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Additional 0.5% on Market orders
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AFK Hauler
State War Academy
#21 - 2012-05-22 20:59:52 UTC
From my understanding this is just a start to balance inflation.

More to come later to bring empire in line with nullsec.


Seems this "expansion" is the first step to eliminating empire space (as some may have it).

I'm not complaining on this one as it does not affect me too much (yet).
Mina Hiragi
Perkone
Caldari State
#22 - 2012-05-22 21:00:37 UTC
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
at the end I'm not sure this will move some isk from economy at all.


It will by virtue of game mechanics. ISK collected via market tax - regardless of any price increases by marketeers to cover it - disappears into the infernal regions of /dev/null. It's removed from the game; it's no longer in circulation.

Whether or not the tax increase can have any real effect against increasingly easy methods of bringing new ISK into the game, combined with player base expansion, is a matter I'll leave to people who enjoy calculators than I do.
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#23 - 2012-05-23 01:43:27 UTC
If you all think people are going to 'adjust their prices to reflect the new taxes' you are sorely mistaken.

Stuff will cost the same as it ever did, just there's a little bit more leaving the game by tax now

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION
Chokichi Ozuwara
Perkone
Caldari State
#24 - 2012-05-23 01:52:18 UTC
Savage Angel wrote:
If your cost of sale is up by .25%, raise your price by .25%. Not a difficult concept.

That's basically how taxes act IRL.

It's always funny to see consumers lobbying the government to tax businesses more, completely oblivious to the fact that higher taxes get passed along in higher prices.

Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round.
Venus Rinah
Arcanum Industry
#25 - 2012-05-23 01:56:33 UTC
This is pretty much how the I see the results of this change. The associated costs will be placed on the consumer, making the price of goods marginally more and although addressing some aspect of EvE inflation it doesn't identify the root of the problem which was originally associated with bounties.

I'm hoping CCP actually go after the real issues in the future instead of expecting the industrial base to foot the bill for problems caused elsewhere in the system.
Zleon Leigh
#26 - 2012-05-23 18:33:14 UTC
CCP needs either comment on this change or dev blog it. This is a major change in the economy - and it was just about stealthed in.

Incarna - Newest business example of mismanaged capital. CCP - Continuing to gank independent PI producers every day

PvP's latest  incentive program ** Unified Inventory **  'Cause you gotta kill something after trying to use it
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#27 - 2012-05-23 18:37:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Par'Gellen wrote:
I would have much rather them reduced bounties a bit like one of the devs mentioned in an interview rather than slam us with a higher market tax


They did.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Pak Narhoo
Splinter Foundation
#28 - 2012-05-23 18:56:15 UTC
Make PLEX have an expiration date after which they can no longer be traded on the markets/ contracts but only exchanged for ISK with CCP at a set lower value.

End of PLEX hoarding,. End of PLEX hoarders playing the markets. Gets rid of the extra money fast.

Best isk sink I can come up with.



Then again I'm not an economist. Big smile
Zleon Leigh
#29 - 2012-05-23 19:18:52 UTC
Pak Narhoo wrote:
Make PLEX have an expiration date after which they can no longer be traded on the markets/ contracts but only exchanged for ISK with CCP at a set lower value.

End of PLEX hoarding,. End of PLEX hoarders playing the markets. Gets rid of the extra money fast.

Best isk sink I can come up with.



Then again I'm not an economist. Big smile


That would be interesting.... 'Course that would be for only newly purchased PLEX.

Incarna - Newest business example of mismanaged capital. CCP - Continuing to gank independent PI producers every day

PvP's latest  incentive program ** Unified Inventory **  'Cause you gotta kill something after trying to use it
MadMuppet
Critical Mass Inc
#30 - 2012-05-23 19:25:04 UTC
Pak Narhoo wrote:
Make PLEX have an expiration date after which they can no longer be traded on the markets/ contracts but only exchanged for ISK with CCP at a set lower value.

End of PLEX hoarding,. End of PLEX hoarders playing the markets. Gets rid of the extra money fast.

Best isk sink I can come up with.



Then again I'm not an economist. Big smile




With the trading of PLEX on the market it is getting taxed each time it is traded at 1.5% (adjusted for skills). At 400,000,000 isk that is 6,000,000 isk going down the sink each time it is moved. There is no isk being 'created' with PLEX, only traded. So, rather than having the isk move from one player to the other, you would just have CCP materialize isk out of thin air to purchase the PLEX? That isn't a sink, it is a faucet.

This message brought to you by Experience(tm). When common sense fails you, experience will come to the rescue. Experience(tm) from the makers of CONCORD.

"If you are part of the problem, you will be nerfed." -MadMuppet
Faith O'Siras
Silhouette.
#31 - 2012-05-23 19:32:15 UTC
I'm not too personally bothered by this. It won't hurt my bottom line because I'll simply calculate this additional cost into the final sale. I won't lose any ISK over it. Twisted
Kiandoshia
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2012-05-23 19:43:06 UTC
Pok Nibin wrote:
Savage Angel wrote:
If your cost of sale is up by .25%, raise your price by .25%. Not a difficult concept.
It's the American way! Push your taxes onto your customers!


Show me a country where it is not done that way?
Par'Gellen
#33 - 2012-05-24 20:19:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Par'Gellen
Karl Hobb wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mudflation

The objective is to restore value to items through increased prices while at the same time removing ISK from the economy.

I understand the point. They are just going about it incorrectly. You do not increase the value of a currency by increasing taxes. That is like the absolute worst way to do it because it PROMOTES inflation in an economy that at this point has nearly unlimited currency. The only people this hurts are new players who have no to little isk. Older players like myself who only pay attention to market prices in as far as to make sure I'm not buying a shuttle for 50 million isk won't even notice.

I thought CCP had an economist on staff... I remember all the fanfare and hoopla when he was hired. Was he let go in the layoffs? If not and this was his idea did he suffer a massive stroke recently?

"To err is human", but it shouldn't be the company motto...
Drew Solaert
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2012-05-24 20:40:37 UTC
All I'm seeing in this thread is Par'Gellen not getting the point at all, despite the many good posts explaining why he is a tool, or his ability to add 0.25% to items.

And now using newbies as an excuse. Anyone else remember when a extra 15k bankrupted a newbie trying to afford a Vexor?

I lied :o
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#35 - 2012-05-24 20:46:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Athena
Savage Angel wrote:
If your cost of sale is up by .25%, raise your price by .25%. Not a difficult concept.

Traders and industrialists usually set prices to the current market price, not to some value representing a desired profit margin. After all, they get zero profit if the item does not sell.
Par'Gellen wrote:


I thought CCP had an economist on staff... I remember all the fanfare and hoopla when he was hired. Was he let go in the layoffs? If not and this was his idea did he suffer a massive stroke recently?

Hes still there. He gave a presentation at the last fanfest where he said there was too mush ISK in the eve economy asked what would be done about it, then stage whispered to everyone "fees and taxes".

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#36 - 2012-05-24 20:50:41 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Par'Gellen wrote:
I would have much rather them reduced bounties a bit like one of the devs mentioned in an interview rather than slam us with a higher market tax


They did.


They did not CCP increased bounties by adding Drone bounties
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
I Accidentally YourShip
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#37 - 2012-05-24 20:56:51 UTC
Tax is still too low.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#38 - 2012-05-24 20:57:46 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
Par'Gellen wrote:
Karl Hobb wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mudflation

The objective is to restore value to items through increased prices while at the same time removing ISK from the economy.

(snip)
I thought CCP had an economist on staff... I remember all the fanfare and hoopla when he was hired. Was he let go in the layoffs? If not and this was his idea did he suffer a massive stroke recently?


I recall Dr E was against nerf's and wanted additional sinks.
First thing CCCP did though was nerf Incursions ( curious if he'll show the chart of characters running Incursions before & after the Incursion nerf next fanfest like he did this year )

The tax increase he did seem to be in favor of but in a more dynamic way I recall.
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
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