save them". A Criminal Flag means the the pilot did something wrong, so Concord cometh and Concord Destroyeth. Just because you do something shady in this game does NOT mean you deserve to die... if it did, Concord would destroy you.

And since the Suspect did NOT do something worthy of Concord's Deathray, they are free to travel as they will. Yes, they did something shady, and so Concord is stepping back and saying, "we don't know what's happening here, so we are not getting involved.". Hence everyone can shoot them without concord responding.

Now, as for docking in a Station.... you do realize that 99% of the NPC stations in eve are NOT under Concord's control, but usually some random corporation that wouldn't give two .... about what a person did or didn't do. However, those stations do care if your guns are still hot from shooting at other people...

Finally, from the Suspect's view point, the bounty hunter is doing something very wrong when they shoot at the Suspect...
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