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My Apology

First post First post
Author
Fenris Deka
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#1361 - 2012-03-27 09:09:11 UTC
Heimatar Auctioneer wrote:
orphenshadow wrote:
Markus Reese wrote:
orphenshadow wrote:
The arguments against those of us who still support The Mittani has resorted to.. "Oh your a goon/cfc member you are going to support him no matter what" is getting kind of old.

There are plenty of people in goonswarm and the cfc who are upset with what happened. The main difference is that we know the person behind the mistake. We know the character behind the persona that the rest of eve see's.

It's not some tin foil hat conspiracy.. We have no reason to want him off the CSM, and therefore no reason to close our minds and hearts to his sincere apology.


Question then for the goon organization then on the situation, seriously please. I myself feel the appology was well written. If not for the fact that real name was given. Majority of the people in this thread did not know that. His wife in other forums has expressed displeasure about it. Those are signs that it is serious and sentimental.

The question is about punishment. Understandably he is supported, I am sure it takes alot to keep the goons together. Honestly, I have no idea how from the outside view I get you guys keep it together. Something on the internal has to be doing it. But should there be, and would you guys agree with a reasonable punishment handed out. As a supporter, what do you feel if reasonable if yes. If no punishment, why not? Would no punishment be showing favoritizm or was there no violation of the rules?


I am not a member of Goons, So I cannot comment on how they are handling the situation internally. However, The man made a public apology, and willingly associated his real name with the situation. This will follow him around for the rest of his life. Not only that but he gave literally every isk he owned to the guy.

He is sorry for what he did and he feels shameful and regrets it. I do not think that he will do something like this again. I think that this is sufficient punishment for his action.


I don't think so. Look at how Mittani the Great singlehandedly destroyed all the years of his hard work, in a single day:

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/03/26/ccp-investigates-player-panel-that-encouraged-cyber-bullying/

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/116503-Eve-Online-Panel-Encourages-Harassing-Suicidal-Player

http://www.edge-online.com/news/ccp-launches-investigation-after-suicidal-player-mocked

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-03-26-ccp-launches-investigation-after-eve-online-fanfest-panel-accused-of-mocking-suicidal-player

If CCP shows leniency in Mittani the Great's action, it only tells the media that CCP completely supports cyber-bullying and a proponent of "player-assisted suicide." Surely, none of you want every non-EVE players to associate all of us as high school illiterate who cyber-bullies during free-time and supports bigotry remarks at anyone different than the usual crowd?

Mittani the Great should resign and save us the trouble of having CCP make the hard choice.


Dude, get over yourself. He didn't destroy anything, it's morons like you that made some stupid protest about something a drunk guy said. I could right now, go on youtube and show you many videos of drunk people saying some really dumb things, but would you make a protest over it, and send it to the media outlets? No you won't, because you won't get anything out of it, and you know that the mainstream media would laugh your stupid self out of their office or force you to hang up the phone.

None of you truly care about The Wis, you are only posting against Mittani for your own personal gain, whatever it is you think you are going to get out o fit. It's disgusting, and it only ruins people's real life because of it. You people are beyond disgusting.
brokentrader
Elysian Navy
#1362 - 2012-03-27 09:09:48 UTC
People need to harden up. Also if your mentally unstable FFS don't play this game.

If someone tells me on the internets he wants to kill himself, boo hoo he is gonna be mocked.

And if he does, who cares this world is way overpopulated and we got way bigger problems...

@Mittens, please do not step down!
David Cedarbridge
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
#1363 - 2012-03-27 09:10:41 UTC
Prince Kobol wrote:
Terminal Insanity wrote:
Prince Kobol wrote:
The Mittani was the person who first decided it would be funny to tell everybody about Wis.

No, he thought it would be funny to tell everyone in the internet videogame called Eve: Online.
Then some self-serving carebears decided to take that and post it to every game news website and force CCP into making public statements and acting all political.

If -any- of these people cared about The Wis they'd have left him alone. Instead, you took an insult that he didn't even know about, and used it to make him upset to prove your point that it was a 'mean' thing to say.

Yes it was a little mean if taken literally, but its also mean to go dragging that guy's personal life up in front of the cameras as your martyr.


There is the problem, he though it was funny.

At no point did he even consider the ramifications, the possible consequences. At no point did the thought entire his head

"hmm.. maybe taking the **** out of somebody who claims to be suicidal in front of thousands of people might be going a tad to far?"

Why do you think that CCP has a rule against posting kill mails, eve mails, private conversations for the sole purpose to mock and humiliate people?

Every decision in life we take has a consequence. It is up the individual to consider those consequences, in this instance he didn't which was unfortunate.

Also the remark about "but its also mean to go dragging that guy's personal life up in front of the cameras as your martyr" is hypercritical at best.

It was The Mittani who thought it would be funny to drag the guys personal life in front of the cameras, you can not then condemn others who are defending (what ever their motives) but not also condemning the Mittani as well.


This is a spectacular demonstration of the sort of proxy white knighting this thread is made out of. Not only is the so-called "victim" totally unmoved by the event, he was also totally out of the loop until somebody tracked him down to ask him about it. Additionally, the whole thing only has traction in the first place because people not even connected to the so-called victim got their panties in a bunch about a joke that could be considered in poor taste.

This is probably as good a time as any to point out. Any "bad press" that comes out of this, the community brought upon themselves. It is you, the Eve--0 badposter who is bringing upon EVE: The Game About Internet Spaceships all of this bad press as a part of a witch hunt where the only person who should care, really doesn't. Good work on the effort you put into sinking your own ship guys.
nestafarios
stooge in plain sight
#1364 - 2012-03-27 09:10:55 UTC
Welcome to the political arena, everything you say can and will be held against you; especially when it is aired for many to see, public speaking is an interesting thing, and sometimes what you say may have consequences.

A leader in a PUBLIC arena (and that is the issue) must be careful of his/her words and actions, because they are representing something larger than they are. Repercussions should follow the CSM guidelines what ever they may be.
Rico Minali
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1365 - 2012-03-27 09:11:29 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Rico Minali wrote:
Versuvius Marii wrote:
I've been drunk plenty of times. Not once have I turned around to anybody and told them that if their issues are that bad they should kill themselves.

Just sayin'.



Ive been drunk alot of times too, ive said some very bad things to people when drunk. Ive also gotten into fights and hurt people. It isnt big, it isnt clever, but its what happens when you put mind altering chemicals into your system. Anyone who says that being drunk doesnt make you do stupid things is either A: Lying, or B: Never been drunk.


Wow don't ever want you in my defense. That does not make it an excuse. You hurt ppl but thats ok because you where drunk What? F**k me ????


No, I quite clearly state that it ISNT ok. I am saying that what you do when drunk isnt what you do when you are not drunk, answering the people who are saying who you are when drunk is the real you.

You are right, you probably dont want me in your defense, I am not fond of defending stupid people.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.

Prince Kobol
#1366 - 2012-03-27 09:12:29 UTC
Fenris Deka wrote:
Prince Kobol wrote:
Terminal Insanity wrote:
Prince Kobol wrote:
The Mittani was the person who first decided it would be funny to tell everybody about Wis.

No, he thought it would be funny to tell everyone in the internet videogame called Eve: Online.
Then some self-serving carebears decided to take that and post it to every game news website and force CCP into making public statements and acting all political.

If -any- of these people cared about The Wis they'd have left him alone. Instead, you took an insult that he didn't even know about, and used it to make him upset to prove your point that it was a 'mean' thing to say.

Yes it was a little mean if taken literally, but its also mean to go dragging that guy's personal life up in front of the cameras as your martyr.


There is the problem, he though it was funny.

At no point did he even consider the ramifications, the possible consequences. At no point did the thought entire his head

"hmm.. maybe taking the **** out of somebody who claims to be suicidal in front of thousands of people might be going a tad to far?"

Why do you think that CCP has a rule against posting kill mails, eve mails, private conversations for the sole purpose to mock and humiliate people?

Every decision in life we take has a consequence. It is up the individual to consider those consequences, in this instance he didn't which was unfortunate.

Also the remark about "but its also mean to go dragging that guy's personal life up in front of the cameras as your martyr" is hypercritical at best.

It was The Mittani who thought it would be funny to drag the guys personal life in front of the cameras, you can not then condemn others who are defending (what ever their motives) but not also condemning the Mittani as well.


Really? Really dude?

He was merely posting mails he got from morons that got popped then wanted to get something out of it by sending the mail in the first place. The Wis didn't even remember sending it, or the fact that he was ganked, and didn't even care what Mitanni said, then didn't care even after reading about it and hearing about it.

The only people that care about this, are the people who took gross offense to what some dumb drunk guy said, and those of us defending the person he is, not what he said.



Your missing the point. Whether Wis is full of **** is not the issue and has never been the issue.

The issue is that he stood up front of thousands of people at a official CCP Event and mocked a person who was potentially suicidal.

I completely accept that the guy did a very dumb thing and that in real life he is not like that.

However as I said, there are consequences to every action you take.

If it wasn't an issue then none of the sites that reported on this would of cared. These sites don't don't give a **** what we think or what is said on the forum as far as they are concerned it was a case of a player driven panel at a official event that was encouraging Cyber Bullying.

Kai Tel
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1367 - 2012-03-27 09:14:29 UTC
*YAWN* At this point I am just waiting on work to end so I can go out, have dinner, and get laid. This **** goes on and on and on...
Professor Alphane
Zombie Surplus
Mildy Unprofessional
#1368 - 2012-03-27 09:16:24 UTC
orphenshadow wrote:
Professor Alphane wrote:
Also being drunk is no excuse

Alchohol just lowers your social inhabitions

Therefore this is what he really thinks but normaly wouldn't have the guts to say


I'm going to go out on a limb here..

I do not have sympathy for anyone who says they want to commit suicide. I think its a sign of weakness and a ploy for attention. If someone says that they are considering suicide then they by god better be serious. I think anyone who makes such a claim should be arrested and sent to a psychiatric ward. It's one of the things that pisses me off more than anything.

I have often thought that some of these people should just do it, instead of constantly talking about it and using it as a ploy for attention. But this is mostly a cynnical and sarcastic opinion and I would never dream of actually walking up to someone and telling them to do it.


My point is... I'm sure a lot of us have had similar opinions that we would never openly act on.

I do not for one second believe that he had any intention of actually trying to get someone to commit suicide. I think to him at that moment it was a dark and uncouth joke. Granted one that may or may not have had real life consequences. But it was said in jest none the less.

Anyone who is sitting at home thinking that Mittens would actually want to see someone do harm to themselves has obviously never spoken to him and probably does not know the type of person he actually is.

I think everyone deserves a chance at redemption.



Good luck out on that limb bud ... read your first sentence and ignored the rest

[center]YOU MUST THINK FIRST....[/center] [center]"I sit with the broken angels clutching at straws and nursing our scars.." - Marillion [/center] [center]The wise man watches the rise and fall of fools from afar[/center]

David Cedarbridge
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
#1369 - 2012-03-27 09:16:25 UTC
Terminal Insanity wrote:
Jake Warbird wrote:
Terminal Insanity wrote:
When i was in gradeschool, we were on a field trip. One of the students literally shat his pants and everyone saw it. Needless to say, there was many jokes about it.

Now, imagine if a teacher called an assembly, and dragged him up on stage and gave a huge lecture about bullying. Thats what you did to The Wis. You took his personal issues, and used it for your own self-serving purposes without even considering what he would want.

This is what Mittani did and encouraged other people to do as well.


No, was just in his class laughing and making fun of the situation. You can argue that it was childish, sure. But it was all of you mittani-hatersl who decided to give the lecture and turn it into cannon fodder to use against your enemies.

This might result in his entire REAL LIFE family/friends finding out about his situation and personal issues. There is also the possibility that he may have the police show up to check on his condition. If the police are unsure, they are forced to hold him for 72 hour suicide watch. What if he didn't want this? Did any of you ask The Wis what he thought before you started posting your crap to every game news site you could find? Nope.


Prince Kobol wrote:


There is the problem, he though it was funny.

At no point did he even consider the ramifications, the possible consequences. At no point did the thought entire his head

Perhaps you're right. I wont argue that you are wrong here.

But, my point is that YOU didnt consider the ramifications of YOUR actions ether. And infact, you made a far bigger scene and subjected The Wis to far many more people's ridicule then Mittani ever did.


I don't know how it is you think these events started or what your imagination is telling you about how this whole thing unfolded, but it certainly wasn't CFC members posting notices to Escapist and Massively about how horrible this guy was made fun of for claiming to be suicidal.
Avila Cracko
#1370 - 2012-03-27 09:17:38 UTC
Morphisat wrote:
Sentinel Mantik wrote:
I can't believe what is happening here...

As a person, I count the action of appologice from The Mittani. He may made the mistake to call out the name of the scam-victim CHAR, but he was drunk. I personaly normaly won't drink alkohol, especialy when i have to make a presentation (even if it is trolling at all) but i often see people do such things while they're drunk.
The char-name maybe could be changed... no one knows the real name of the player behind the char.

The facts I count:

- Mittens did a great Job as CSM 6 Chairmen
- over 10.000 people voted him for CSM 7
- Mittens made a mistake while drunk by calling the name
- Mittens apologiced for what he has done

I defenetly won't let one mistake be the turningpoint.

Who of you ever was so drunk that you said something that you wont have sad otherwise? Those please throw the first stone...


By this logic, every thing you do while drunk can be excused. What a load of crap. Evil



So when you cheat your wife while you drunk she only say "nothing until you say sorry"??? RollRollRoll

truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

brokentrader
Elysian Navy
#1371 - 2012-03-27 09:17:39 UTC  |  Edited by: brokentrader
Prince Kobol wrote:

The issue is that he stood up front of thousands of people at a official CCP Event and mocked a person who was potentially suicidal.



Yes, because when some anonymous dude on the internet claims to be suicidal, LETS ALL MAKE A BIG DEAL OUT OF IT.

Hell, I'm suicidal because my untanked hauler got ganked in jita, if CCP dont reimburse me I'm gonna kill myself.
David Cedarbridge
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
#1372 - 2012-03-27 09:17:52 UTC
Professor Alphane wrote:
read your first sentence and ignored the rest


Clearly posts are not meant to be read or understood. That would require critical thinking skills and the like.
Karim alRashid
Starboard.
#1373 - 2012-03-27 09:17:58 UTC
Prince Kobol wrote:

If it wasn't an issue then none of the sites that reported on this would of cared. These sites don't don't give a **** what we think or what is said on the forum as far as they are concerned it was a case of a player driven panel at a official event that was encouraging Cyber Bullying.



Oh, give me a break, the "journalistic" scum are always up for the "sensation", making up one if there aren't any readily available.

These sites don't give a flying **** what we think or what is said or about Mittens or about the allegedly suicidal dude, they care for the page visits and will blow out of proportion anything.

A dude's roleplaying bleeded into RL when he was drunk and made him say nasty things, boo-hoo, big news. At 11.

Pain is weakness leaving the body http://www.youtube.com/user/AlRashidKarim/videos

Singeabooty Raj
Doomheim
#1374 - 2012-03-27 09:18:05 UTC
David Cedarbridge wrote:
Singeabooty Raj wrote:

Edit: ~Snipe~


Its not a snipe if you edit your post to notice.

~~~Chill out Bro~~~

Black Man with Goggles

Ssakaa
Animatar Foundation
#1375 - 2012-03-27 09:18:46 UTC
Professor Alphane wrote:

Perhaps I don't know the American system but I used to live with a Barrister in England and I know how strict they can be


For practising barristers in England and Wales:-

You're quite right.

Note the above emphasis.

"Modern Life is Rubbish"

Clause VonDouche
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1376 - 2012-03-27 09:18:49 UTC
It is ok Alex, we forgive you and still love you. Hugs. My Chairman
Fenris Deka
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#1377 - 2012-03-27 09:19:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Fenris Deka
Kai Tel wrote:
*YAWN* At this point I am just waiting on work to end so I can go out, have dinner, and get laid. This **** goes on and on and on...


It'll be ignored in a few days anyway.

As for Prince Kobol:

They are only reporting on it because it's FanFest and they have nothing else to report on, so they are winging with this. The people calling this cyber bullying are idiots and have no idea what cyber bullying really is. There has been less back lash at a Senator using a racial slur than there has with what Mittani stated.

CCP doesn't need to do anything at all, at worst administratively ban him, and have a sober alliance panel next year. Why they were not moderated anyway is beyond me. It's CCP's fault that this even went down, they had no regulations put in place, and it wasn't moderated very well at all. The CCP guy standing there had no control over it because 90% of the panelists were drunk off their ass.

If any of you morons are going to blame anyone, blame CCP for allowing this to happen. Apologies were made, the topic should be dead. All you guys are doing is beating a dead horse to dust.
Professor Alphane
Zombie Surplus
Mildy Unprofessional
#1378 - 2012-03-27 09:20:06 UTC
David Cedarbridge wrote:
Professor Alphane wrote:
read your first sentence and ignored the rest


Clearly posts are not meant to be read or understood. That would require critical thinking skills and the like.


Why bother when the guy proves himslf an ass in the first sentence

To me thats like saying.. I have no sympathy for those who have cancer

Suicidal tendencies are an illness in the same way.

Why bother listening when he already proved he has nothing real or relevant ot say

[center]YOU MUST THINK FIRST....[/center] [center]"I sit with the broken angels clutching at straws and nursing our scars.." - Marillion [/center] [center]The wise man watches the rise and fall of fools from afar[/center]

Versuvius Marii
Browncoats of Persephone
#1379 - 2012-03-27 09:20:47 UTC
Maybe somebody should make a drunken Youtube video as an apology while singing Lady Gaga. If he's drunk then perhaps he means it, amirite? Plus can't get much lower than singing that.

Deadly serious btw. Get drunk, make the vid.

The Gaming MoD - retro to modern, console to MMO, I blog about it if it's a game and I'm interested in it. Yes, I play games other than Eve and I don't care if you think I'm wrong.

Professor Alphane
Zombie Surplus
Mildy Unprofessional
#1380 - 2012-03-27 09:21:20 UTC
Ssakaa wrote:
Professor Alphane wrote:

Perhaps I don't know the American system but I used to live with a Barrister in England and I know how strict they can be


For practising barristers in England and Wales:-

You're quite right.

Note the above emphasis.



I'm sure you are the relevant authority to tell me that ..... we will see what the relevant association make of it

[center]YOU MUST THINK FIRST....[/center] [center]"I sit with the broken angels clutching at straws and nursing our scars.." - Marillion [/center] [center]The wise man watches the rise and fall of fools from afar[/center]