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question about stacking penalties
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Dreygun
Alexylva Paradox
#1 - 2012-04-16 11:31:45 UTC
So, I was curious if I have two tracking disruptors but one has the optimal range script and the other has the optimal tracking script, will they cause any stacking penalty to each other seeing as how they no longer affect the same stat?
Hayaishi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-04-16 11:32:42 UTC
Dreygun wrote:
So, I was curious if I have two tracking disruptors but one has the optimal range script and the other has the optimal tracking script, will they cause any stacking penalty to each other seeing as how they no longer affect the same stat?


They will not stack, no.
Dreygun
Alexylva Paradox
#3 - 2012-04-16 11:37:17 UTC
Hayaishi wrote:
Dreygun wrote:
So, I was curious if I have two tracking disruptors but one has the optimal range script and the other has the optimal tracking script, will they cause any stacking penalty to each other seeing as how they no longer affect the same stat?


They will not stack, no.



just to make sure I understand you correctly your are saying they wont trigger a penalty to each other?
Truespin
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-04-16 11:38:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Truespin
While we're at it, another question: do projected effect have a stacking penalty? Like having everyone in your fleet painting a frigate into the size of a titan.
Schalac
Apocalypse Reign
#5 - 2012-04-16 11:40:06 UTC
Dreygun wrote:
Hayaishi wrote:
Dreygun wrote:
So, I was curious if I have two tracking disruptors but one has the optimal range script and the other has the optimal tracking script, will they cause any stacking penalty to each other seeing as how they no longer affect the same stat?


They will not stack, no.



just to make sure I understand you correctly your are saying they wont trigger a penalty to each other?

They will cancel each other out and you are left with worse stats than if you just don't use scripts.

SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN!! http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schalac
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#6 - 2012-04-16 11:56:06 UTC
Schalac wrote:
Dreygun wrote:
Hayaishi wrote:
Dreygun wrote:
So, I was curious if I have two tracking disruptors but one has the optimal range script and the other has the optimal tracking script, will they cause any stacking penalty to each other seeing as how they no longer affect the same stat?


They will not stack, no.



just to make sure I understand you correctly your are saying they wont trigger a penalty to each other?

They will cancel each other out and you are left with worse stats than if you just don't use scripts.


FAIL

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Dreygun
Alexylva Paradox
#7 - 2012-04-16 12:58:30 UTC
why would they cancel each other out? dont scripts just apply the mod if i use one script on one mod and a different script on another mod why would they cancel each other out, is that just the way the system is designed?
non judgement
Without Fear
Flying Burning Ships Alliance
#8 - 2012-04-16 13:14:30 UTC  |  Edited by: non judgement
Truespin wrote:
While we're at it, another question: do projected effect have a stacking penalty? Like having everyone in your fleet painting a frigate into the size of a titan.

The effect has stacking penalty. The stacking penalty is from the point of view of the target. How many target painters are aimed at a target not how many target painters you have on your ship. There wont be much of a change after you have 6-7 target painters aimed at someone.

Whether disruption scripted gets a penalty, I'm not so sure... Could test it out and see if there is a change. I would believe that speed and range would be seen as two different disruption effects on a target with 2 separate stacking penalties.
Serene Repose
#9 - 2012-04-16 13:18:44 UTC
100%*(1-.4*1.0)(1-.4*.87)(1-.4*.57)

We must accommodate the idiocracy.
Schalac
Apocalypse Reign
#10 - 2012-04-16 13:26:51 UTC
War Kitten wrote:
Schalac wrote:
Dreygun wrote:
Hayaishi wrote:
Dreygun wrote:
So, I was curious if I have two tracking disruptors but one has the optimal range script and the other has the optimal tracking script, will they cause any stacking penalty to each other seeing as how they no longer affect the same stat?


They will not stack, no.



just to make sure I understand you correctly your are saying they wont trigger a penalty to each other?

They will cancel each other out and you are left with worse stats than if you just don't use scripts.


FAIL

Test it out for yourself. If you use opposing scripts in two of the same mod you will lose effectivness compared to just using two unscripted mods.

SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN!! http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schalac
Dreygun
Alexylva Paradox
#11 - 2012-04-16 13:41:43 UTC
[/quote] Test it out for yourself. If you use opposing scripts in two of the same mod you will lose effectivness compared to just using two unscripted mods. [/quote]


as in overall or just if they are both focused on the same target?

I have seen loadouts that got a lot of support on battle clinic that had 2 TDs one with each script, I assumed they could be used to disrupt two different target or be used in differrent situations, but I read on the evelopedia that staking penalties apply to the same effect and when u use these scripts they no longer have the same effects, so I was wondering if that meant you could use both on the same target and get the effect of full use of two TDs,

but even if that doesn't work it still would be nice to have for disrupting multiple targets in different situations, but are you saying that by simply equiping them they will both be screwed up?
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#12 - 2012-04-16 14:12:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Stacking penalties have slightly different effects on scripts depending on whether we're talking about positive or negative buffs. Not because of anything in the mechanics — just because the maths work out that way. It's compound interest all over again… P

You're quite right: those scripted modules will not penalise each other because they don't affect the same stats.

However, you'll commonly hear the comment that this also means they give less effect than if you run two unscripted modules but that only holds true for positive bonuses, not for negative ones, and the tracking disruptor is one of those negative effects.

Compare:

1). A module gives a two 25% bonuses; scripting two of them, each on one bonus, it doubles that, giving a total of 50% for both effects. Using the module twice, unscripted, means you get a 25% bonus from the first and a 25×0.87=21.75% bonus on the second one… which you multiply together: 1.25 × 1.2175 = 1.52% — a 52% bonus to both effects.

2) A module gives two -25% bonuses to different attributes; scripting two of them for one specific bonus each, gives you a total effect of -50% for both stats — the target ends up with 0.5× his normal value. Using the module twice, unscripted, means you get a -25% bonus from the first and a -21.75% from the second… which you once again multiply together: 0.75 × 0.7825 = 0.587 — a -41.3% bonus. Hell, even without a stacking penalty, you come off worse: -25% bonus applied twice gives you 0.75 × 0.75 = 0.5625, or a total bonus of just -43.75%.


So: positive bonus, run unscripted when using multiple modules against the same target. Negative bonus: run scripted (both times assuming the scripting bonus is 100% — should they ever introduce a script with a different meta-bonus, this might change).
Dreygun
Alexylva Paradox
#13 - 2012-04-16 14:57:10 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Stacking penalties have slightly different effects on scripts depending on whether we're talking about positive or negative buffs. Not because of anything in the mechanics — just because the maths work out that way. It's compound interest all over again… P

You're quite right: those scripted modules will not penalise each other because they don't affect the same stats.

However, you'll commonly hear the comment that this also means they give less effect than if you run two unscripted modules but that only holds true for positive bonuses, not for negative ones, and the tracking disruptor is one of those negative effects.

Compare:

1). A module gives a two 25% bonuses; scripting two of them, each on one bonus, it doubles that, giving a total of 50% for both effects. Using the module twice, unscripted, means you get a 25% bonus from the first and a 25×0.87=21.75% bonus on the second one… which you multiply together: 1.25 × 1.2175 = 1.52% — a 52% bonus to both effects.

2) A module gives two -25% bonuses to different attributes; scripting two of them for one specific bonus each, gives you a total effect of -50% for both stats — the target ends up with 0.5× his normal value. Using the module twice, unscripted, means you get a -25% bonus from the first and a -21.75% from the second… which you once again multiply together: 0.75 × 0.7825 = 0.587 — a -41.3% bonus. Hell, even without a stacking penalty, you come off worse: -25% bonus applied twice gives you 0.75 × 0.75 = 0.5625, or a total bonus of just -43.75%.


So: positive bonus, run unscripted when using multiple modules against the same target. Negative bonus: run scripted (both times assuming the scripting bonus is 100% — should they ever introduce a script with a different meta-bonus, this might change).



thanks very helpful good to know that