EVE General Discussion

See, that's the problem. People who suicide gank high-sec miners are the laziest PvP'ers. Now that it is no longer so easy to gank high-sec miners, gankers find it easier to whine on the forums instead of actually learning to PvP.

MMOs reflect the real world in many wicked ways. One of them is the kind of player playing it.

You have the top alpha male on one side, if it was for him, all would be hard core and a matter of domination and proof of his masculine hormones overabundance. They are relatively rare. They often are extremely accomplished people in RL as well, maybe retired already and can dedicate tons of time to the game. They also achieve ten time more per unit of time than others.

Then there's a plethora of "more calm water" players with various degrees of committment, endurance, ability to form their own objectives (something quite needed for a sandbox game). They are still quite rare, they are the free minds, often in alliance or harsh conflict with the above. Some of them entertrain into more or less wicked manipulations both of the markets and of the other people listed below. Some of them are cheaters, awoxers etc.

Then there's the "populace", who "just want to live and let leave", who "just want to do their honest job", "just work hard and feed the family". They need their hands driven by somebody else, they are easily used and manipulated, they are the honest tax payers. Not because they are inherently good, but because they were manipulated into being honest and into believing in "the State", in "the Good Values" and other similar mass sociology brain washing.
This is where the tens of millions subscribers are, they are the sheep, the material to be used and abused by those in command. Many of them are very mediocre players (which does not mean they are necessarily "casual") but they form "zergs" and generally meatshield to sacrifice (I am trespassing into Machiavelli now).

At the base of the above are the subsidized, the welfare people. They will indeed think they have to buy the best expensive product (Hulk) and an iPad, because "you are cool and elite with them". They just cannot be self sufficient, the (European) State provide them with the basic life needed things in exchange for their life and sweat.
We have whole subsidized categories in RL, I won't mention any because the last time I got flamed to the ground for speaking the cold truths.
They are predictable and go after blind guides adoption (see the 0.0 Halada's miners guide deadspace fitting used in hi sec Hulks!).
You simply cannot demand those guys will smarten up, they just can't. They may be amiable persons, good workers, friends but they just won't walk the extra mile, they are the anti-emergent player.

MMO companies for their own survival rely on all sorts of players with varying degrees of composition.

EvE relied on the first two kinds for some years and this made EvE of a niche MMO.
But then, 5000 players were not enough to grant the game continued expansion and improvement.

So, CCP opened the doors for the other kind of players.


So, you have to sort of deal with it.
The latter players are simply not able to walk the extra mile some in this thread demand them to.
This is why CCP are creating "canned content" for them.
The only ways to keep those players is to WoW-ify the game a little in order to tangibly scale up the subs numbers.
Or to educate them, but this is extremely hard, it's a process that takes years and is extremely, harshly and sometimes punished with RL death, because strong RL powers WANT to have unwashed masses to control, drive and feed onto.

Imagine what would happen if suddenly, the honest tax payers, the family fathers woke up and started thinking.

Yes, you did. And yield isn't everything. I did provide proof, by the way, just not in the form you seem to understand. You're letting numbers blind you to any other line of reasoning. Quit posting numbers and provide a better argument.

Right. And when CCP tallies the votes (aka subs,) who do you think has a bigger voice? The high-sec gankers? Or the high-sec miners? I think it's pretty obvious that CCP values the miners' concerns over the high-sec gankers' concerns.

The real question is: will the high-sec gankers unsub over the mining ship changes? Because, you know, this game isn't for everyone.

You have really to hope the current CEO and stake holders don't change and get replaced by "$$$$ in the eyes" quick short term money mongers a la EA.

they won't, they'll adapt, like the miners have routinely failed to

on the other hand, the miners will unsub for other reasons, such as another wow clone they can give $15/mo to or getting scammed

the only way to adapt this game for the crowd in question is to completely throw away everything that keeps the people who actually love this game subscribed

You have really to hope the current CEO and stake holders don't change and get replaced by "$$$$ in the eyes" quick short term money mongers a la EA.

You have yet to see the real EA-alike directors in action. If you believe that little CCP brainfart was something serious you'd see MMOs that got totally gutted to the point of losing dozens of servers in 2-3 months, others that within 3 months off release were already 40% player base down and so on.

CCP can do just so much to diversify the ships. Game model is too simple and lacks of the hundreds of tangent factors that in RL make people buy products that are not min maxed in the 2-3 super important stats.

Also, there are "mining doctrines" too. If common belief is that max yield is THE MUST then they can sugar coat all they want, people will still fly untanked double MLU Hulks.

I don't expect to see equality in ships usage, nor ISK will play a factor since everybody can and will switch to an exhumer ASAP.

But the vocal miners won't adapt anyway (since they could have for years now and haven't), so what is the point of making any changes. They still will fail fit, die to gankers, and whine on the forums. Meanwhile us adaptable miners will switch to ganking them because they are so destructive to the game as a whole.