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First Impression of Faction Warfare -- post inferno patch

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X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#41 - 2012-05-25 16:13:08 UTC
BolsterBomb wrote:

How are you getting 10k comets? I thought you were at the same warzone control as us (tier 1) . What am I missing?

The clearly stated assumption w.r.t baseline LP payouts.
Axl Borlara
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#42 - 2012-05-25 16:18:10 UTC
Cearain wrote:

And I am not done yet. I still have allot more stuff to move around and *allot* more logistics to do to get ships into the new base. This sort of shuffling work makes me dread signing on the game. Being a casual player I know I will never base out of the faction war zone again. Not unless ccp removes this no docking rule and gives some assurance they won’t implement it again.


I'm a casual player and even though I'm on the opposing side, I have a similar problem.

This change has focused the war and created front lines where most of the action is.
These front lines can, and will, move. That will create lots of logistic issues, as you point out.
And that's what was needed - an incentive to fight!

Yes, I find myself away from the current front line and will have to deal with that to get fights. And that's just what I'll do.

Quote:

The no docking rule is a real detriment to being able to get pvp frequently. It forces people to take more time with every reship and take more time with logistic crap. It's just a bad idea that was tacked on to what was otherwise well thought out changes.


The no docking rule is a vital part of why this new system works.
It puts me at a disadvantage right now too, but I'll adapt.

Quote:

Moreover fighting in plexes is a real pain when you can't repair rat damage except by going a few jumps out and coming back. (or using alts. yes there are options but none of them are good)


Erm, why can't you (or a fleet mate) fit reps? You don't have to dock up somewhere to repair.

Quote:

As far as the 16x multiplier yes it makes the losing sides lp pretty much worthless. But so long as there is no lp for defensive plexing I think the tides may turn.


That will be one of the balances, I think.
We have lots more plexes to defend, gaining no lp for doing it. Plus putting the lp we do get into upgrades.
You gain lp from the abundance of plexes you have to choose from. Blink

And of course, we all now gain lp from shooting each other. \o/
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#43 - 2012-05-25 16:18:50 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
It seems the increase in pew vastly outweighs the costs in reshipping (so far).
Emphasizing that cost associated with not being able to reship is acknowledged. Also emphasizing the cost is less than the benefit of the 14 other things CCP has implemented.

Geez, have some fun and quit nitpicking game design. You have the fights you've always claimed you've wanted for the past 3 years. Enjoy them while you can.



I'm trying to in between trying move all my crap out of the war zone. With 2 pvp characters that I purposely spread fit ships and modules out throughout the zone it is not so easy. I don't have a carrier alt.

Of course your side of the war is not 59 systems to 11 so you don't understand, but keep pretending amarr are just "nitpicking."

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#44 - 2012-05-25 16:22:40 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Of course your side of the war is not 59 systems to 11 so you don't understand, but keep pretending amarr are just "nitpicking."
I just want to emphasize that I am sayin YOU are nitpicking, not the Amarr. Big smile There are several Amarr corporations still based in low sec (Kamela, Sahtogas), as well as the hordes of Amarr in Eggelhende. It doesn't look like they will e kicked out any time soon.
Wenron
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2012-05-25 16:23:22 UTC
Cearain wrote:


This will work if all the people with research agents are dumb and don't have their research alts getting the amarr datacores. How long do you think that will last?



Not sure. I am also not sure of the effect of the R&D datacore changes. Time will play that out. I still think that the majority of cores will come from FW which may be able to dictate prices and take the R&D alts for a free ride on the market curve.

Frankly though, I have no data to back up the gut feeling that more datacores will be made available from FW. I am also assuming that any research alts will be wise enough to realize when their faction has to pay increased LP for cores.

I do feel that the LP rewards swinging from the currently dominant faction is a great idea; however, I am not sure that it provides adequate incentive for the faction on the short end of the stick. Being impoverished with a lack of resources is quite realistic, but I wonder that it may discourage some from joining a faction, or worse, encourage others to drop out of FW.
Axl Borlara
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#46 - 2012-05-25 16:25:12 UTC
Cearain wrote:

I'm trying to in between trying move all my crap out of the war zone. With 2 pvp characters that I purposely spread fit ships and modules out throughout the zone it is not so easy. I don't have a carrier alt.


Both sides will be trying to ship their stuff to (or possibly away from) the front lines, whereever they may be.
And that provides more targets (and a different play style) for everyone.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#47 - 2012-05-25 16:28:57 UTC
Axl Borlara wrote:
Cearain wrote:

And I am not done yet. I still have allot more stuff to move around and *allot* more logistics to do to get ships into the new base. This sort of shuffling work makes me dread signing on the game. Being a casual player I know I will never base out of the faction war zone again. Not unless ccp removes this no docking rule and gives some assurance they won’t implement it again.


I'm a casual player and even though I'm on the opposing side, I have a similar problem.

This change has focused the war and created front lines where most of the action is.
These front lines can, and will, move. That will create lots of logistic issues, as you point out.
And that's what was needed - an incentive to fight!


We have lots of incentives to fight under this new system. There is no need to create logistical issues to get pvp, or create mechanics where all the fighting only takes place in a few systems.

Axl Borlara wrote:

Yes, I find myself away from the current front line and will have to deal with that to get fights. And that's just what I'll do.


Good for you. If you are happy to be a space hauler I won't knock it. Its just not why I sign on.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#48 - 2012-05-25 16:32:04 UTC
Axl Borlara wrote:
Cearain wrote:

I'm trying to in between trying move all my crap out of the war zone. With 2 pvp characters that I purposely spread fit ships and modules out throughout the zone it is not so easy. I don't have a carrier alt.


Both sides will be trying to ship their stuff to (or possibly away from) the front lines, whereever they may be.
And that provides more targets (and a different play style) for everyone.



Yes it will. I am not a big fan of camping stations looking for haulers. Nor am I a big fan of hauling **** around. But if that is your thing then yes you will like the no docking rule. People like different things.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#49 - 2012-05-25 16:32:15 UTC
Lets hope that the "winning" side doesn't get board waiting for the gangs to actually get something good together, while trying to shift their ships on a flooded market :)

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
BolsterBomb
Perkone
Caldari State
#50 - 2012-05-25 16:33:25 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Axl Borlara wrote:
Cearain wrote:

And I am not done yet. I still have allot more stuff to move around and *allot* more logistics to do to get ships into the new base. This sort of shuffling work makes me dread signing on the game. Being a casual player I know I will never base out of the faction war zone again. Not unless ccp removes this no docking rule and gives some assurance they won’t implement it again.


I'm a casual player and even though I'm on the opposing side, I have a similar problem.

This change has focused the war and created front lines where most of the action is.
These front lines can, and will, move. That will create lots of logistic issues, as you point out.
And that's what was needed - an incentive to fight!


We have lots of incentives to fight under this new system. There is no need to create logistical issues to get pvp, or create mechanics where all the fighting only takes place in a few systems.

Axl Borlara wrote:

Yes, I find myself away from the current front line and will have to deal with that to get fights. And that's just what I'll do.


Good for you. If you are happy to be a space hauler I won't knock it. Its just not why I sign on.



Im not sure how Amaar works, but up here in Caldari space I can go into almost any system and get a 3 man fight. If I go into the main system areas yes blobs occur, but I usally go 6-15 jump in fw and always get a fight.

Logistics, shouldve thought about moving your stuff prior patch and if you really dont want to haul. Black Frog 40m

Brig General of The Caldari State

"Don" Bolsterbomb

Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#51 - 2012-05-25 16:35:45 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Of course your side of the war is not 59 systems to 11 so you don't understand, but keep pretending amarr are just "nitpicking."
I just want to emphasize that I am sayin YOU are nitpicking, not the Amarr. Big smile There are several Amarr corporations still based in low sec (Kamela, Sahtogas), as well as the hordes of Amarr in Eggelhende. It doesn't look like they will e kicked out any time soon.


FYI Eggelhende is out of the war zone. So those hordes have already been kicked out. As for the others I guess it will depend on what you mean by "anytime soon."

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#52 - 2012-05-25 16:42:17 UTC
BolsterBomb wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Axl Borlara wrote:
Cearain wrote:

And I am not done yet. I still have allot more stuff to move around and *allot* more logistics to do to get ships into the new base. This sort of shuffling work makes me dread signing on the game. Being a casual player I know I will never base out of the faction war zone again. Not unless ccp removes this no docking rule and gives some assurance they won’t implement it again.


I'm a casual player and even though I'm on the opposing side, I have a similar problem.

This change has focused the war and created front lines where most of the action is.
These front lines can, and will, move. That will create lots of logistic issues, as you point out.
And that's what was needed - an incentive to fight!


We have lots of incentives to fight under this new system. There is no need to create logistical issues to get pvp, or create mechanics where all the fighting only takes place in a few systems.

Axl Borlara wrote:

Yes, I find myself away from the current front line and will have to deal with that to get fights. And that's just what I'll do.


Good for you. If you are happy to be a space hauler I won't knock it. Its just not why I sign on.



Im not sure how Amaar works, but up here in Caldari space I can go into almost any system and get a 3 man fight. If I go into the main system areas yes blobs occur, but I usally go 6-15 jump in fw and always get a fight.

Logistics, shouldve thought about moving your stuff prior patch and if you really dont want to haul. Black Frog 40m


It is similar here in amarr. Early on with this patch we have been getting allot of pvp. The patch clearly did allot of great things and on the whole faction war is better.

There is really only one major problem with it. I am not just trying to be critical. But I am also stating my view that the station lockout is a major problem with this expansion.

Black frog - try contracting drugs. Also I have so much stuff in so many different systems I have no idea what its worth. Its just a ******* head ache.

Should have done it sooner? It would have been just as bad doing it then just as much as it is now.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#53 - 2012-05-25 16:43:02 UTC
Cearain wrote:


FYI Eggelhende is out of the war zone. So those hordes have already been kicked out. As for the others I guess it will depend on what you mean by "anytime soon."
Do any players based in Kamela and Sahtogas care to respond to this post? How long until you guys think you'll get kicked?

And it seems to me that Eggelhende is a great place to base out of. My corp did so last year and had no trouble reshipping since it's right next to the front lines of the fighting.
BolsterBomb
Perkone
Caldari State
#54 - 2012-05-25 16:45:42 UTC



So your bad planning doesn't make the patch bad it makes your situation bad. Your fault you didnt think about the logistics prior to patch. There is a 2 week long forum post about your view on station lockout. Theres no excuse you can make no saying "I cant get my stuff out" You knew about it and were a big proponent against it.

Brig General of The Caldari State

"Don" Bolsterbomb

Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#55 - 2012-05-25 16:45:45 UTC
Axl Borlara wrote:
Cearain wrote:


Moreover fighting in plexes is a real pain when you can't repair rat damage except by going a few jumps out and coming back. (or using alts. yes there are options but none of them are good)


Erm, why can't you (or a fleet mate) fit reps? You don't have to dock up somewhere to repair.



Well if I wanted to roll with a pve fit I would do that. But I would like to get some pvp without having to gimp my ship.

Axl Borlara wrote:
[
Quote:

As far as the 16x multiplier yes it makes the losing sides lp pretty much worthless. But so long as there is no lp for defensive plexing I think the tides may turn.


That will be one of the balances, I think.
We have lots more plexes to defend, gaining no lp for doing it. Plus putting the lp we do get into upgrades.
You gain lp from the abundance of plexes you have to choose from. Blink

And of course, we all now gain lp from shooting each other. \o/




Yes both get the same lp for the same types of ships but your lp is several times more valuable than mine.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#56 - 2012-05-25 16:51:37 UTC
BolsterBomb wrote:



So your bad planning doesn't make the patch bad it makes your situation bad. Your fault you didnt think about the logistics prior to patch. There is a 2 week long forum post about your view on station lockout. Theres no excuse you can make no saying "I cant get my stuff out" You knew about it and were a big proponent against it.



Oh I thought about it. And I took measures so I can get my stuff out. It just meant that I couldn't pvp as much.

I don't really like spending my time on eve hauling **** around. Its a tedious pain in the ass. If you like doing that, then certainly you will like the no docking rule.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Axl Borlara
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#57 - 2012-05-25 16:55:29 UTC
Cearain wrote:

Yes both get the same lp for the same types of ships but your lp is several times more valuable than mine.


Our stuff is cheaper, but you have the opportunity to get more (spendable) lp, as I posted.

To be honest, you are sounding like you are whining because things changed and you can't carry on the same way you used to.
BolsterBomb
Perkone
Caldari State
#58 - 2012-05-25 16:55:54 UTC
Cearain wrote:
BolsterBomb wrote:



So your bad planning doesn't make the patch bad it makes your situation bad. Your fault you didnt think about the logistics prior to patch. There is a 2 week long forum post about your view on station lockout. Theres no excuse you can make no saying "I cant get my stuff out" You knew about it and were a big proponent against it.



Oh I thought about it. And I took measures so I can get my stuff out. It just meant that I couldn't pvp as much.

I don't really like spending my time on eve hauling **** around. Its a tedious pain in the ass. If you like doing that, then certainly you will like the no docking rule.



Again your poor planning doesnt make the patch crap it makes your planing crap. Its not about liking to haul its about being smart......

Anyway I am not going to keep saying the same thing over and over in reply to your post.

Brig General of The Caldari State

"Don" Bolsterbomb

Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation
Axl Borlara
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#59 - 2012-05-25 16:58:14 UTC
Oh, and in my opinion, whining is complaining about changes that are bad for YOU.
A more valid argument would be complaining about changes that are bad for the GAME as a whole, regardless of how they affect an individual.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#60 - 2012-05-25 17:03:20 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:


FYI Eggelhende is out of the war zone. So those hordes have already been kicked out. As for the others I guess it will depend on what you mean by "anytime soon."
Do any players based in Kamela and Sahtogas care to respond to this post? How long until you guys think you'll get kicked?

And it seems to me that Eggelhende is a great place to base out of. My corp did so last year and had no trouble reshipping since it's right next to the front lines of the fighting.



Sadly I anticipate both are kicked out in the next 4 months. Kamela has a better chance but I think the future is looking dim.

Eggelhende is close unless of course the kourm auga gate is camped. Its a regional gate but if you are trying to come back to the fight in anything larger than a dessie you may not make it back. The other way takes about 8 jumps.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815