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Newton's First Law

First post
Author
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#41 - 2012-08-08 18:00:13 UTC  |  Edited by: FloppieTheBanjoClown
Metal Icarus wrote:
So i tried to work with Physics in our universe, explaining how the warp drive component of every ship in the game affects your ship. You made your own universe where unicorns and dragons could exist and you get the likes...


it helps to be a Clown. People like clowns.

Seriously, I got the idea from Stephen Baxter's story Raft, which is a part of the larger Xeelee Sequence universe. It presents the idea of multiple universes in which the constants of physics vary.

Metal Icarus wrote:
He said newton's first law, physics in our universe was OP's question.


Yeah, but I've never been able to work out a scenario that really fits in our universe. Besides, the whole point of that was to get the OP to throw out the notion of making game mechanics fit into science and instead accept them as their own universe. A roundabout way of saying "it's just a game, accept it for what it is."

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.

FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#42 - 2012-08-08 18:02:42 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
A reasonable explanation, one that makes sense. Now, as for being internally consistent, if we could somehow get CCP to understand that hurtling a projectile with a 1.4 metre diameter 60 km through space instantaneously is kind of difficult, Eve would be better place.


I just take that to be artistic license for the sake of not having to do ballistics modeling. Turrets all shoot in a straight line because it's easier to render.

Though one could use the same "fluid space" mechanics I mentioned to justify why projectiles don't keep flying forever and lasers dissipate over short distances.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.

Cadfael Maelgwyn
Doomheim
#43 - 2012-08-08 18:03:42 UTC
lachrymus wrote:
Come on, we all know how warp engines work don't we? Damn, where's Scotty when you need him?

He's retired.
alittlebirdy
All Hail The Liopleurodon
#44 - 2012-08-08 18:21:12 UTC
Cause CCP can't code... funny on that reply too a get a 404 on the forums... fail epic fail.
Charles Case
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#45 - 2012-08-08 18:45:50 UTC
MY IMMERSION
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#46 - 2012-08-08 19:30:21 UTC
1) the creation of the active warp field puts an enormous amount of subspace drag upon the ship, bringing it to a stop before the lightspeed engines can take over (completely made up by me, just pointing out scifi excuses exist)

2) server is based on vectors and so a stationary object has no direction. Not sure if this could be corrected with some programmer skills.
TorquePSA
State War Academy
Caldari State
#47 - 2012-08-08 19:55:07 UTC
... or since it takes light 9 minutes to travel 1 AU, and my ships can go 5-19 AU a second (2,500x - 10,000x the speed of light), why can I see anywhere except directly in front of me, very briefly, as the infinitesimal mass of photons hits my eyes with the force of a thousand nuclear bombs?

Because physics are the bane of fairy tales.
Have fun.

(I realize that photons don't have mass but I submit that (10000 x infinity)^2 is a number large enough to kill you all by itself)
Metal Icarus
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#48 - 2012-08-08 20:03:45 UTC
TorquePSA wrote:
... or since it takes light 9 minutes to travel 1 AU, and my ships can go 5-19 AU a second (2,500x - 10,000x the speed of light), why can I see anywhere except directly in front of me, very briefly, as the infinitesimal mass of photons hits my eyes with the force of a thousand nuclear bombs?

Because physics are the bane of fairy tales.
Have fun.

(I realize that photons don't have mass but I submit that (10000 x infinity)^2 is a number large enough to kill you all by itself)


Photons are a quantum entity, it has mass and no mass at the same time.

EDIT: it depends on your perspective.
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#49 - 2012-08-08 20:03:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Corina Jarr
TorquePSA wrote:
... or since it takes light 9 minutes to travel 1 AU, and my ships can go 5-19 AU a second (2,500x - 10,000x the speed of light), why can I see anywhere except directly in front of me, very briefly, as the infinitesimal mass of photons hits my eyes with the force of a thousand nuclear bombs?

Because physics are the bane of fairy tales.
Have fun.

(I realize that photons don't have mass but I submit that (10000 x infinity)^2 is a number large enough to kill you all by itself)

This wouldn't be an issue.

Nothing is hitting your eyes.




The real question is, why can we see most everything while at warp?
Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#50 - 2012-08-08 20:10:09 UTC
eve takes place in a different universe where space has the same physics as earth's water.
Solania Aurae
Garoun Investment Bank
#51 - 2012-08-08 22:12:59 UTC
Corina Jarr wrote:
TorquePSA wrote:
... or since it takes light 9 minutes to travel 1 AU, and my ships can go 5-19 AU a second (2,500x - 10,000x the speed of light), why can I see anywhere except directly in front of me, very briefly, as the infinitesimal mass of photons hits my eyes with the force of a thousand nuclear bombs?

Because physics are the bane of fairy tales.
Have fun.

(I realize that photons don't have mass but I submit that (10000 x infinity)^2 is a number large enough to kill you all by itself)

This wouldn't be an issue.

Nothing is hitting your eyes.




The real question is, why can we see most everything while at warp?



This is the only thing that really bothers me now that I've been playing for awhile now. Originally, I let it slide as I figured that this implementation was dramatically more cool looking then staring at blackness or some physcedelic warp tunnel(?).

Now I wouldn't mind a cool new take on the warp tunnel mechanic as far as graphics are concerned. Something with more "punch". Having said that, the current tunnel that has since been updated for Crucible (V3) has a really cool subtle "warping" effect.
Tarn Kugisa
Kugisa Dynamics
#52 - 2012-08-08 22:31:32 UTC
WIZARDS
WIZARDS EVERYWHERE

Be polite. Be efficient. Have a plan to troll everyone you meet - KuroVolt

Jypsie
Wandering Star Enterprises
#53 - 2012-08-08 22:42:03 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Space is a liquid.


Its aether.
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#54 - 2012-08-08 22:55:27 UTC
because of falcon

how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value

Togg Bott
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#55 - 2012-08-08 22:59:07 UTC
Alice Saki wrote:
We're not in Space, We're Underwater, Did noone tell you?

Also, Its a Game.



its not underwater... its inside a vast space oil deposit
AlleyKat
The Unwanted.
#56 - 2012-08-08 23:05:05 UTC
lachrymus wrote:
For me, these two fails break the illusion - and they break Newton's First Law. Come on CCP, fix this simple stuff...


Interesting point: what is more important in a video game?

(1) Suspension of disbelief (a) @ the expense of video game mechanics (b)

OR

(2) Video game mechanics (b) @ the expense of realism (c)

OR

(3) World of Warcraft (d)

1+2=3

Most would say d-c+a=EVE

And I guess you need confirmation the math is right...and maybe it isn't, but so long as the positive outweighs the negative, that is enough for most.

The framework of something doesn't denote importance, it's just the framework. The subject is the subject, and if that is not flawed, then the framework can be without affecting the impact of the subject.

It's analogous to people arguing about the quality of special effects in a motion picture affecting the enjoyment of the film. If the film is good, it is not good because of the special effects, it is good because of the quality of the story telling. If the story telling is pristine, the special effects are completely irrelevant.

As we have emotions, I would argue the enjoyment of a game is more important than any of its components, and especially the framework.

/goes to play Tetris for an hour.





This space for rent.

Wacktopia
State War Academy
Caldari State
#57 - 2012-08-08 23:20:52 UTC
lachrymus wrote:
Stop! You're breaking my illusions...


You're under water. You cannot breathe. Wake up! Wake up!!

Kitchen sink? Seriousy, get your ship together -  Fleet-Up.com

Dersk
Perkone
Caldari State
#58 - 2012-08-08 23:24:30 UTC
lachrymus
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#59 - 2012-08-09 18:26:57 UTC
OP here. Thanks all for your encyclopaedic responses. Guess I'll have to live with it as it is...
Jimmy Gunsmythe
Sebiestor Tribe
#60 - 2012-08-09 18:44:27 UTC
Alice Saki wrote:
We're not in Space, We're Underwater, Did noone tell you?

Also, Its a Game.


Funny, when people rabbled about warping through a planet, the phrase 'It's a game' did not satisfy them. Even when given plausible scientific reasons, they still weren't satisfied.

It may be a game, but its a better game when things make sense.

John Hancock