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so the hulk WTF CCP?!!?!?

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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#321 - 2012-04-11 18:42:40 UTC
Jojo Jackson wrote:
Why should I if I don't like it?
Because then you will no longer have to pick those hulks and industrials.
Quote:
And who tells you I wouldn't know how to?
Fair enough. It just comes as a conclusion from you apparently wanting to pick hulks and industrials, and your claim that you pick those because you're “too bad for real PvP”.

Adunh Slavy wrote:
@ Tip
The amount of complaints about its lack of survivability proves something as well.
Yes: that people don't know how to tank their ships, because once you start asking them about what's behind the complaints, that's always what comes out in the end. They want their ships to be more sturdy because they refuse to make them more sturdy themselves. They refuse to accept responsibility for their own decisions.

I don't see why their lack of intelligence, character, and forethought should in any way be rewarded. They can learn by their mistakes like everyone else, and if they don't, it's only right that they suffer the consequences of their poor decisions.

Quote:
And there are better ways to make a ship gank proof than fitting a tank, but I'll let you ponder that one, see if it'll drag you out of your black and white box of safe arguments.
So you're back to that straw man, eh? You're the one banging on about being “gank proof”, not me. I know how to make my hulk gank proof, and it has nothing to do with how I fit it. However, just like with the suggestion to actually fit a tank, people refuse to adopt those kinds of strategies as well because… well… just because, usually.
Jojo Jackson
Dead Red Eye
#322 - 2012-04-11 18:46:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Jojo Jackson
Darth Gustav wrote:
By your logic all battleship pilots would be fools to not see the epic gimpness of their mining capabilities.

Meanwhile, non-morons call this a "role" and accept it.

Then tell me why
[Rokh, New Setup 2]
4*Mining Laser Upgrade II
Co-Processor II

8*Miner II

3*Large Cargohold Optimization I

Mining Drone II x5
Hobgoblin II x5

is such a great mining ship. (1371 yield/min without gank bonis and implants)

[Hulk, New Setup 2]
2*Mining Laser Upgrade II

3*Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I

Mining Drone II x5

= 1749 yield/min without bonis and implants

Rohk = 38371 EHP without any modul
Hulk = 9217 EHP without any modul
~400 yield/min for ~29k EHP? bad trade!

Why the hell can't I fitt capital repairs or shield booster on an Orca ... it's an CAPITAL ship!
masternerdguy
Doomheim
#323 - 2012-04-11 18:48:28 UTC
Jojo Jackson wrote:
Darth Gustav wrote:
By your logic all battleship pilots would be fools to not see the epic gimpness of their mining capabilities.

Meanwhile, non-morons call this a "role" and accept it.

Then tell me why
[Rokh, New Setup 2]
4*Mining Laser Upgrade II
Co-Processor II

8*Miner II

3*Large Cargohold Optimization I

Mining Drone II x5
Hobgoblin II x5

is such a great mining ship. (1371 yield/min without gank bonis and implants)


I approve this message.

Things are only impossible until they are not.
Cloned S0ul
POCKOCMOC Inc.
#324 - 2012-04-11 18:49:11 UTC
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#325 - 2012-04-11 18:49:16 UTC
Jojo Jackson wrote:
Darth Gustav wrote:
By your logic all battleship pilots would be fools to not see the epic gimpness of their mining capabilities.

Meanwhile, non-morons call this a "role" and accept it.

Then tell me why
[Rokh, New Setup 2]
4*Mining Laser Upgrade II
Co-Processor II

8*Miner II

3*Large Cargohold Optimization I

Mining Drone II x5
Hobgoblin II x5

is such a great mining ship. (1371 yield/min without gank bonis and implants)

I used to get 799/min or some **** out of my Vexor, so what?

It's not "good" by Hulk pilots' standards and it can't mine ice. So what?

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
Roll Sizzle Beef
Space Mutiny
#326 - 2012-04-11 18:49:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Roll Sizzle Beef
All this is moot. After this summers war expansion. they said they will be looking specifically at the Harvesting mechanics of the game as they have concentrated on destruction for a long time. Then after Harvesting, the Crafting/industrial side. It was the circle of life in the EVE keynote.

The shear amount of possible changes simply to where and how you mine can increase survivability without touching the hull of the ship. Even UI changes quite possible in Inferno like sorting players by standings in local could avoid ganks without watcing D-can like a paranoid w-space dweller without the perk of munching on Arkanor while you do so.
Adunh Slavy
#327 - 2012-04-11 18:51:05 UTC
Tippia wrote:

Yes: that people don't know how to tank their ships, because once you start asking them about what's behind the complaints, that's always what comes out in the end. They want their ships to be more sturdy because they refuse to make them more sturdy themselves. They refuse to accept responsibility for their own decisions.

I don't see why their lack of intelligence, character, and forethought should in any way be rewarded. They can learn by their mistakes like everyone else, and if they don't, it's only right that they suffer the consequences of their poor decisions.


That must be a very comfortable little box. Maybe open the top and look outside from time to time.

Tippia wrote:

So you're back to that straw man, eh? You're the one banging on about being “gank proof”, not me. I know how to make my hulk gank proof, and it has nothing to do with how I fit it. However, just like with the suggestion to actually fit a tank, people refuse to adopt those kinds of strategies as well because… well… just because, usually.


LOL, the straw is yours and it looks just like you. I have not be "banging on" as you claim about 'gank proof' in your narrow little definition of fitting a tank.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Eternum Praetorian
Doomheim
#328 - 2012-04-11 18:53:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Eternum Praetorian
I would ignore Tippa, he is one of those people who does not understand that "my opinion" is not the same as "the only opinion" or "the truth" . It is in fact just another random person's opinion.




For more random opinions, see Tippa's rants

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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#329 - 2012-04-11 18:57:34 UTC
Jojo Jackson wrote:
That's not your point.

Your point: Don't buff our prefared eazy mode targets as we would lose more money while we do our anti sozial ganking.

No?
No. My point is: there is no reason to buff the Hulk just because people make bad decisions in how they choose to fit them. The solution to that “problem” is for people to stop making those bad decisions.

Quote:
Then enlight us with a true argument why BC size ships don't have the same starting values (slots, cpu, pg, other stats).
Most of them do, you know, so why would I argue against facts? You're also over-interpreting the meaning of slots and the meaning of size. Sure, a battlecruiser may have 7-8 highs for 6-7 weapons… because it needs 6-7 weapons to get its full gank on. A Hulk only needs 3 highs to get its full yield. If it's the number of slots that's bothering you then sure, double the number of highs on all barges and exhumers and cut the yield and fitting reqs of all strip miners in half. Problem solved.

Why don't all BC size ships have the same starting values? Because they are completely different ships.

Quote:
But why do they lose another 4 slots (mid+low)?
And why do they lose massive amounts of CPU and PG?
And why do they lose massive amounts of base defense? Hulk 7.374 base EHp v Claymore 20.657 base EHP .. BOTH ARE TECH 2 BC hulls and (should) be at the same price tack!
Because they don't need any more to fulfil their role. Same goes for the base hitpoints. A Hulk doesn't have the stats of a T2 battlecruiser because a Hulk isn't a T2 battlecruiser — it's a T2 mining barge. It's a completely different class of ship. They have nothing to do with each other. Nothing that applies to one is of any relevance to the other.
Jojo Jackson
Dead Red Eye
#330 - 2012-04-11 18:57:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Jojo Jackson
I REALY want to make my Hulk tanky ... it's just not posible :(

TECH II BATTLE CRUISER HULL

[Hulk, New Setup 2]
Damage Control II
Power Diagnostic System II

10MN MicroWarpdrive II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I

Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Core Defence Field Purger I


Mining Drone II x5

MISSING ~280 PG and ~35 CPU

And don't try to troll me this fit is fail as it's the most compareble to any PvP fitting for standart Tech 2 BC hulls
EXCEPT 4 MISSING SLOTS!

PS: now only ~150 yield/min as the Rohk and still not the same EHP as a Rohk WITHOUT defens mods

Why the hell can't I fitt capital repairs or shield booster on an Orca ... it's an CAPITAL ship!
Selinate
#331 - 2012-04-11 18:59:01 UTC
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
I would ignore Tippa, he is one of those people who does not understand that "my opinion" is not the same as "the only opinion" or "the truth" . It is in fact just another random person's opinion.




For more random opinions, see Tippa's rants


Still butthurt over the forum beating you got from Tippia, I see.

Go back to your corner.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#332 - 2012-04-11 18:59:29 UTC
Adunh Slavy wrote:
That must be a very comfortable little box. Maybe open the top and look outside from time to time.
I accept your surrender.

Quote:
LOL, the straw is yours and it looks just like you. I have not be "banging on" as you claim about 'gank proof' in your narrow little definition of fitting a tank.
…except that I never made any claim about how gtanks would make you gank proof — that's something you've dreamed up because you ran out of arguments and needed to invent something I never said so you could attack it.
EvilweaselFinance
GoonCorp
Goonswarm Federation
#333 - 2012-04-11 18:59:54 UTC
what the **** are you doing putting a mwd on a hulk
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#334 - 2012-04-11 19:01:19 UTC
EvilweaselFinance wrote:
what the **** are you doing putting a mwd on a hulk

It's just random modules and his claims of really trying hard, obviously?

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
EvilweaselFinance
GoonCorp
Goonswarm Federation
#335 - 2012-04-11 19:01:52 UTC
i should not be suprised considering you've never figured out an orca structure tanked but god almighty man
Adunh Slavy
#336 - 2012-04-11 19:04:31 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Adunh Slavy wrote:
That must be a very comfortable little box. Maybe open the top and look outside from time to time.
I accept your surrender.


I'm sure your ego will find whatever justification it needs.

Quote:
except that I never made any claim about how gtanks would make you gank proof — that's something you've dreamed up because you ran out of arguments and needed to invent something I never said so you could attack it.


Nor did I, keep screaming at that mirror, maybe one day you will convert even your self.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Jojo Jackson
Dead Red Eye
#337 - 2012-04-11 19:05:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Jojo Jackson
Darth Gustav wrote:
EvilweaselFinance wrote:
what the **** are you doing putting a mwd on a hulk

It's just random modules and his claims of really trying hard, obviously?

CFC forum troll 1
EvilweaselFinance wrote:
but seriously what the **** are you doing putting a mwd on a hulk

CFC forum troll 2

Your posts in here are : we want Hulkgeddon

I don't expect any real discussions with you 2.

Why the hell can't I fitt capital repairs or shield booster on an Orca ... it's an CAPITAL ship!
EvilweaselFinance
GoonCorp
Goonswarm Federation
#338 - 2012-04-11 19:06:53 UTC
i would be happy to discuss with you what the **** you are doing putting a mwd on a hulk please give me some insight here
Adunh Slavy
#339 - 2012-04-11 19:07:21 UTC
Jojo Jackson wrote:

I don't expect any real discussions with you 2.



Just block him, "hide posts", he's useless.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Jojo Jackson
Dead Red Eye
#340 - 2012-04-11 19:11:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Jojo Jackson
EvilweaselFinance wrote:
i would be happy to discuss with you what the **** you are doing putting a mwd on a hulk please give me some insight here

Jojo Jackson wrote:

EvilweaselFinance wrote:
what the **** are you doing putting a mwd on a hulk


Dude read the text:
"closest to common PvP ship fitting for standart tech 2 BC".

Do you ever saw a not-fail fit for Claymore, Sleibnir, Nighthawk WITHOUT MWD ?????????????


If you are unable to scroll up and find the reason.

But for god will remove the MWD and use a LSB
[Hulk, New Setup 2]
Damage Control II
Power Diagnostic System II

Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Booster II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I

Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Core Defence Field Purger I

Mining Drone II x5

still the same damn CPU+PG+CAP+CAP RECHARGE problems.

TECH II BATTLECRUISER compared to command ships !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why the hell can't I fitt capital repairs or shield booster on an Orca ... it's an CAPITAL ship!