EVE General Discussion

Aren't suicide gankers part of the that wheel though? I guess what I'm saying is that there is no historical information on which to draw a conclusion in an Eve where suicide gankers don't exist, because they have always been there. They have always been part of the wheel. Assuming players can't kill each other in High Sec, than, what happens to Eves economy? What is the impact on Eve when we eliminate this reducing effect?

Its worth pointing out as well that suicide gankers have always existed side by side with miners, and there always have and continue to be an unlimited supply of people willing to mine.

So, once again you are alt posting?

My question is, though, if the new players are showing up because of "carebear buffs", should we expect that these players venture beyond high sec with the same frequency as those of us who play now?

i would guess that a whole bunch of these "supposed" new carebear subs would stay in the safe environs of hisec but some will venture out further afield and bolster the population of lo and null sec, and any increase in these populations has to be a good thing for null and lo pvp not to mention increased sub numbers for ccp (we know how hilmar likes to monitor subs before investing in new devs)

so whats the downside ?

lack of non consensual pvp in hisec
no more ganking

cant see that being a big issue, if the gankers wanna gank then go to losec or null and try see how you get on there,
there will still be noobs to pick on only thing is your gonna have to do it outside of hisec,

the possible benefits IMO however outweigh the tears of players who like to pick on hisec players,

there is room in eve for both playstyles and adapting game mechanics in hisec doesnt really upset anyone bar goonie pubbies

Well, I'm not sure how long you have played this game (assuming your using a posting alt) but suicide ganking before Hulkagedon was far broader of a phenomenon which included pretty much any target on which one could make a profit. Not sure about the frequency, as I have said, I have never been ganked, no one has ever attempted to gank me and I have never seen a gank in progress in 6 + years of playing this game so to me the whole thing is kind of a myth. gf the forums are any indication, however, suicide ganking was definitely more prevalent back in the day. That or people complained about it more back than. In any case it became more focused during the hulkagedon on miners specifically, and naturally their is a connection between that ongoing event and exhumer buffs. But I find it kind of an inconsistent response by CCP, I mean tomorrow Goons might decide its "Industrialgedon"... so what are we going to do? Buff every ship anytime an alliance makes a ganking event around it?

I guess what I'm driving at here is that, I don't see how making sweeping game changes in response to player events is in the spirit of Eve. CCP seemingly, at least in the public eye (as the author pointed out) encourages player events and seems to thrive on the publicity for their game when they occur, yet they turn around and suddenly present us with changes to the game that prevent such a thing from happening in the future. Which suggests that they obviously don't want us to organize in this fashion.

I think the author of this article makes a good point about this connection and I do believe that its a very unhealthy approach. I'm not saying I support suicide ganking here, as I still am yet to hear a reasonable argument for its existance, but certainly I support many other types of mechanics in which players are thrown to the spear through organization of events by players.. like war decs for example. Can we expect that everytime players organize an event and the results are "people get blown up" that their will be a game mechanic to prevent that event in the future?

I think that's the point the author is kind of driving home here. This is less about suicide ganking and more about how CCP responds to the organization of player driven content/events. Is this the new status quo? Next time I war dec someone can I expect the game to be nerfed to discourage me from doing it?

Clearly you where not in null sec last night.

http://dog-net.org/brdoc/?brid=12325
http://dog-net.org/brdoc/?brid=12327
http://dog-net.org/brdoc/?brid=12290

When was the last time you saw that in carebear land?

Yeah I got that, it wasn't that hard to figure out. You are right it is partially a mining barge buff whine, but that's not really what we are talking about here so how about instead of looking like a jack ass in an otherwise mostly productive discussion, you just take a pass on it.

I underlined the part I wanted to address (because I'm too lazy to edit, and context and all that)

I don't think the article really makes that case. It is clear that ship revision is an ongoing effort, I think the arguement that the changes to miners were targeted to specifically stop ganking can be clearly unsupported by that simple observation. That is unless you hold to the opinion that the rest of the ship revisions are all in an effort hide CCP's "true purpose" of making carebear, afk mining appealing.

You could make the case that past changes have been made to insure that high security ganking doesn't become more prevalent by being hugely profitable.

The only way I see high security ganking as a valid tactic is if it were part of a larger strategic initiative on the part of low/null sec corporations to preserve profit margins. I think that would be in the spirit of eve. The risk is large scale ship losses on the bet that margins for low/null sec material become more desirable.

Ganking for the lulls, or some some strange hatered of high sec miners or gaming the security mechanics? No, I don't agree that that gameplay should specifically be preserved.

And this is why stupid people should never be allowed to vote.

Not sure what you mean here. Are you under the impression that once you join a player corp, you can't return to an NPC corp?