EVE General Discussion

would say this in time maybe ccp might do give areas as safe zones dont hold your breath companys normally change thigs when revenue drops.

if you are being ganked then need to change the fittings of ships, the pros and veterns on here will help you with that .

you could allways form a fleet and go after them if they have small amount of members , this can help you no end to a point if they know you fleet up they be more carefull , so it help you in the long run .

can be wads of fun in a fleet on comms and if you go after them can give them a bloddy nose ,after all some who war dec are after easy kills . in a fleet they have no easy kills .

i like wars now me third war and learning so much from them and the fun to be had , you could allways join a alliance who have pvp corps so to help you with wars and go learn with them .

wish you well .

Easy to determine who are the gankers IRL - the scammers who target you via your mobile and take your entire life savings (from reading the paper just today - IRL! ). EVE is nicer - the gankers cannot kill you, only set yuou back some.

Remember when Rodenberry started - the love in that was the 60's. Look where we are 50+ years later and see where Corprate greed has gotten us - hence why we can choose to make/join Corporations in EVE.

---

After I wrote what I did last night I did determine what would would be an apt analogy for EVE IRL.....

It's the apocryphal/archetype of the 'English Public School' where the teachers remain beholden to the priviledged parents of the even more priviledged children they try and teach:

- High Sec is the classroom where there is a semblance of control, where the teachers/CONCORD can punish only partly after the event

- Low Sec is the playground where bullies can roam, and the teachers/CONCORD just take note

- and Null Sec is what happens in the dormitories when the lights go out........

Jog on. EvE is a PvP game.

People who think it should be playable without interaction from other players just don't understand what they're talking about.

HTFU and other such mockery.

Yeah, people need to stop posting that since all it does is prove that CCP isn't very good at data analysis. That survey wasn't even conducted and or verified by a neutral 3rd party.

Supposedly that survey was done on 80,000 new players who were only 15 days old. They were checked for deaths within that time frame and if any of those new players were killed, CCP then checked their attackers record to see if they were killed by Concord. Then CCP placed those 80,000 new players into 3 different groups - illegally killed, legally killed and not killed. Then they looked at player retention for each group.

According to their survey, 85.5% were not killed, 13.5% were legally killed (Wardec, limited engagement, etc) and 1% were illegally killed (Ganked). No stats were presented for player retention in the game, just a statement that "People who die play longer". Supposedly players in the 1% ganked group were most likely to stay subscribed, players in the 13.5% legally killed group were less likely to stay subscribed and players in the 85.5% not killed group were the least likely to stay subscribed. CCP never said what percentage of those 80,000 new players ended up quitting the game, all they said was that less than 1% of the players who quit said it was due to ship loss or harassment.

More than likely most of those 80,000 new players were still doing the Career Agents or the level 1 SoE Epic Arc and hadn't really ventured out into the Eve Universe. Also let's not forget that a few years ago CCP made it perfectly clear that new players 30 days old or younger were not to be messed with in 30 different systems.

I'll bet the survey stats would have been way different if it had been done by a neutral 3rd party. The survey itself should have been done on 1 to 3 month old players instead of 15 day old players. Also the percentage amount of players in each group who quit should have been listed along with the percentage amount of players who actually gave a reason for quitting.

In my opinion that survey was just pure BS propaganda.


DMC

Since that's his own personal opinion, it isn't even relevant to this thread topic. Also this game has changed a lot since when he posted that in 2014. In fact Eve is currently changing into the type of game he said he didn't want to see.

---

Not sure why you want to WarDec NPC Corps, probably think you'll get easy kills. All NPC Corps belong to an Empire Alliance.

Just remember, a few little bee's may not harm a big bad bear but a swarm of little bee's will definitely chase a big bad bear away.

Death by a thousand stings.



DMC

Trite - unless a new player comes in via one of the entities like Reddit and SA, etc. they probably don't have the kind of support network to make that anything but a soundbite.



As per the other thread I posted in - after talking to a few people who quit the game early on due to being ganked or losing stuff in a similar fashion in most cases it wasn't the act of being ganked that turned them away as I had first thought but that they found there was no meaningful way in most cases to even attempt to exact revenge. In some cases the lack of tools to better understand the dangers was also cited.



I dunno - I think it is relevant - people don't tend to gank someone unless they think they are safe - that the will come out on top, that they will gain either in griefing or gain from loot drop more than they lose and that they can after waiting out a short timer either dock up or log off and be safe until any chance of revenge has past if they think there is any chance someone might fight back. Maybe its time to change all that.

Just give people who dont want to pvp a button like the safety. We can call it Spectator mode. The only downside is nothing they do can generate isk or interfere with the universe while its on. No chatting either, use the spectator channel for chat. Also you cant leave empire and upon jumping a gate to low, null or a wormhole the button activates. There will be a pop-up message like when you go to lowsec for the first time but this one will take up the full screen and three buttons would need to be clicked to ensure they really really really wanted it off. Kinda like the "im not a robot' things websites use to classify robots and vampires.

Sure, no doubt there would be different results if they looked at different time windows. But CCP Rise was trying to figure out why new players don't stay with the game, and if 95% of them don't make it past the trial, then it is this window that is most relevant. Therefore, numerically it is much more important what factors keep a person playing past those first few weeks, and being exploded non-consensually turns out not to be a negative factor. I get that some people try to wrongly over-extend that correlation to say ganking is great for the game which as you point out may not be true if you look at retention of players in a longer time window, but the fact that Eve Online has such a poor retention rate during the first weeks (or even hours!) means CCP is very correct to focus on that window for what they are trying to do and given how many players go away at this point. It isn't "BS propaganda" to look at what player experiences correlate with making that initial decision to stay past what was the old trial time.

Why would CCP need propaganda anyway? It's their game and they can do what they want. I also believe it is completely in their best interests to figure out what factors keep players from getting into, and staying with the PvP sandbox game they have built rather than to try to deceive the player base as part of some shadowy HTFU conspiracy. I don't believe them liars, or disingenuous, and I expect they are as capable as anyone of parsing their massive collection of logs and trying to extract correlations and relationships, and make evidence-based hypotheses they can use to guide their development of the game or even test directly as CCP Rise and his group did with the Opportunities system. As he said:



This seems all perfectly reasonable to me and not "propaganda".

In aggregate, the data show that new players are not negatively affected by being exploded by criminals or during wardecs. They are much more likely to drift away by not engaging with other players and succumbing to the confusing and boring game Eve can be if you make no connections or have no interactions with other real people. That isn't universal, and I am sure they are happy soloists who took to the game instantly and still rarely interact, but in aggregate, of all the people who tried, this is the most common experience. And yes, none of this says anything about what keeps them playing the game say six months down the line.

Wardecs are a major way for players to interact in highsec. That means, they will always be around in some form no matter how much the people who seem to be playing the wrong game whine to CCP. These types, like the OP, would be much happier either just staying in the NPC corp or by finding another game altogether where you are intended to be able to control who interacts with you.

Removal of war decs = People have to go to null or low sec or shudder, those scary wormhole places to blow stuff up.

War dec people cause a problem and it's Not a grey area. You should listen to them on comms. Such egos. Seriously, put an alt in for the experience. Eye opening.

As 99.99% of war decs are initiated by people far too scared to go to these places, CCPs sort of stuck with them much like moon mining to create vast amount s of ISK. They can "move the goal posts around", but they can't close Pandora's box (fnar fnar)

Turning it off ? It is not clear what the result will be.
Could be a huge boon to the game or a bust for the game.
As it is, it's *imperfect* and that's acceptable for CCP

best thing to do is create a new corp every time you get war dec. Corps cost 0isk.

As the ESI endpoints start to mature, I can see a point where spinning up corpb exactly the same as corpa, as hard as filling out a Web form. That'll kill off war decs very effectively with CCP waking away from the war dec people with a clear conscience lol.

Honestly, the only reason everyone doesn't do this is (jump into a fresh corp when that wardec mail arrives) is because of admin work involved. Remove that and Trolololo

Only people who can't do this are sov holders and they live in null where wardecs are meaningless. We use alts and jump clones to skip war deccers. So, technically war decs are pointless anyway.

War dec enablers are just stubborn / stupid / ignorant people .. it's already de

I play Battlefield, the guys on the other team are all assholes and that one guy who killed me twice now is a bully.