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Moon mining and reactions

Author
UtamaDoc
Heavywater Innovations
#1 - 2012-08-01 13:20:28 UTC
Wheres this going?

I have poses set up for reacting complex materials on dead moons - i buy everything and react everything....

The latest Dev makes me think this sort of gameplay is dead in the water - any Dev's or speculators want to comment on this?
Roll Sizzle Beef
Space Mutiny
#2 - 2012-08-01 13:26:46 UTC
UtamaDoc wrote:
Wheres this going?

I have poses set up for reacting complex materials on dead moons - i buy everything and react everything....

The latest Dev makes me think this sort of gameplay is dead in the water - any Dev's or speculators want to comment on this?


Doesn't stop you from having more options when purchasing everything.
Perhaps one goo dips low enough for one upper reaction to be made cheaper.

And ring mining is still way off. Yet you would still likely need to react everything.
UtamaDoc
Heavywater Innovations
#3 - 2012-08-01 13:49:36 UTC
Roll Sizzle Beef wrote:
UtamaDoc wrote:
Wheres this going?

I have poses set up for reacting complex materials on dead moons - i buy everything and react everything....

The latest Dev makes me think this sort of gameplay is dead in the water - any Dev's or speculators want to comment on this?


Doesn't stop you from having more options when purchasing everything.
Perhaps one goo dips low enough for one upper reaction to be made cheaper.

And ring mining is still way off. Yet you would still likely need to react everything.


I've said for years that moon mining isn't the problem its the act of allowing the biggest entities in eve to monopolise an entire market with seemingly no way to combat it. I think Alchemy won't touch that unless they increase the refine rate,

I quite like moon mining/reacting since i think the risk versus reward versus time model is inline with current mechanics... I would say kuddose to anyone who changes the difficulty of making a pos go offline or into reinforce mode - everyone hates pos shooting and so people can play the whole "disrupt isk making" role, pos'es should really have smaller defences to appeal to the less than 20 man gangs.

Pinstar Colton
Sweet Asteroid Acres
#4 - 2012-08-01 13:56:15 UTC
I would have to disagree with you. Even if they lowered POS defenses, the bigger players would be able to field fleets to defend their holdings from raiders. Meanwhile, the smaller POS owning corps, who might rely more heavily on the defenses of the POS itself, would see their stations easily picked off.

In the end, alchemy is a safety valve. It is always more economical to produce the mineral itself, but lacking that, the more common minerals can be used in place of it.

Thus the cost of the rarer material is capped at the cost of replacing it with the cheaper stuff.

In the cat-and-mouse game that is low sec, there is no shame in learning to be a better mouse.

UtamaDoc
Heavywater Innovations
#5 - 2012-08-01 14:46:58 UTC  |  Edited by: UtamaDoc
Pinstar Colton wrote:
I would have to disagree with you. Even if they lowered POS defenses, the bigger players would be able to field fleets to defend their holdings from raiders. Meanwhile, the smaller POS owning corps, who might rely more heavily on the defenses of the POS itself, would see their stations easily picked off.

In the end, alchemy is a safety valve. It is always more economical to produce the mineral itself, but lacking that, the more common minerals can be used in place of it.

Thus the cost of the rarer material is capped at the cost of replacing it with the cheaper stuff.


I can see your point,

but i can point to this - > "the bigger players would be able to field fleets to defend their holdings from raiders" currently that doesn't happen. I can't get in a fleet big enough to do any damage in the first place and if i do, when the ref-timer is out there is a fleet twice three times that of ours waiting - i was more thinking along the lines of 10 - 20 man fleets being able to do some damage. In fact i don't know of any alliances who go to kill a moon for the fun of it. Moon taking is a sign of an alliance wanting space to live in. there are entities out there that don't want to live in space but do want to disrupt isk making in the hope of a good fight and to ruin some ones day. To me the whole Pos and Ref-timer mechanic create stagnation.

On the other hand would forcing bigger alliances to defend their assets cause them to stay in their space....unlike stations being anchored on moons 4 or 5 regions over just becuase "they can".

and to point out smaller pos owning corps don't cap the good moons becuase they wouldn't be able to defend, meaning the only moons that are left are the low end and dead moons that bigger alliances don't need.
Garreth Vlox
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2012-08-01 21:45:31 UTC
"Moon taking is a sign of an alliance wanting space to live in. there are entities out there that don't want to live in space but do want to disrupt isk making in the hope of a good fight and to ruin some ones day. "

I'm not against a small group of players having an impact on null, but allowing 10-20 people to do whats takes 3 hours for hundreds is just going to take us right back to the incarna rage levels. If you want to make small groups able to effect 0.0 then the sov system needs an overhaul to match.

The LULZ Boat.

Pipa Porto
#7 - 2012-08-02 00:05:06 UTC
UtamaDoc wrote:
Moon taking is a sign of an alliance wanting space to live in. there are entities out there that don't want to live in space but do want to disrupt isk making in the hope of a good fight and to ruin some ones day. To me the whole Pos and Ref-timer mechanic create stagnation.


Sorry, Dominion happened a few years ago. Moon taking is a sign that someone wants some income or needs to set up a POS, nothing more.

Dropping SBUs is a sign that an Alliance wants space to live in.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto

UtamaDoc
Heavywater Innovations
#8 - 2012-08-03 09:04:51 UTC
I'm reading nothing that inspires me about the changes to moon mining atm.... Can anyone else contribute?
Natasha Mendel
Doomheim
#9 - 2012-08-03 09:09:21 UTC
I saw another suggestion somewhere, and I liked it a lot.

I can't remember the specifics, but the gist of the idea is that each race would have a specific T2 component that is used in the construction of each race's T2 ships and weapons. Instead of Technetium being the bottleneck, there would be four of them, respective for each race.

These four new race-specific bottlenecks would be distributed according to racial regions, the higher concentrations in the specific race's lowsec and nearby nullsec, with a slight dusting of each spread about throughout the rest of the universe.

This may be a possible solution, but it may not work out.
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
#10 - 2012-08-03 09:10:42 UTC
You mean just the basic profession of moon mining and reactions? Wierd, I havn't heard much, besides the dev blog on alchemy. That might or might not be worth your time. CCP said they still want tech to be worth isk, so not sure how far alchemy will go for you.

Signature removed for inappropriate language - CCP Eterne

Pipa Porto
#11 - 2012-08-03 09:35:20 UTC
Natasha Mendel wrote:
I saw another suggestion somewhere, and I liked it a lot.

I can't remember the specifics, but the gist of the idea is that each race would have a specific T2 component that is used in the construction of each race's T2 ships and weapons. Instead of Technetium being the bottleneck, there would be four of them, respective for each race.

These four new race-specific bottlenecks would be distributed according to racial regions, the higher concentrations in the specific race's lowsec and nearby nullsec, with a slight dusting of each spread about throughout the rest of the universe.

This may be a possible solution, but it may not work out.


Ummm, you mean like how the Carbides work?

"Tungsten Carbide is a much-used composite, greatly favored by the Amarrians for construction of their advanced technologies."
"Due to its immense strength and molecular malleability, Titanium Carbide has become the darling of the Caldari technological industry, seeing use in everything from reactor units to weapons systems."
"An exeptionally hard material created from crystallite alloys and carbon polymers, crystalline carbonite is a primary component in various forms of advanced Gallente technology, such as thrusters and armor plating."
"A revolutionary ceramic carbide compound, much favored by the Matari both for its earthy quality and its extremely wide range of technological uses."

Anyway, there were multiple bottlenecks before CCP changed all the Component formulae to reduce the amount of R64s needed.

I'd say there's roughly 0 chance that CCP can successfully control the strength of any bottleneck they try to create.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto

UtamaDoc
Heavywater Innovations
#12 - 2012-08-03 10:39:11 UTC  |  Edited by: UtamaDoc
I read the Blog on Alchemy - its the main "replacement" of anything related to moon mining that is bothering me. I personally can not sit wired into comms whilst taking part in a group activity, the wife doesn't like it, so as you can see i am trying to protect the only thing in eve that allows me to do other forms of eve.

I like reacting moon goo - i do it on dead moons and buy everything off the market since i am not able to have my own moons to mine.

I still put in the effort and can sit for hours setting up and resetting reactions; I am completely un-inspired by the latest CSM minutes and further more i have no confidence in the current CSM or this game (for the future at least anyhow)....

Further moon i bet there are 10's of thousands of other people who are in the same situation as me. we want our piece of eve and want to be able to sign in and enjoy it but all idea's that are coming out of CCP/CSM are pushing the boat further inline with BLOB warfare - the biggest cause of stagnation, its not i don't want to its becuase RL stops us from being able to do it.