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New Dev Blog: UI and I – Our Little Improvements Together V2

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CCP RedDawn
C C P
C C P Alliance
#181 - 2012-04-26 10:06:49 UTC
Am I last? Sad

Team Genesis
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#182 - 2012-04-26 10:12:16 UTC
CCP RedDawn wrote:
Am I last? Sad


Maybe, but not for now.
DrCrowley
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#183 - 2012-04-26 18:51:35 UTC
copy paste from V1


My suggestion:
Combat log save locally or be persistent.

Yesterday I got killed by another cruiser on my Caracal. I had 3 different missiles equipped so i wondered which did the most damage. I docked so I am not a sitting duck in space but the log was cleared and there is no way for me to see what happened to learn from it.
Elijah Craig
Trask Industries
#184 - 2012-04-27 13:14:50 UTC
All these changes to the Market screen and the Quickbar in particular are great.

HOWEVER:-

- Will I ever be able to Export my Quickbar settings / content?

I go through all these steps to fill out and customise and build my quickbar content, but on my other PC or Alt account..... its not there.

Can there be an "export / import quickbar" button at the botton next the "New Folder" and it spits out all the content to make it available for Importing on another account / PC?
minuseb
Rattini Tribe
Minmatar Fleet Alliance
#185 - 2012-04-27 15:45:58 UTC  |  Edited by: minuseb
DrCrowley wrote:
copy paste from V1


My suggestion:
Combat log save locally or be persistent.

Yesterday I got killed by another cruiser on my Caracal. I had 3 different missiles equipped so i wondered which did the most damage. I docked so I am not a sitting duck in space but the log was cleared and there is no way for me to see what happened to learn from it.


maybe i'm missing something but logs are saved in txt files, check your c:\users\xxxname\documents\eve\logs\gamelogs (where xxxname is the name of your user)

logs are named using date/time info and shouldnt be a problem to locate a particular log

also you can upload the logs to sites like this to interpret that info in a nicer way :)
http://eveboard.com/combat/
Zifrian
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#186 - 2012-04-27 17:23:28 UTC
Zifrian wrote:
Great changes. I still think little things like this are just as important as new features. The market highlight for my orders is such a simple but huge change to game play.

One of the things that seems to be missed in all of this is changes to the science and industry window. It hasn't been updated in years and I would really like to see some attention there.

Here's a list of simple changes I have suggested several times already but I think are really simple but very noticeable things that will improve the game in the same way as the list in this blog.


  • Show number of manufacturing and invention/research jobs available in the blueprints tab of science & industry - i.e. Change Max Manufacturing Jobs 10 to Remaining Manufacturing Jobs 4/10 (showing 4 jobs left)

  • Right click for any blueprint, only show options that are available for that type. Right now it shows all. I.e time research for a T1 BPC doesnt make sense. For example only show the following options for BPs:
    • T1 Copy - Manufacture and Invent
    T2 Copy - Manufacture
    T1 BPO - Manufacture, Copy, Material Research, Time Research
    T2 BPO - Manufacture, Copy, Material Research, Time Research
    T3 BPC - Manufacture
    Relic (not a BP but same issue) - Reverse Engineering

  • Manufacturing - Add an option to manufacturing for T2 BPC's to 'Manufacture All' that automatically populates the Runs button with the max runs for the BPC. I.e. 10 for most items

  • Inventing - Click Flow to allow more enter button selectiom, changes in bold: Right click, choose invent. CCP change - Highlight Pick Installation (Selecting OK doesn't make any sense here), double click select installation, CCP change - Highlight OK Button. CCP change - Highlight Accept Quote button

  • Manufacturing - Click Flow to allow more enter button selectiom, changes in bold: Right click, choose manufacturing. CCPchange - Highlight Pick Installation, double click select installation, CCP change - highlight OK Button

  • R.A.M. use - Change R.A.M.s to only need the number required after damage calculated instead of 1 for each run. I.e. right now, 1 ram takes 30% damage per run can be used 2 more times but game required 3 rams, not 1. (Or just get rid of them, what purpose do they serve anyway? Don't we already have enough extra components/items to add for T2 production?)

  • Only show industry slots at POS labs/arrays that are ONLINE


Hope that helps. And thanks again for the great work.

Can you please comment on the above or whether changes to the industry/S&I UI are even being considered?

Maximze your Industry Potential! - Download EVE Isk per Hour!

Import CCP's SDE - EVE SDE Database Builder
CCP karkur
C C P
C C P Alliance
#187 - 2012-04-27 21:49:16 UTC
Elijah Craig wrote:
All these changes to the Market screen and the Quickbar in particular are great.

HOWEVER:-

- Will I ever be able to Export my Quickbar settings / content?

I go through all these steps to fill out and customise and build my quickbar content, but on my other PC or Alt account..... its not there.

Can there be an "export / import quickbar" button at the botton next the "New Folder" and it spits out all the content to make it available for Importing on another account / PC?
to be honest, I want to add that... so maybe one day it will happenP but don't expect it soon because I don't really have that much time now to add it.

CCP karkur | Programmer | Team Five 0 | @CCP_karkur
CCP karkur
C C P
C C P Alliance
#188 - 2012-04-27 21:58:00 UTC
Zifrian wrote:
Can you please comment on the above or whether changes to the industry/S&I UI are even being considered?
I can't say that I've heard that changes to S&I are being planned, but I've heard some people express interest in updating the UI. There are some things in your list that should be fairly easy to change but could improve the experience a fair bit. I'll run through the list when I have some free time, and evaluate what it takes to change those things.

CCP karkur | Programmer | Team Five 0 | @CCP_karkur
CCP karkur
C C P
C C P Alliance
#189 - 2012-04-27 22:02:05 UTC
DrHeinz Doofenshmirtz wrote:
Could the Modules Variations be ordered by meta level and not by alphabetical order, for each 'Tech' level.

The alphabetical order is useless
-Modules don't follow strict naming conventions. some have apostrophes some don't and it makes the current sort break anyways.
ie: E500 Prototype Energy Vampire (why u no heavy)
Heavy 'Ghoul' Energy Siphon
Heavy 'Knave' ...
Heavy Diminishing ...
-There's not that many items for each subsection ("Tech") so really alphabetical order isn't needed.
Not really true for the officer section, still it would be more useful to know the meta level

If i have to find a Meta4 Variation i have to click show info on every single variation to find out which one is m4. If you think the alphabetical order is important then just add a meta level column, displaying the meta level right there for each module. I realize i could use compare, but it shouldn't be needed just to find out which version is the meta 4 one, compare is awesome but it's also slow.
good point, I'll add it to my list to check out P

CCP karkur | Programmer | Team Five 0 | @CCP_karkur
CCP karkur
C C P
C C P Alliance
#190 - 2012-04-27 22:30:06 UTC
Arsanovae wrote:
I actually liked having the tooltips. It helped me keep my desktop neater. Now I'll have to reconfigure my desktop. Unfortunately there is no way to scroll sideways in any window to see headings that are off-screen. And you can't move headings around. I can only reduce the size of the fixed heading which also reduces the information I get see. I can put the windows on top of one another but then there is a lot of up and down scrolling to see all the orders then. I want to see as much info as possible without scrolling.

Anyway, I for one would like to see tooltips back. One vote here. Thx for all the hard work btw. I especially like that I can mark my orders with a color. It's helpful.
I'm sorry, I think it's very unlikely that they are making a return in the market, as a lot of people where annoyed that the tooltip covered the info they were trying to see.

Maybe you don't want to let your windows overlap, but maybe something like this could work for you:
  1. make the wallet as narrow as possible
  2. make the market window a little bit wider than it´s now and place it on top the wallet (a little bit more to the right though) so all you can see in your wallet orders is the name of type
  3. as you want to work on the orders, double click them in the wallet to bring up the market details
  4. in the market window, see your order in blue, and how it compares to what others are offering, and make your changes from there.


just an idea P

CCP karkur | Programmer | Team Five 0 | @CCP_karkur
Elijah Craig
Trask Industries
#191 - 2012-04-27 22:47:16 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:
Elijah Craig wrote:
All these changes to the Market screen and the Quickbar in particular are great.

HOWEVER:-

- Will I ever be able to Export my Quickbar settings / content?

I go through all these steps to fill out and customise and build my quickbar content, but on my other PC or Alt account..... its not there.

Can there be an "export / import quickbar" button at the botton next the "New Folder" and it spits out all the content to make it available for Importing on another account / PC?
to be honest, I want to add that... so maybe one day it will happenP but don't expect it soon because I don't really have that much time now to add it.


That's great! That's all I needed to hear :-)

If it's on a back log, or a to do list, or is something you want to do, that's good enough for me for now. Cool

Thanks for taking the time to answer, I really hope to see an "export the quickbar" feature at some point in the future, so I can make the most of all this great functionality you have been adding to the market screen and quickbar.
Zifrian
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#192 - 2012-04-27 23:18:25 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:
Zifrian wrote:
Can you please comment on the above or whether changes to the industry/S&I UI are even being considered?
I can't say that I've heard that changes to S&I are being planned, but I've heard some people express interest in updating the UI. There are some things in your list that should be fairly easy to change but could improve the experience a fair bit. I'll run through the list when I have some free time, and evaluate what it takes to change those things.

Thank you! I think I speak for everyone who is an industrialist when I say that improving the S&I interface would be a huge improvement to the game and very appreciated.

Maximze your Industry Potential! - Download EVE Isk per Hour!

Import CCP's SDE - EVE SDE Database Builder
Seloena
Mighty Orca Inc
#193 - 2012-04-28 10:46:26 UTC
Maybe this is not for that topic, but someone mentioned about quickbar settings and I think this would be more than cool:

It would be great to be able to export all EvE settings to the server.

Steam platform have "Steam Cloud". Always when you leave the game it sends all the game settings to the server.
This allow me to use this settings no matter where I play. This also give me ability to get my settings back after I reinstall my system or game.

This would also prevent from situations like the last time, when you deleted all our settings.
I play eve on 2 machines. Creating overview settings, window positions and so on again when installing the client is annoying (i know i can copy the settings folder, but its additional work).

It could be done manually. Send config and restore it only if you need (and restore only the part you want to: f.e. only overview and market, but no graphics).
Such thing you can do in "Netbeans" editor :]

What do you think?

Kisses :*


p.s. Karkur, my dear. Unfortunately I post in old "U & I V1" topic, not here. Could you take a look when you will have little free time?
Creat Posudol
German Oldies
#194 - 2012-04-28 17:06:00 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:
I'm sorry, I think it's very unlikely that they are making a return in the market, as a lot of people where annoyed that the tooltip covered the info they were trying to see.

Maybe you don't want to let your windows overlap, but maybe something like this could work for you:
  1. make the wallet as narrow as possible
  2. make the market window a little bit wider than it´s now and place it on top the wallet (a little bit more to the right though) so all you can see in your wallet orders is the name of type
  3. as you want to work on the orders, double click them in the wallet to bring up the market details
  4. in the market window, see your order in blue, and how it compares to what others are offering, and make your changes from there.


just an idea P


Mock-up time! Made you a photoshop!

I have a suggestion about the "My Orders"-Window. It's not particularly optimized for smaller displays, and some arrangements aren't logical. Here is a screenshot (with some red highlights of unused space and actual display problems at small window sizes), and a mock-up of the screenshot, how it could look without much effort.
Original (Screenshot): http://postimage.org/image/sjik7minl/
Improved (Mock-up): http://postimage.org/image/k0kwirxvp/

The window in the screenshot has the minimal width possible for the window, that was the starting point.

I obviously didn't measure anything exactly (or bother aligning text or something like that), but you can clearly see that there is an extra column visible at almost exactly the same window width. The mock-up is only slightly higher by 30 pixels (if you crop the mock-up at the bottom, which I forgot). Obviously "Selling" and "Buying" are much wider than they are high, hence it saves a lot of space placing them above their respective tables.
Please note the rearranged statistics below the actual orders. Now all static values (derived directly from skills) are on the right, all dynamic values (order amount, ISK in escrow/sell/buy) on the left. The "Additional to cover" text is actually readable, being an extra line and all. There were 2 unused lines on one column previously, now there's only 1.
The only thing I didn't know where to put it was the "export" button, so it's at the top here, but I'm sure there's a better place for it somehow.
CCP karkur
C C P
C C P Alliance
#195 - 2012-04-28 17:24:59 UTC
Creat Posudol wrote:
Mock-up time! Made you a photoshop!

I have a suggestion about the "My Orders"-Window. It's not particularly optimized for smaller displays, and some arrangements aren't logical. Here is a screenshot (with some red highlights of unused space and actual display problems at small window sizes), and a mock-up of the screenshot, how it could look without much effort.
Original (Screenshot): http://postimage.org/image/sjik7minl/
Improved (Mock-up): http://postimage.org/image/k0kwirxvp/

The window in the screenshot has the minimal width possible for the window, that was the starting point.

I obviously didn't measure anything exactly (or bother aligning text or something like that), but you can clearly see that there is an extra column visible at almost exactly the same window width. The mock-up is only slightly higher by 30 pixels (if you crop the mock-up at the bottom, which I forgot). Obviously "Selling" and "Buying" are much wider than they are high, hence it saves a lot of space placing them above their respective tables.
Please note the rearranged statistics below the actual orders. Now all static values (derived directly from skills) are on the right, all dynamic values (order amount, ISK in escrow/sell/buy) on the left. The "Additional to cover" text is actually readable, being an extra line and all. There were 2 unused lines on one column previously, now there's only 1.
The only thing I didn't know where to put it was the "export" button, so it's at the top here, but I'm sure there's a better place for it somehow.
Yeah, you are right, there is a lot of wasted space there (I've already had a few conversations about it with my co-workers).

I don't think this would solve the issue with all the numbers at the bottom, and even if it magically worked for English, it probably wouldn''t work for all language. To be honest, when I get a defect on display issues there, my reply is that this just needs to be redesigned and it's not worth it to try to fix the overlapping.. but maybe we could move the "BUY"/"SELL" headers even though it does not fix the overlapping... I'll put it on my list of things to consider P

Thanks for taking the time to mock it up Smile
(the most natural place for the "export" button would be in a "bottom banner" like we have all over EVE)

CCP karkur | Programmer | Team Five 0 | @CCP_karkur
Sarina Berghil
New Zion Judge Advocate
#196 - 2012-04-28 17:57:49 UTC
Some very cool stuff, especially copying elements of a table.

But you really need to get over your occasional right-click fetish.

Quote:

Wouldn't it be wonderful if you could, say, have a right click option on the trace text at the top of the "Details" tab that made the "Browse" list magically open on the correct group? I thought so, so I made it so :P


No that would not be wonderful. But having a tiny button in the left top side of the tab that did the same thing would be wonderful. And there's plenty of room.

Right-click menus are not cool. They are a necessary evil when there are limited space for other UI elements. Since the market detail tab has plenty of spare room, hiding this options as a right-click is not a good idea. Especially because people wont notice it unless they know about it.
Salpun
Global Telstar Federation Offices
Masters of Flying Objects
#197 - 2012-04-28 18:18:26 UTC
Sarina Berghil wrote:

Right-click menus are not cool. They are a necessary evil when there are limited space for other UI elements. Since the market detail tab has plenty of spare room, hiding this options as a right-click is not a good idea. Especially because people wont notice it unless they know about it.

Just want to second this.

If i dont know something about EVE. I check https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/ISK_The_Guide

See you around the universe.
DrHeinz Doofenshmirtz
The Scope
#198 - 2012-04-28 18:44:34 UTC  |  Edited by: DrHeinz Doofenshmirtz
Just thought of something else that would totally be awesome.

Add the Optimal range and Accuracy FallOff of guns on their tooltip. When in space flying (on F1-F9), not on the fittings screen.
When you have 4 tracking computers and keep switching scripts and ammo it would really be usefull if it was displayed right there instead of having to dig though the full info panel.

Adding Missile range to the tooltip would totally be awesome aswell. I always thought it was weird that it was impossible to find out what range your missiles have with your current skills, short of shooting something and finding out when you don't do damage.

Thx for adding the previous suggestion to your list. Is my market suggestion not feasible or was it unclear what i meant ? :)
Seloena
Mighty Orca Inc
#199 - 2012-04-28 20:33:15 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:
Yeah, you are right, there is a lot of wasted space there (I've already had a few conversations about it with my co-workers).


1.
I have better idea. Take off this whole info. Not all, leave: orders count, escrow, buy and sell amounts. This 4 items are 100% of information marketer need everyday. No more, no less.

The rest of info which we need only from time to time could be under "overlib" when onmouseover (i) icon (prompt?), or ejected after clicking "more info" button.

This way you will get much more free space on the bottom - you could even put there separate info for corporation orders amount (why EVEMoon can have it and client not?)

2.
Second thing about BUY/SELL text -> remove it. It is needed only for new players. Put this text INSIDE this windows.
When new player enters orders window he will see 2 tables with BUY and SELL text inside.
After creating sell or buy order they will disappear (they are visible if no orders are set).

3.
I know my solutions are simple and always cool :P

4.
Karkur, you didn't answer on my last post :*

5.
Kisses for all :*
BeanBagKing
The Order of Atlas
#200 - 2012-04-28 20:40:43 UTC
Since this has turned into a suggestion thread I wanted to point out my idea for reducing another clickfest :)

It's linked so you can read the whole thing, but the short of it is a way to save fleet settings so that you can instantly recreate how a fleet is formed. Everything from the number of squads, squad names, free move, who it's open to, if it's hidden, etc can all be loaded from a save \o/