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Incoming titan adjustments

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Sybaun
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1781 - 2012-03-14 19:20:55 UTC
FeLiZk wrote:
GeneralDisturbed wrote:
FeLiZk wrote:
GeneralDisturbed wrote:
It is refreshing to see at least one titan blobber willing to come in and admit that they saw a pretty good subcap fight in progress and thought "Man we should just drop supers all over that". You know, risk/reward or whatever.


If there is a tactical structure we are in defending or attacking, and it looks like there is a chance we will lose it off cause we have. Just like you bring another full fleet.

I don't recall off hand a time where we have not been outnumbered, where we have brought Titans to a straight up fight.


So what you're saying is, if there's a chance you'll lose a strategic objective, you drop titans. So you win. Sort of like an "Iwin" button you might say. Huh.


No more then 250 fleet on top would be.

And no one is preventing you from doing the same, as mittanie stated you have one of the biggest ones.


Please stop posting and watch this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=aR62HsSBggs#t=23s
The Mittani
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1782 - 2012-03-14 19:21:02 UTC
Daiony wrote:
The Mittani wrote:
FeLiZk wrote:
On a side note I think it is so funny Goons are complaining about being blobbed, what is not funny is CCP is listening.

Change Titans by all means but don't do it for them. And don't rush it for them.


You yourself are to blame; you and your fellows refuse to accept responsibility for your own misbehavior. Typical.


So you are saying that using titans against subcaps was an exploit then? Otherwise your post makes no sense. Everything that was done was well within the rules CCP implemented. You chose not to use your supercapitals in a scenario where they would be at risk. Thats your choice. It doesn't mean that it was the only right thing to do. Why didn't you use all the tools available to you? Instead you chose not to use them and vote for a nerf so the other evil guys can't use them against you.

People do want titans to be changed, but not like this. This is a half assed ****** patchjob that looks rushed and tailored towards goons playstyle. That is the problem people have with it. Why rush a "surgical fix" (lol) like this out now? It's not like it couldn't wait till CCP thought out a proper solution to the WHOLE problem that are supercaps and sov warfare.

To me it looks like CCP is panicking here for no apparent reason.

CCP should take their time and act like professionals. Do a fix, but do it right, and not some piece of **** rushjob.


The nerfs happen now because you - hiding behind a NPC alt - couldn't control yourselves, like a glutton at an all-you-can-eat Vegas buffet, even going so far as to blap CCP's own subcaps.

You can make all the excuses you want, but that just goes to show your own lack of restraint - the very inability to accept responsibility that has brought about this situation.

You ask why this has happened? The answer is written all over your own post.

~hi~
Quest Liem
Doomheim
#1783 - 2012-03-14 19:21:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Quest Liem
Ser Berus wrote:




only so many ways to point out that this isn't how a multiplayer sandbox game works, and there are fabulous opportunities for cancelling your account and playing something that's better suited for your obsessive need of goodfites.


Like wise to you to sir, You wined and CCP is adjusting the Titans, you could have just unsubscribed and found a better game to get you good fights as well. Instead you did not and complained to CCP about it.
Scooter McCabe
Thunderwaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#1784 - 2012-03-14 19:21:48 UTC
Quest Liem wrote:
Scooter McCabe wrote:
Quest Liem wrote:
I believe in it is a definite imbalance if one group can field more people then the other. We play this game to be fair and have fun, how fun is it to be outnumbered 50 to 1? Not very, in the best interest of this game CCP should come up with a way to limit the number of combatants in a signal system. I mean we do need to be fair and give someone s sporting chance.


So you want to penalize alliances that have a better culture in terms of attracting players and getting them to show up for fleet fights. Sorry CCP cannot upgrade your personality.



How is that penalizing any alliance? We are making the game more enjoyable for both. You enjoy the game by out numbering your opponent? Is not that not an I win button? I am bring issues that would make the game more fair to everyone who pays to play the game. A 30 on 30 fight is a lot more enjoyable then something like 300 on 50. Do you not agree?


I absolutely disagree if a fleet of 50 decided to take on a fleet of 300 either roaming around or headed to a fleet fight, that's just poor fcing. If its a corp of 50 that found itself in a war with a corp of 300, that's poor diplomacy and planning. Now if a fleet of 50 can perform hit and run tactics on the field and that 300 loses heart, hides in station or doesn't log, that is just delicious tears. Now if a group of 50 has essentially half its players in Titans able to do the job of 20 ships per titan then that group of 300 is in the unfair position by your standard.

If you are so worried for smaller groups looking to get a chance in null sec why don't you ask CCP to double the size of null sec? It promises to break some power blocs and at the very least these power blocs can't hold all that space. Hey do you think that if there was more space people in Hi Sec think they might have a chance out in Null and that might make the game exciting and attractive to new players. Really what do you think is better a broken kill anything ship that makes a few RMTing Emo space nerds happy or more null sec systems to allow new blood to come in and help drive game content?
Bagehi
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1785 - 2012-03-14 19:22:51 UTC
The Mittani wrote:
asdf ghyj wrote:
Dear CCP if do this nerf then gief back to all pilots titan skills cuz we spend 5 bil for skill and 100 bils = for titan and wasting like 3 month + for make skill AND NOW WE CANT USE THIS SHIP cuz this MITANI not have skill and isk to take titan

MR MITANI go play PREPELIX ONLINE and stop cry to CCP cuz u guys (goon) cant fly titans

OR MAKE SERVER FOR GOONS AND LET US PLAY FAIR
And CCp what prefer to have 6-7k players( goons) or 60k players ??????
Think before do wrong changes


I fly an Erebus, and have one of the largest Titan fleets in the galaxy.

The hard fact is that the fault lies with the people who used Titans to annihilate subcaps en masse, and then had the poor judgement to laugh about it, congratulate themselves, and keep doing it. If RDN, NCdot and PL hadn't gone whole-hog abusing an obviously broken mechanic, this nerf would have never happened.

They may tell themselves that the inarguable imbalance of blapping titans was a sign of their 'skill' or 'superiority' - the same excuses offered forth throughout the history of the Titan, justifying Remote Doomsdays, AoE Doomsdays, etc etc. The same old guard players, the same old guard excuses, the same old-guard entitlement.

Ultimately, the nemesis of titans was the poor impulse control of their own pilots - the inability, when faced with what amounted to a free bar, not to drink themselves into blundering violence and to assault the other guests.
Darth Tickles
Doomheim
#1786 - 2012-03-14 19:23:01 UTC
The absolute best part of all this:

Who the **** do you think is going to have the unstoppable titan fleet in approximately 6 months under current mechanics, in addition to their current subcap superiority?

So dumb...so gd dumb.
Swearte Widfarend
Ever Vigilant Fountain Defenders
#1787 - 2012-03-14 19:23:41 UTC
Nao Oikawasan wrote:
Swearte Widfarend wrote:
This supposed change will do little to the nullsec battlefield. It will do little to skilled players with Titans who understand game mechanics. It will do nothing to Titan proliferation (743 as of this morning's capital tweet). The smart thing to do is to actually fix them, give them a place or pull them from the game, refund Titan-related skill points and the ship's mineral value in ISK to the pilots.


Why, in god's name, do you people believe that anyone deserves skillpoints and ISK because the faulty game mechanic, that you've been abusing for so long, has been fixed? You've had a good old time wrecking dramiels and rifters. We've all laughed on comms about these killmails and how absolutely ridiculous they are!
You've plopped your fat asses into the systems with 2000 actual pilots duking it out and whored untold numbers of killmails without a single worry as to being killed.
I think you've been given enough. No need for refunds.


I'm just going to try using logic instead of rage, I know that's hard for some people.

CCP has historically refunded skillpoints, and/or ISK value of skill books, when removing them from the game. Historically this has been an accepted practice (see Learning Skills or Connections Skills).

If the ship is to be removed, the modules should be put in the nearest NPC station, and the equivalent of the raw materials to build the ship in the same station. BPOs should be refunded at market prices. I know balance means nothing to you, but someone actually did something to acquire the ISK and/or minerals for the ship and/or blueprints. I don't think it's wise to give ISK value of the ship, because that's subject to crazy market manipulation. Of course, mineral value is as well, but in the volume we are talking about (750 titans worth of minerals at least) I think it is the best course. The former Titan pilot could then utilize those materials for acquiring ships that are still in game and can be flown, and still have all the modules that are useable on other ships.

Mind you, I'm not saying this is the right solution. But if CCP can't be bothered to fix a broken ship for FOUR YEARS maybe the should just admit they were wrong rather than pretend to put a bandaid on a sucking chest wound. If they can't figure out what role a Titan should have in this game, get rid of them.

Democracy is only as good as the despot managing the voting booth.
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1788 - 2012-03-14 19:24:50 UTC
The Mittani wrote:
FeLiZk wrote:
On a side note I think it is so funny Goons are complaining about being blobbed, what is not funny is CCP is listening.

Change Titans by all means but don't do it for them. And don't rush it for them.


You yourself are to blame; you and your fellows refuse to accept responsibility for your own misbehavior. Typical.

Would also please tell Greyscale to balance the blob when you are having beers with him next time?
mkd0815
no members required
#1789 - 2012-03-14 19:26:08 UTC
i can only say this is a bad fix.

i have no clue how a fix that wrong happened to get online . where is your QA department ?
Scooter McCabe
Thunderwaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#1790 - 2012-03-14 19:29:05 UTC
mkd0815 wrote:
i can only say this is a bad fix.

i have no clue how a fix that wrong happened to get online . where is your QA department ?


Okay why was it a bad fix? Let's hear some good analytic reasons.
Blawrf McTaggart
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1791 - 2012-03-14 19:29:20 UTC
mkd0815 wrote:
i can only say this is a bad fix.

i have no clue how a fix that wrong happened to get online . where is your QA department ?


You've only yourselves to blame for it.
Audax Rarnikwar
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1792 - 2012-03-14 19:31:04 UTC
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=12512955

Yes, my moving pod got hit and killed by a titan. I probably ****** up my transversal, my own fault.
Dovinian
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#1793 - 2012-03-14 19:31:43 UTC
When TEST grows up we might have some Titans someday.

Then when we have superior subcap numbers AND more Titans, suddenly it'd just be more complaints from the other side. Fix Titans now, make a better EVE for everyone.

I am Dovinian, and this is my stance on the matter. Dovinian for CSM7 because I have no idea what the **** I'm doing.
The Mittani
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1794 - 2012-03-14 19:31:47 UTC
John Maynard Keynes wrote:
The Mittani wrote:
FeLiZk wrote:
On a side note I think it is so funny Goons are complaining about being blobbed, what is not funny is CCP is listening.

Change Titans by all means but don't do it for them. And don't rush it for them.


You yourself are to blame; you and your fellows refuse to accept responsibility for your own misbehavior. Typical.

Would also please tell Greyscale to balance the blob when you are having beers with him next time?


Greyscale and I can't stand each other. And he doesn't drink.

I'm sorry that you - hiding, ashamed, behind the anonymity of an npc alt - are unwilling to face up to your own comeuppance.

This is happening because of your misdeeds, your obvious culpability. And you're hiding behind straw men and trying - desperately so! - to deflect the consequences of your actions.

You blapped, and now you got blapped. Perhaps if you hadn't misused Titans in the first place, this nerf wouldn't have had to happen.

~hi~
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1795 - 2012-03-14 19:32:19 UTC
it was a bad fix as it does not implement the Final Solution to the supercap question
deyaneira
#1796 - 2012-03-14 19:32:48 UTC
To all:

This change makes well balance of game mechanics and engagements. I think this is the start of what a real fight space is. Titans will still be UBER ships, but their role wil now be used more properly. Get over it.
Sentinel Eeex
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1797 - 2012-03-14 19:34:57 UTC
FeLiZk wrote:
Andski wrote:
FeLiZk wrote:
Better to restart the server, would that be fair enough for you.

Risk / Reward anyone ever heard this concept, thought it was what this game was suppose to be based on.


Yes you risk all of your titans when you drop them en masse ahahah


Every time we drop them we risk
-Counter drop (trap)
-One bumped titan (thanks for that one CCP)
-Disconnect

And yes we risk all of them, it only takes one very bad day and we lose them all in one go ask RA.

You might not think this, but there are times that we don't use them because the risks involved.



Hahahahahahahahaha.
Bagehi
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1798 - 2012-03-14 19:35:33 UTC
mkd0815 wrote:
i can only say this is a bad fix.

i have no clue how a fix that wrong happened to get online . where is your QA department ?


The problem is the scan res / weapon sig / sig radius thing isn't properly weighted. It is made all the more obvious by changing titan scan res to 5. The difference in lock time for a cruiser and a dread isn't remotely enough. The same can be said for the guns as the lock times. The underlying mechanics need to be worked on.

That said, titans needed a nerf. In the tradition of CCP nerfs, this one was a bit over the top and off the mark.
The Mittani
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1799 - 2012-03-14 19:35:42 UTC
They hide these behind NPC alts because they don't dare show their faces; they know they have abused a broken mechanic and are unwilling to own up to their misdeeds. Their altposting is a scarlet letter of their shame, an admission of guilt.

They can't accept adult responsibility; they threw their toys around, misbehaved, and now their toys are being taken away. Alas!

~hi~
Daiony
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1800 - 2012-03-14 19:36:41 UTC
The Mittani wrote:
Daiony wrote:
The Mittani wrote:
FeLiZk wrote:
On a side note I think it is so funny Goons are complaining about being blobbed, what is not funny is CCP is listening.

Change Titans by all means but don't do it for them. And don't rush it for them.


You yourself are to blame; you and your fellows refuse to accept responsibility for your own misbehavior. Typical.


So you are saying that using titans against subcaps was an exploit then? Otherwise your post makes no sense. Everything that was done was well within the rules CCP implemented. You chose not to use your supercapitals in a scenario where they would be at risk. Thats your choice. It doesn't mean that it was the only right thing to do. Why didn't you use all the tools available to you? Instead you chose not to use them and vote for a nerf so the other evil guys can't use them against you.

People do want titans to be changed, but not like this. This is a half assed ****** patchjob that looks rushed and tailored towards goons playstyle. That is the problem people have with it. Why rush a "surgical fix" (lol) like this out now? It's not like it couldn't wait till CCP thought out a proper solution to the WHOLE problem that are supercaps and sov warfare.

To me it looks like CCP is panicking here for no apparent reason.

CCP should take their time and act like professionals. Do a fix, but do it right, and not some piece of **** rushjob.


The nerfs happen now because you - hiding behind a NPC alt - couldn't control yourselves, like a glutton at an all-you-can-eat Vegas buffet, even going so far as to blap CCP's own subcaps.

You can make all the excuses you want, but that just goes to show your own lack of restraint - the very inability to accept responsibility that has brought about this situation.

You ask why this has happened? The answer is written all over your own post.


Because the honorable mittani and the goons are a role model for moral integrity and aloofness. Please, get over yourself.
Look at the whole picture from a non biased standpoint and even you will have to acknowledge that this "fix" is ****, halfassed. It doesn't matter where anyone touched your subcapitals. The very concept of this adjustment is wrong. They should do it right the first time, not rush some crap out and alienate one part of the playerbase.

Try to be objective for once.