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Mining missions and crystal use?

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Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#1 - 2012-10-07 10:33:08 UTC
I've flown a lot of level 3 missions, opting to use T1 strippers due to laziness.

A few minutes ago I flew 3-4 missions using T2 crystals, but it seems to me as if the crystals aren't damaged when used on non-standard roids, i.e. the kind of roids you have to mine from in mining missions.

The strippers work, I get ore (instead of an error message), but I didn't pay close attention to whether I actually got the yield bonus. I think I did, but I'm not sure.

Is it a design oversight that the crystals aren't damaged?
Celgar Thurn
Department 10
#2 - 2012-10-07 11:22:32 UTC
Hmmmm. The ores in mining missions are non-refinable variants of the standard ore types. The decriptions for them tell you which ore type they are related to. I have been meaning for ages to test out whether the mining crystals to give increased yield when mining them or not but 'haven't got around to it'.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#3 - 2012-10-07 14:37:42 UTC
(Mining Crystal) II only gives bonus for the EXACT ore.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#4 - 2012-10-07 16:25:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
(Mining Crystal) II only gives bonus for the EXACT ore.

As far as I know, this is incorrect.

Augumene = Pyroxeres
Banidine = Veldspar
Lyavite = Kernite
Mercium = Omber
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#5 - 2012-10-07 16:34:13 UTC
A simple Google search turned up this 2009 thread.

First Google result at the TOP.

http://community.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1174898

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#6 - 2012-10-07 16:58:05 UTC
Celgar Thurn wrote:
Hmmmm. The ores in mining missions are non-refinable variants of the standard ore types. The decriptions for them tell you which ore type they are related to. I have been meaning for ages to test out whether the mining crystals to give increased yield when mining them or not but 'haven't got around to it'.


To test it, simply have two T2 strippers fitted, one with a crystal in it, one without. Then suck one cycle with each stripper on two different roids. Or preferably on the same large roid, first one stripper, then the other, noting the intermediate amount of ore after the first cycle, and the final amount of ore after both cycles.

According to my notes, 2 out of the 7 level 3 mining missions involve a single large asteroid that's good for multiple cycles.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#7 - 2012-10-07 20:55:31 UTC
Just simply .hitting "Show Info" on the Stripper Module while in space will tell you exactly how much it will pull in per cycle. Compare the two with and without.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#8 - 2012-10-08 01:37:36 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Just simply .hitting "Show Info" on the Stripper Module while in space will tell you exactly how much it will pull in per cycle. Compare the two with and without.


No it won't.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#9 - 2012-10-08 12:11:47 UTC
Salpad wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Just simply .hitting "Show Info" on the Stripper Module while in space will tell you exactly how much it will pull in per cycle. Compare the two with and without.


No it won't.



I give up on you. The above quoted statement is false information noobs are now reading.

I repeat, your Stripper modules "Show Info" will tell you the yield per cycle with the crystal on it or not.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Alberik
Eusebius Corporation
#10 - 2012-10-08 15:32:45 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Salpad wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Just simply .hitting "Show Info" on the Stripper Module while in space will tell you exactly how much it will pull in per cycle. Compare the two with and without.


No it won't.



I give up on you. The above quoted statement is false information noobs are now reading.

I repeat, your Stripper modules "Show Info" will tell you the yield per cycle with the crystal on it or not.


sure, but it wont show you if the mission specific ore is "the same" as the standard ore. your answer doesnt help
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#11 - 2012-10-08 15:56:13 UTC
Alberik wrote:


sure, but it wont show you if the mission specific ore is "the same" as the standard ore. your answer doesnt help


What the heck are you wanting to find out ? Your point is utterly lost somewhere.................

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#12 - 2012-10-09 01:26:47 UTC
Alberik wrote:
sure, but it wont show you if the mission specific ore is "the same" as the standard ore. your answer doesnt help


That's exactly my point. "Show info" shows the yield for those ore types that gets the yield bonus, but it doesn't explain what ore types it is, so we don't know if the mining mission ores get the yield bonus, in spite of Krixtal Icefluxor's ******** arrogance.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#13 - 2012-10-09 13:06:26 UTC
Salpad wrote:
Alberik wrote:
sure, but it wont show you if the mission specific ore is "the same" as the standard ore. your answer doesnt help


That's exactly my point. "Show info" shows the yield for those ore types that gets the yield bonus, but it doesn't explain what ore types it is, so we don't know if the mining mission ores get the yield bonus, in spite of Krixtal Icefluxor's ******** arrogance.



Arrogant ? Read your own very first reply.

Reported.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
CCP Gargant
C C P
C C P Alliance
#14 - 2012-10-09 13:23:25 UTC
Gentlemen, please keep on the correct side of the constructive discussion.

As to the dilemma at hand, it is probably a good idea to shoot the Game Masters a petition asking about it. They should be able to either point you in the right direction or have the matter checked.

CCP Gargant | EVE Universe esports Coordinator
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#15 - 2012-10-09 13:54:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Bugsy VanHalen
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Salpad wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Just simply .hitting "Show Info" on the Stripper Module while in space will tell you exactly how much it will pull in per cycle. Compare the two with and without.


No it won't.



I give up on you. The above quoted statement is false information noobs are now reading.

I repeat, your Stripper modules "Show Info" will tell you the yield per cycle with the crystal on it or not.

Actually Krixtal you are wrong.

Hitting show info will tell you your exact yield with and without crystals, but does not answer the question of whether or not the mission variations of the roids are still affected by the crystals.

When you show info on a T2 strip it lists two values. Your bonused value of the ore that matches the crystal and your base value you will get for everything else. I always assumed that the crystals did work as all the mission variants of ore have a normal ore equivalent. (the crystal you would use) But I have never tested it. So I can also not confirm or deny that the crystals are not damaged.

Logic would seem to dictate that if the crystals are not damaged, that is because they are not working on those ores.

I do run mining missions, mostly level 4, but always use T1 strips. The lvl 4 missions I usually get contain the high end ore (A,B,C) equivalents, I don't like to waste A,B,C, crystals. I will have to test this out though if it seems the crystals are not damaged.

Has anyone actually tested this recently??
Idris Helion
Doomheim
#16 - 2012-10-09 16:04:34 UTC
I've done a bunch of mining missions, but I only ever use T1 ships and strips. The difference in yield is negligible in the amounts we're talking about, and training some of the higher-end crystals is pretty pointless if all you're doing is running missions in hisec space. In most L4 mining missions, you only need to deliver 44,500M3 of ore or so. That's two trips in a Retriever or a Mack, so big deal. You might save five minutes or so by using crystals, but...eh. Not worth the hassle.
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#17 - 2012-10-10 14:07:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Bugsy VanHalen
Idris Helion wrote:
I've done a bunch of mining missions, but I only ever use T1 ships and strips. The difference in yield is negligible in the amounts we're talking about, and training some of the higher-end crystals is pretty pointless if all you're doing is running missions in hisec space. In most L4 mining missions, you only need to deliver 44,500M3 of ore or so. That's two trips in a Retriever or a Mack, so big deal. You might save five minutes or so by using crystals, but...eh. Not worth the hassle.


Very true, which is why I have never gotten around to testing this. Although I do often use my ORCA and 3 hulks to run level 4 mining missions. Burning 9 Arknor crystals for a negligible difference seem pointless. I can complete most of the level 4 mining missions in under 5 minutes. Except the ones where you have to slow boat to the roids, those take about 10 minutes. I generally only run mining missions for standings. Currently trying to get my entire crew over 5.0 faction standings. I hate having to boot members whenever I need to anchor a POS.
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#18 - 2012-10-10 19:06:03 UTC
Idris Helion wrote:
I've done a bunch of mining missions, but I only ever use T1 ships and strips. The difference in yield is negligible in the amounts we're talking about, and training some of the higher-end crystals is pretty pointless if all you're doing is running missions in hisec space. In most L4 mining missions, you only need to deliver 44,500M3 of ore or so. That's two trips in a Retriever or a Mack, so big deal. You might save five minutes or so by using crystals, but...eh. Not worth the hassle.


I looked thoroughly in the EVE Survival mission wiki about a week ago, and the biggest level 4 missions require ore loads of 44-45k m3, so a bit more than what a Mackinaw can take. None of the level 3 ones require more than a Retriever can take, but I still prefer using a T2 Exhumer because it's tankier.

I do find mining missions to be a very nice way to earn standing, quickly and while semi-AFK (and I've never once had a level 3 mission send me out-of-system), and CCP might some day release level 5 mining missions. Exact knowledge of how T2 crystals work or don't work on the mission ores could be useful. All I know, so far, is that there didn't seem to be any wear on the crystals, which were used for several cycles. I'll probably do further testing at a later time, but right now I don't have any NPC corps that I want to boost standing with, and which offers mining missions.
Styth spiting
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2012-10-10 19:25:00 UTC
Bugsy VanHalen wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Salpad wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Just simply .hitting "Show Info" on the Stripper Module while in space will tell you exactly how much it will pull in per cycle. Compare the two with and without.


No it won't.



I give up on you. The above quoted statement is false information noobs are now reading.

I repeat, your Stripper modules "Show Info" will tell you the yield per cycle with the crystal on it or not.

Actually Krixtal you are wrong.

Hitting show info will tell you your exact yield with and without crystals, but does not answer the question of whether or not the mission variations of the roids are still affected by the crystals.

When you show info on a T2 strip it lists two values. Your bonused value of the ore that matches the crystal and your base value you will get for everything else. I always assumed that the crystals did work as all the mission variants of ore have a normal ore equivalent. (the crystal you would use) But I have never tested it. So I can also not confirm or deny that the crystals are not damaged.

Logic would seem to dictate that if the crystals are not damaged, that is because they are not working on those ores.

I do run mining missions, mostly level 4, but always use T1 strips. The lvl 4 missions I usually get contain the high end ore (A,B,C) equivalents, I don't like to waste A,B,C, crystals. I will have to test this out though if it seems the crystals are not damaged.

Has anyone actually tested this recently??


Bugsy VanHalen is completely right.

Show info will show the yield you will receive based on ship, crystal, skills, boosts, etc. But the yield shown has nothing to do with what you are mining. You could be using Arkonor T2 crystals on a veldspar roid and it would still show the same yield value.

That being said using the corresponding mining crystals do improve yield. If you show info on the roid you can determin what type of crystal to use. For example Augumene ore is in the Pyroxeres category. When you show info on the roid you will see:

"Despite its resemblance to common Pyroxeres, Augumene ore in its raw form is both rare and highly toxic to humans. Thus, while it is also a source of many of the minerals found in Pyroxeres ore, Augumene is generally considered virtually worthless due to the dangers posed by its handling."

So if you use T1/T2 pryo crystals while mining Augumene you will get the increased yield the mining crystal would give vs the yield you would get using the incorrect crystal for the ore type.