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Missions & Complexes

 
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Regarding AFK Complex Farming

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Dregol
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#61 - 2012-08-09 13:33:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Dregol
mkint wrote:

Probably should have mentioned that there's a bugged complex in the news post. I was all like "I wonder if afk missioning is on the chopping block next, or rookies mining in industrials, or etc." It sounds like I'm not the only one who was confused by it.



Pretty much this. I was confused/angry as **** when I read the initial post.

Sreegs it'd probably be a good idea to update your post and say "there was a bugged complex, we're fixing it; any time you stay logged in for 23/7 and continue to make isk without being at your computer will be considered botting and will be bannable."

It doesn't mention what complex it was, or where it was, but people that have no idea wtf the bug was will have some explaination and you won't ge the Evil reaction from those who are uninformed.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#62 - 2012-08-09 13:36:30 UTC
Zwo Zateki wrote:
Then FIX it. Set time limit for drone aggressive mode. But do not threaten players. This is the SANDBOX ffs.


please stop misinterpreting "sandbox" as "I can use my drones to do literally the same thing a bot does just without a macro because Sandbox"

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#63 - 2012-08-09 13:40:15 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Sreegs
Dregol wrote:
mkint wrote:

Probably should have mentioned that there's a bugged complex in the news post. I was all like "I wonder if afk missioning is on the chopping block next, or rookies mining in industrials, or etc." It sounds like I'm not the only one who was confused by it.



Pretty much this. I was confused/angry as **** when I read the initial post.

Sreegs it'd probably be a good idea to update your post and say "there was a bugged complex, we're fixing it; any time you stay logged in for 23/7 and continue to make isk without being at your computer will be considered botting and will be bannable."

It doesn't mention what complex it was, or where it was, but people that have no idea wtf the bug was will have some explaination and you won't ge the Evil reaction from those who are uninformed.


"Specific examples of this include such activities as warping into a particular room in a complex, dropping sentry drones, then going to do your laundry or perhaps watch a 24 hour Lazytown marathon."

I don't believe it's limited to a single particular complex and to be frank if I did do that and they found somewhere else that it worked I'd have to deal with 700 petitions of rules lawyering. In this case what we're specifically concerned about is the ability to make money during long periods of being AFK performing activities which are meant to be active.

:edit: I'll try to clarify in a bit in the news item.

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
Tyke Orlieveit
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#64 - 2012-08-09 13:40:37 UTC
CCP Sreegs wrote:


I'm merely going to quote this. It's not going to please everyone and certainly not going to please those who were making isk while going about their lives doing things other than playing EVE actively but at the end of the day we're only referring to situations in THIS PARTICULAR CASE where you could in theory generate isk 24 hours a day without ever touching your computer. This does not apply to every situation you might perhaps maybe possibly use sentry drones in and nobody's going to ban your accounts because you went to get a cup of coffee.

There were however cases where this was being abused and so we're stating publically that abusing it is wrong and from this point forward the automated systems will handle it.

Protip for the future: if your computer is logged in 24 (or way more than a person can) hours a day making money in a way that is meant to be active and you're not in front of it you're probably doing something wrong



Question based on this if I could Sreegs:

What about cases where the EVE client is running on say, a home machine, and you are using remote desktop / remote viewing tools to perform eve activities ( an example being the ever favorite mining. )

Would this fall under a similar catchment as a bannable behaviour?
Darth Skorpius
352 Industries
#65 - 2012-08-09 13:41:51 UTC
CCP Sreegs wrote:
In this case what we're specifically concerned about is the ability to make money during long periods of being AFK performing activities which are meant to be active.


Well that means AFK mining is safe then!

Follow my Adventures in New Eden!
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#66 - 2012-08-09 13:42:09 UTC
Tyke Orlieveit wrote:
CCP Sreegs wrote:


I'm merely going to quote this. It's not going to please everyone and certainly not going to please those who were making isk while going about their lives doing things other than playing EVE actively but at the end of the day we're only referring to situations in THIS PARTICULAR CASE where you could in theory generate isk 24 hours a day without ever touching your computer. This does not apply to every situation you might perhaps maybe possibly use sentry drones in and nobody's going to ban your accounts because you went to get a cup of coffee.

There were however cases where this was being abused and so we're stating publically that abusing it is wrong and from this point forward the automated systems will handle it.

Protip for the future: if your computer is logged in 24 (or way more than a person can) hours a day making money in a way that is meant to be active and you're not in front of it you're probably doing something wrong



Question based on this if I could Sreegs:

What about cases where the EVE client is running on say, a home machine, and you are using remote desktop / remote viewing tools to perform eve activities ( an example being the ever favorite mining. )

Would this fall under a similar catchment as a bannable behaviour?


No, and you wouldn't be able to abuse that for the extended periods of time where it becomes ridiculous.

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#67 - 2012-08-09 13:43:03 UTC
Darth Skorpius wrote:
CCP Sreegs wrote:
In this case what we're specifically concerned about is the ability to make money during long periods of being AFK performing activities which are meant to be active.


Well that means AFK mining is safe then!


If you are aware of a way for miners to mine AFK with no third party programs 24 hours a day without being at their machines and managing cargo then I'm all ears.

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#68 - 2012-08-09 13:46:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Richard Desturned
will the fix for this allow me to park a supertanked ship permarunning an armor rep just to laugh at people who can't run the complex because my presence is preventing rats from respawning

i hope it does because that'd be p hilarious

(what i'm saying is that i hope that isn't the solution they have in mind)

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Tyke Orlieveit
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#69 - 2012-08-09 13:47:40 UTC
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Tyke Orlieveit wrote:
CCP Sreegs wrote:


I'm merely going to quote this. It's not going to please everyone and certainly not going to please those who were making isk while going about their lives doing things other than playing EVE actively but at the end of the day we're only referring to situations in THIS PARTICULAR CASE where you could in theory generate isk 24 hours a day without ever touching your computer. This does not apply to every situation you might perhaps maybe possibly use sentry drones in and nobody's going to ban your accounts because you went to get a cup of coffee.

There were however cases where this was being abused and so we're stating publically that abusing it is wrong and from this point forward the automated systems will handle it.

Protip for the future: if your computer is logged in 24 (or way more than a person can) hours a day making money in a way that is meant to be active and you're not in front of it you're probably doing something wrong



Question based on this if I could Sreegs:

What about cases where the EVE client is running on say, a home machine, and you are using remote desktop / remote viewing tools to perform eve activities ( an example being the ever favorite mining. )

Would this fall under a similar catchment as a bannable behaviour?


No, and you wouldn't be able to abuse that for the extended periods of time where it becomes ridiculous.


Awesome, cheers for clearing that up :)
Dregol
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#70 - 2012-08-09 13:49:13 UTC
CCP Sreegs wrote:
[

"Specific examples of this include such activities as warping into a particular room in a complex, dropping sentry drones, then going to do your laundry or perhaps watch a 24 hour Lazytown marathon."

I don't believe it's limited to a single particular complex and to be frank if I did do that and they found somewhere else that it worked I'd have to deal with 700 petitions of rules lawyering. In this case what we're specifically concerned about is the ability to make money during long periods of being AFK performing activities which are meant to be active.

:edit: I'll try to clarify in a bit in the news item.


The "going to do your laundry" bit implies that doing any form of ratting whilst not sitting directly at your computer is now illegal. I mean, what if I have a dominix in an anom, and I go to get a drink or make a sandwich? With your definition, it makes it sound like any and all drone activity while you're not at your computer is a bannable offence.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#71 - 2012-08-09 13:51:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Richard Desturned
Dregol wrote:
The "going to do your laundry" bit implies that doing any form of ratting whilst not sitting directly at your computer is now illegal. I mean, what if I have a dominix in an anom, and I go to get a drink or make a sandwich? With your definition, it makes it sound like any and all drone activity while you're not at your computer is a bannable offence.


it's fairly obvious that the news item is specifically related to sites that continuously spawn rats, not sites that spawn a set number of waves

not quite a ninja edit: okay yeah it wasn't that obvious

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Arian Mistacce
Krusual Research and Design
#72 - 2012-08-09 13:51:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Arian Mistacce
CCP Sreegs wrote:
:edit: I'll try to clarify in a bit in the news item.
Probably for the best. If you're not aware of the specific complex you're talking about, it makes it sound like you're banning any type of AFK Ratting.

I've seen discussions of people saying that AFK missioning is now an exploit, because it's meant to be active ISK making, and if you're away from the computer you're making it passive.

I mean, it takes me 20 minutes to "Go and do my laundry". I don't think I'm particularly unusual in this. That's not an unreasonable amount of time for an AFK Domi to clear a room.
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#73 - 2012-08-09 13:52:30 UTC
Dregol wrote:
CCP Sreegs wrote:
[

"Specific examples of this include such activities as warping into a particular room in a complex, dropping sentry drones, then going to do your laundry or perhaps watch a 24 hour Lazytown marathon."

I don't believe it's limited to a single particular complex and to be frank if I did do that and they found somewhere else that it worked I'd have to deal with 700 petitions of rules lawyering. In this case what we're specifically concerned about is the ability to make money during long periods of being AFK performing activities which are meant to be active.

:edit: I'll try to clarify in a bit in the news item.


The "going to do your laundry" bit implies that doing any form of ratting whilst not sitting directly at your computer is now illegal. I mean, what if I have a dominix in an anom, and I go to get a drink or make a sandwich? With your definition, it makes it sound like any and all drone activity while you're not at your computer is a bannable offence.


UGH, yeah I guess. I'll edit it. This situation really only applies in rather extreme cases. It's impossible for you to be impacted by this if you're engaging in normal gameplay.

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
Dregol
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#74 - 2012-08-09 13:54:36 UTC
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Dregol wrote:
CCP Sreegs wrote:
[

"Specific examples of this include such activities as warping into a particular room in a complex, dropping sentry drones, then going to do your laundry or perhaps watch a 24 hour Lazytown marathon."

I don't believe it's limited to a single particular complex and to be frank if I did do that and they found somewhere else that it worked I'd have to deal with 700 petitions of rules lawyering. In this case what we're specifically concerned about is the ability to make money during long periods of being AFK performing activities which are meant to be active.

:edit: I'll try to clarify in a bit in the news item.


The "going to do your laundry" bit implies that doing any form of ratting whilst not sitting directly at your computer is now illegal. I mean, what if I have a dominix in an anom, and I go to get a drink or make a sandwich? With your definition, it makes it sound like any and all drone activity while you're not at your computer is a bannable offence.


UGH, yeah I guess. I'll edit it. This situation really only applies in rather extreme cases. It's impossible for you to be impacted by this if you're engaging in normal gameplay.


Yeah, from the thread I've gathered that. When you edit it, feel free to link the blog to this thread to help clarify Big smile
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#75 - 2012-08-09 14:09:39 UTC
Dregol wrote:
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Dregol wrote:
CCP Sreegs wrote:
[

"Specific examples of this include such activities as warping into a particular room in a complex, dropping sentry drones, then going to do your laundry or perhaps watch a 24 hour Lazytown marathon."

I don't believe it's limited to a single particular complex and to be frank if I did do that and they found somewhere else that it worked I'd have to deal with 700 petitions of rules lawyering. In this case what we're specifically concerned about is the ability to make money during long periods of being AFK performing activities which are meant to be active.

:edit: I'll try to clarify in a bit in the news item.


The "going to do your laundry" bit implies that doing any form of ratting whilst not sitting directly at your computer is now illegal. I mean, what if I have a dominix in an anom, and I go to get a drink or make a sandwich? With your definition, it makes it sound like any and all drone activity while you're not at your computer is a bannable offence.


UGH, yeah I guess. I'll edit it. This situation really only applies in rather extreme cases. It's impossible for you to be impacted by this if you're engaging in normal gameplay.


Yeah, from the thread I've gathered that. When you edit it, feel free to link the blog to this thread to help clarify Big smile


It's republished now

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
Ghost Frog
Doomheim
#76 - 2012-08-09 14:10:09 UTC
At the risk of escalating this into a shitstorm, I'd like to get clarification about freighters. I have done quite a bit of AFK freighter piloting. In fact, I'm willing to bet the overwhelming majority of EVE players do freighter runs 100% AFK. Will you be ******* with us as well? Because the core of the logic being applied here would seem to fit my situation.
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#77 - 2012-08-09 14:12:25 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Sreegs
Ghost Frog wrote:
At the risk of escalating this into a shitstorm, I'd like to get clarification about freighters. I have done quite a bit of AFK freighter piloting. In fact, I'm willing to bet the overwhelming majority of EVE players do freighter runs 100% AFK. Will you be ******* with us as well? Because the core of the logic being applied here would seem to fit my situation.


No, the core of the logic that's being attributed to it would :)

The core of the logic that's actually being applied here is that this only applies to fringe cases and anyone engaging in normal gameplay is completely unaffected.

Clearly the news item wasn't clear enough about that so I've had it edited.

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
Tanaka Aiko
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#78 - 2012-08-09 14:18:46 UTC
Quote:
You may feel free to feed yourself while playing EVE Online without threat of punishment.

you're really generous CCP Lol
Legiolith
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#79 - 2012-08-09 14:27:47 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Navigator
It's a sandbox. You put in the mechanics and we make the most of them. If a plex is broken, fix it, don't throw bs around that you will ban people for afk'ing while playing this game as 90% of the damn game can be accomplished while beeing afk. INCLUDING SKILL TRAINING, TRADING, MINING etc...

For the record, I dont do this myself and I think it's f'ed up that you can do it. But if you play by the rules, ie. the game mechanics that are not broken, then you should not be banned for it.

So man the f up and change the plex(es?) in question so you can't do it for 23/7 and stop being a-holes and remove that ******** post about banning players for playing by the rules introduced by you. And we will pretend that his never happened and move on...

DO NOT BREAK THIS GAME! I enjoy it. And I am all that matters.

Love,
Legio
Decimat Draconia
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#80 - 2012-08-09 14:30:49 UTC
I agree that the COSMOS exploit needs to be fixed, lets just keep it to high sec plexes though.

If you afk plex in 0.0 you run the risk of being scanned down and podded - this is the beauty of NULL.