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My Apology

First post First post
Author
David Cedarbridge
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
#1341 - 2012-03-27 08:57:48 UTC  |  Edited by: David Cedarbridge
Singeabooty Raj wrote:

Edit: ~Snipe~


Its not a snipe if you edit your post to notice.
Il Feytid
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1342 - 2012-03-27 08:58:37 UTC
Sentinel Mantik wrote:
I can't believe what is happening here...

As a person, I count the action of appologice from The Mittani. He may made the mistake to call out the name of the scam-victim CHAR, but he was drunk. I personaly normaly won't drink alkohol, especialy when i have to make a presentation (even if it is trolling at all) but i often see people do such things while they're drunk.
The char-name maybe could be changed... no one knows the real name of the player behind the char.

The facts I count:

- Mittens did a great Job as CSM 6 Chairmen
- over 10.000 people voted him for CSM 7
- Mittens made a mistake while drunk by calling the name
- Mittens apologiced for what he has done

I defenetly won't let one mistake be the turningpoint.

Who of you ever was so drunk that you said something that you wont have sad otherwise? Those please throw the first stone...


So he was drunk when putting the slide show together with Vile Rat before fanfest?
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1343 - 2012-03-27 08:58:53 UTC
Terminal Insanity wrote:
When i was in gradeschool, we were on a field trip. One of the students literally shat his pants and everyone saw it. Needless to say, there was many jokes about it.

Now, imagine if a teacher called an assembly, and dragged him up on stage and gave a huge lecture about bullying. Thats what you did to The Wis. You took his personal issues, and used it for your own self-serving purposes without even considering what he would want.

This is what Mittani did and encouraged other people to do as well.
Professor Alphane
Zombie Surplus
Mildy Unprofessional
#1344 - 2012-03-27 08:58:55 UTC
Fenris Deka wrote:
Professor Alphane wrote:
tiberiusric wrote:
Professor Alphane wrote:
A question M

do you as an ex lawyer beleieve you could be charged with the reckless endangerment of life?

Thereis No way he was ever a real practising lawyer.. No way...


Theres no way he will be again most likely when his bar association heres of his conduct


Your speculation is hilarious, you literally have no idea what you are posting about.



Oh these bodies take very seriously anyone who would bring the body into public disrepute.

Perhaps I don't know the American system but I used to live with a Barrister in England and I know how strict they can be

[center]YOU MUST THINK FIRST....[/center] [center]"I sit with the broken angels clutching at straws and nursing our scars.." - Marillion [/center] [center]The wise man watches the rise and fall of fools from afar[/center]

Lexmana
#1345 - 2012-03-27 09:00:22 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
So he was drunk when putting the slide show together with Vile Rat before fanfest?

What was the problem with the slideshow again? Ohh, yes, and unnamed players eve mail was shown to the audience.
David Cedarbridge
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
#1346 - 2012-03-27 09:00:40 UTC
Professor Alphane wrote:
tiberiusric wrote:
Professor Alphane wrote:
A question M

do you as an ex lawyer beleieve you could be charged with the reckless endangerment of life?

Thereis No way he was ever a real practising lawyer.. No way...


Theres no way he will be again most likely when his bar association heres of his conduct


1) If your posting is any sort of benchmark for the report given to the Bar then I doubt they'll even give it time of day
2) He's not actively practicing
3) You literally have no idea how the Bar Association works. This isn't a shock since you don't have to take the exam in order to be an Internet Lawyer
HazardsSoul
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1347 - 2012-03-27 09:01:07 UTC
tiberiusric wrote:
Professor Alphane wrote:
A question M

do you as an ex lawyer beleieve you could be charged with the reckless endangerment of life?

Thereis No way he was ever a real practising lawyer.. No way...

you would be suprised what people do for a living outside of the world of eve...
Sasha Khaine
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1348 - 2012-03-27 09:01:14 UTC
Terminal Insanity wrote:
When i was in gradeschool, we were on a field trip. One of the students literally shat his pants and everyone saw it. Needless to say, there was many jokes about it.

Now, imagine if a teacher called an assembly, and dragged him up on stage and gave a huge lecture about bullying. Thats what you did to The Wis. You took his personal issues, and used it for your own self-serving purposes without even considering what he would want.


It was you wasn't it mate :P

But seriously if you are looking at it from that perspective, imagine if a senior prefect came along and told everyone to make fun of him more up to the point where he would want to kill himself. That is what mittens did to wis.

[center]"The entire British empire was built on cups of tea... and if you think I'm going to war without one mate. You're mistaken."[/center]

killorbekilled TBE
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1349 - 2012-03-27 09:01:40 UTC
the way i see it is that he made a complete idiot of himself, his own mistake and he has since apologized for his mistake both to the allegedly suicidal gamer and the eve community for attracting negative press

on the upside the negative press hes attracted is still press at the end of the day

and ultimately a good thing for attracting new players to game ?

:)

Prince Kobol
#1350 - 2012-03-27 09:01:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Prince Kobol
Terminal Insanity wrote:
Prince Kobol wrote:
The Mittani was the person who first decided it would be funny to tell everybody about Wis.

No, he thought it would be funny to tell everyone in the internet videogame called Eve: Online.
Then some self-serving carebears decided to take that and post it to every game news website and force CCP into making public statements and acting all political.

If -any- of these people cared about The Wis they'd have left him alone. Instead, you took an insult that he didn't even know about, and used it to make him upset to prove your point that it was a 'mean' thing to say.

Yes it was a little mean if taken literally, but its also mean to go dragging that guy's personal life up in front of the cameras as your martyr.


There is the problem, he though it was funny.

At no point did he even consider the ramifications, the possible consequences. At no point did the thought entire his head

"hmm.. maybe taking the **** out of somebody who claims to be suicidal in front of thousands of people might be going a tad to far?"

Why do you think that CCP has a rule against posting kill mails, eve mails, private conversations for the sole purpose to mock and humiliate people?

Every decision in life we take has a consequence. It is up the individual to consider those consequences, in this instance he didn't which was unfortunate.

Also the remark about "but its also mean to go dragging that guy's personal life up in front of the cameras as your martyr" is hypercritical at best.

It was The Mittani who thought it would be funny to drag the guys personal life in front of the cameras, you can not then condemn others who are defending (what ever their motives) but not also condemning the Mittani as well.

Do I think that Alex is some evil bastard in real life, no I don't. Do I think he deserves to have his name all over the internet associated with Cyber Bulling, not at all.

However CCP now have a duty to prove to everybody both outside and inside the game that they take this very seriously and by not punishing him it will show that they don't.
Morphisat
Millard Innovation Inc
The 20 Minuters
#1351 - 2012-03-27 09:02:49 UTC
Sentinel Mantik wrote:
I can't believe what is happening here...

As a person, I count the action of appologice from The Mittani. He may made the mistake to call out the name of the scam-victim CHAR, but he was drunk. I personaly normaly won't drink alkohol, especialy when i have to make a presentation (even if it is trolling at all) but i often see people do such things while they're drunk.
The char-name maybe could be changed... no one knows the real name of the player behind the char.

The facts I count:

- Mittens did a great Job as CSM 6 Chairmen
- over 10.000 people voted him for CSM 7
- Mittens made a mistake while drunk by calling the name
- Mittens apologiced for what he has done

I defenetly won't let one mistake be the turningpoint.

Who of you ever was so drunk that you said something that you wont have sad otherwise? Those please throw the first stone...


By this logic, every thing you do while drunk can be excused. What a load of crap. Evil
Zuju
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1352 - 2012-03-27 09:03:17 UTC
Mittens i damn well voted for you, don't quit.

The drama on the other hand has been relatively entertaining, especially as the guy himself cares little.
Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#1353 - 2012-03-27 09:04:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Terminal Insanity
Jake Warbird wrote:
Terminal Insanity wrote:
When i was in gradeschool, we were on a field trip. One of the students literally shat his pants and everyone saw it. Needless to say, there was many jokes about it.

Now, imagine if a teacher called an assembly, and dragged him up on stage and gave a huge lecture about bullying. Thats what you did to The Wis. You took his personal issues, and used it for your own self-serving purposes without even considering what he would want.

This is what Mittani did and encouraged other people to do as well.


No, was just in his class laughing and making fun of the situation. You can argue that it was childish, sure. But it was all of you mittani-hatersl who decided to give the lecture and turn it into cannon fodder to use against your enemies.

This might result in his entire REAL LIFE family/friends finding out about his situation and personal issues. There is also the possibility that he may have the police show up to check on his condition. If the police are unsure, they are forced to hold him for 72 hour suicide watch. What if he didn't want this? Did any of you ask The Wis what he thought before you started posting your crap to every game news site you could find? Nope.


Prince Kobol wrote:


There is the problem, he though it was funny.

At no point did he even consider the ramifications, the possible consequences. At no point did the thought entire his head

Perhaps you're right. I wont argue that you are wrong here.

But, my point is that YOU didnt consider the ramifications of YOUR actions ether. And infact, you made a far bigger scene and subjected The Wis to far many more people's ridicule then Mittani ever did.

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP

Sasha Khaine
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1354 - 2012-03-27 09:04:09 UTC
killorbekilled TBE wrote:
the way i see it is that he made a complete idiot of himself, his own mistake and he has since apologized for his mistake both to the allegedly suicidal gamer and the eve community for attracting negative press

on the upside the negative press hes attracted is still press at the end of the day

and ultimately a good thing for attracting new players to game ?



In the rare case that any publicity is good publicity, this isn't one of them.

[center]"The entire British empire was built on cups of tea... and if you think I'm going to war without one mate. You're mistaken."[/center]

Fenris Deka
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#1355 - 2012-03-27 09:04:55 UTC
Prince Kobol wrote:
Terminal Insanity wrote:
Prince Kobol wrote:
The Mittani was the person who first decided it would be funny to tell everybody about Wis.

No, he thought it would be funny to tell everyone in the internet videogame called Eve: Online.
Then some self-serving carebears decided to take that and post it to every game news website and force CCP into making public statements and acting all political.

If -any- of these people cared about The Wis they'd have left him alone. Instead, you took an insult that he didn't even know about, and used it to make him upset to prove your point that it was a 'mean' thing to say.

Yes it was a little mean if taken literally, but its also mean to go dragging that guy's personal life up in front of the cameras as your martyr.


There is the problem, he though it was funny.

At no point did he even consider the ramifications, the possible consequences. At no point did the thought entire his head

"hmm.. maybe taking the **** out of somebody who claims to be suicidal in front of thousands of people might be going a tad to far?"

Why do you think that CCP has a rule against posting kill mails, eve mails, private conversations for the sole purpose to mock and humiliate people?

Every decision in life we take has a consequence. It is up the individual to consider those consequences, in this instance he didn't which was unfortunate.

Also the remark about "but its also mean to go dragging that guy's personal life up in front of the cameras as your martyr" is hypercritical at best.

It was The Mittani who thought it would be funny to drag the guys personal life in front of the cameras, you can not then condemn others who are defending (what ever their motives) but not also condemning the Mittani as well.


Really? Really dude?

He was merely posting mails he got from morons that got popped then wanted to get something out of it by sending the mail in the first place. The Wis didn't even remember sending it, or the fact that he was ganked, and didn't even care what Mitanni said, then didn't care even after reading about it and hearing about it.

The only people that care about this, are the people who took gross offense to what some dumb drunk guy said, and those of us defending the person he is, not what he said.
Heimatar Auctioneer
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#1356 - 2012-03-27 09:06:05 UTC
orphenshadow wrote:
Markus Reese wrote:
orphenshadow wrote:
The arguments against those of us who still support The Mittani has resorted to.. "Oh your a goon/cfc member you are going to support him no matter what" is getting kind of old.

There are plenty of people in goonswarm and the cfc who are upset with what happened. The main difference is that we know the person behind the mistake. We know the character behind the persona that the rest of eve see's.

It's not some tin foil hat conspiracy.. We have no reason to want him off the CSM, and therefore no reason to close our minds and hearts to his sincere apology.


Question then for the goon organization then on the situation, seriously please. I myself feel the appology was well written. If not for the fact that real name was given. Majority of the people in this thread did not know that. His wife in other forums has expressed displeasure about it. Those are signs that it is serious and sentimental.

The question is about punishment. Understandably he is supported, I am sure it takes alot to keep the goons together. Honestly, I have no idea how from the outside view I get you guys keep it together. Something on the internal has to be doing it. But should there be, and would you guys agree with a reasonable punishment handed out. As a supporter, what do you feel if reasonable if yes. If no punishment, why not? Would no punishment be showing favoritizm or was there no violation of the rules?


I am not a member of Goons, So I cannot comment on how they are handling the situation internally. However, The man made a public apology, and willingly associated his real name with the situation. This will follow him around for the rest of his life. Not only that but he gave literally every isk he owned to the guy.

He is sorry for what he did and he feels shameful and regrets it. I do not think that he will do something like this again. I think that this is sufficient punishment for his action.


I don't think so. Look at how Mittani the Great singlehandedly destroyed all the years of his hard work, in a single day:

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/03/26/ccp-investigates-player-panel-that-encouraged-cyber-bullying/

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/116503-Eve-Online-Panel-Encourages-Harassing-Suicidal-Player

http://www.edge-online.com/news/ccp-launches-investigation-after-suicidal-player-mocked

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-03-26-ccp-launches-investigation-after-eve-online-fanfest-panel-accused-of-mocking-suicidal-player

If CCP shows leniency in Mittani the Great's action, it only tells the media that CCP completely supports cyber-bullying and a proponent of "player-assisted suicide." Surely, none of you want every non-EVE players to associate all of us as high school illiterate who cyber-bullies during free-time and supports bigotry remarks at anyone different than the usual crowd?

Mittani the Great should resign and save us the trouble of having CCP make the hard choice.
Sendo Jarix
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1357 - 2012-03-27 09:06:36 UTC
Prince Kobol wrote:


Why do you think that CCP has a rule against posting kill mails, eve mails, private conversations for the sole purpose to mock and humiliate people?


You do realise CCP prescreened all the slide show presentations and gave the ok for the material to be shown right ?
Berke Negri
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1358 - 2012-03-27 09:06:43 UTC
Prince Kobol wrote:

Why do you think that CCP has a rule against posting kill mails, eve mails, private conversations for the sole purpose to mock and humiliate people?

you uh, new to eve or something?
Sentinel Mantik
Second Star
Cheese Party
#1359 - 2012-03-27 09:06:47 UTC
Terminal Insanity wrote:

No, was just in his class laughing and making fun of the situation. You can argue that it was childish, sure. But it was all of you mittani-hatersl who decided to give the lecture and turn it into cannon fodder to use against your enemies.

This might result in his entire REAL LIFE family/friends finding out about his situation and personal issues. There is also the possibility that he may have the police show up to check on his condition. If the police are unsure, they are forced to hold him for 72 hour suicide watch. What if he didn't want this? Did any of you ask The Wis what he thought before you started posting your crap to every game news site you could find? Nope.


totaly agree

Minmatar 4 life

German player.

orphenshadow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1360 - 2012-03-27 09:07:11 UTC
Professor Alphane wrote:
Also being drunk is no excuse

Alchohol just lowers your social inhabitions

Therefore this is what he really thinks but normaly wouldn't have the guts to say


I'm going to go out on a limb here..

I do not have sympathy for anyone who says they want to commit suicide. I think its a sign of weakness and a ploy for attention. If someone says that they are considering suicide then they by god better be serious. I think anyone who makes such a claim should be arrested and sent to a psychiatric ward. It's one of the things that pisses me off more than anything.

I have often thought that some of these people should just do it, instead of constantly talking about it and using it as a ploy for attention. But this is mostly a cynnical and sarcastic opinion and I would never dream of actually walking up to someone and telling them to do it.


My point is... I'm sure a lot of us have had similar opinions that we would never openly act on.

I do not for one second believe that he had any intention of actually trying to get someone to commit suicide. I think to him at that moment it was a dark and uncouth joke. Granted one that may or may not have had real life consequences. But it was said in jest none the less.

Anyone who is sitting at home thinking that Mittens would actually want to see someone do harm to themselves has obviously never spoken to him and probably does not know the type of person he actually is.

I think everyone deserves a chance at redemption.