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June release 118.6 - General feedback

First post First post
Author
Nairobi al-Kashmir
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#241 - 2016-06-29 16:45:05 UTC
I've said this already in a different thread, but I thought I'd leave the feedback here, too, as it was suggested.

I actually like the dock / undock feature very much. I've wished for something like this for a long time.

And while I like the feature, there are still things that could perhaps be done a bit better.

As a previous poster mentioned: you could make the docking cinematic a bit more... epic. With more stuff to see as it runs. It would be awesome!

Then I think the cinematic does not need to run when switching ships, but only if actually docking.

And lastly (even if you, CCP, seem opposed to this idea) just make the feature optional. Options are a good thing. And if not optional then just allow those who do not wish to see it to simply "click it away". You would make a lot of people happy with this.

Anyway, thank you for the great work you're doing CCP.
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#242 - 2016-06-29 16:50:56 UTC
CCP Darwin wrote:
I commented to point out that requesting an additional option toggle is not as helpful as explaining why the feature bothers you

So "Please publicly describe your disability to me so I can see if I am willing to accommodate it".

And you wonder why our response is "get some sensitivity training"?

I suggest you take a deep breath, let the the idea that you may be on the wrong side of the argument enter your mind, then come back with an apology.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#243 - 2016-06-29 16:56:39 UTC
Aid Bringer wrote:
Drigo Segvian wrote:
Love the little +/- wallet display as transactions process.

+1 CCP



Yeah, its not bad, though I notice they DIDN'T HAVE A PROBLEM CREATING AN ON/OFF TOGGLE FOR THIS ONE.


Sort of just blows what the Dev said to justify not adding a toggle for the station animation right out of the water, eh?

Common, CCP. Be big, learn to admit mistakes and expedite changes.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#244 - 2016-06-29 16:57:55 UTC
Tao Dolcino wrote:
And as always when there is a crisis between the players and CCP (almost every posts in this thread are against the new animations, i have rarely seen such an unanimity), the CSM is nowhere to be seen.


It's becoming apparent that they were complicit in this fiasco.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#245 - 2016-06-29 17:01:06 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
Red Deck wrote:

It feels to me like CCP completely fails to understand how little things than make people 'ooh' when seen for the first time get unbelievably annoying when endured for the thousandth time.

Because conference room game design and the idea sounds good. Perhaps a hint of someone wishing they had become a film director when they grew up.

Form over function, form over function.


So this is another "Pssshhhhhh" moment?
CCP Turtlepower
C C P
C C P Alliance
#246 - 2016-06-29 17:01:14 UTC
Dominous Nolen wrote:
I like the idea of the wallet pop out however when you multibuy a large list of items such as a complete doctrine fitting for a ship it takes a while to stop popping up with all the transactions of the purchase.

Can you set it to just take the cumulative total of the value of items purchased in one popup instead.
Yes! We very much want to do this (along with allowing it for corp wallets) at some point in the not-too-far-future. For the moment, you could set a threshold to filter out the more insignificant transactions.

o7
CCP Turtlepower
Cade Windstalker
#247 - 2016-06-29 17:02:57 UTC
CCP Larrikin wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:
How effective was it compared to prior to yesterday? When carriers for the first time in their history didn't need to be in a blob (big or small) to be effectively used in PVP..


In real terms, the nerf to general light fighters is approximately a 20% damage reduction versus destroyer and smaller targets, and a 10% damage reduction to Battlecruisers/Battleships (while they have charges). This is completely dependent on fits , tackle and circumstances. In some cases it's worse than this, in others it's better. For example, once you've run out of charges, general light fighters apply a lot better than pre-118.6.

As we said in our first communications about the new fighters that where deployed with Citadels and started taking your feedback, the balance of the new fighters and capitals would need tweeking. The 118.6 patch is the start of that process, but by no means the end.

We had the opinion (and the data since the citadels patch backs it up) that general light fighters could alpha out small targets too well with their heavy rocket salvo, especially combined with the networked sensor array's bonus to locking speed. Given the excellent application of the old heavy rocket salvo ability there was little incentive to fit target painters or webifiers.
Additionally, there is some thematic discontinuance with the heavy rocket salvo having better application than fighter guns.

Post-118.6, carriers can still apply damage quite well to small targets. They also have options with the space superiority fighters, which while do a lot less damage to sub-capitals, can apply incredibly well. Your choices of fit are more important after the 118.6 patch.

We take a lot of time to read the feedback forum posts here, tweetfleet slack (o/ #capitals m8s), the capital focus group, the CSM, and various other community groups. Player feedback is incredibly important and influential to the design process. We don't always reply, and we're sorry about that.



The replies are always appreciated when you can.

This would have been incredibly helpful if it had been posted in the Capital Changes thread about a week ago though. There was no small amount of gnashing of teeth by some parties over those changes and while people in the thread hit on basically every point on this list the debate pretty much devolved into a lot of insult hurling and speculation. I think a post like this, outlining clearly for those who didn't see any issues with the old design, would have helped steer the conversation in a more productive direction.

As always thanks for the hard work and the amount of time that you all put into interacting with the community. Big smile
Cade Windstalker
#248 - 2016-06-29 17:04:45 UTC
KIller Wabbit wrote:
Aid Bringer wrote:
Drigo Segvian wrote:
Love the little +/- wallet display as transactions process.

+1 CCP



Yeah, its not bad, though I notice they DIDN'T HAVE A PROBLEM CREATING AN ON/OFF TOGGLE FOR THIS ONE.


Sort of just blows what the Dev said to justify not adding a toggle for the station animation right out of the water, eh?

Common, CCP. Be big, learn to admit mistakes and expedite changes.


Different menu, different team, different circumstance.

The wallet toggle is off in its own little thing. Darwin commented that his team was trying to reduce the complexity of the graphical menus, which the wallet toggle is not among.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#249 - 2016-06-29 17:06:53 UTC
CCP Darwin wrote:
Kremlath wrote:
1) No, we're not adding options to the options menu because that makes things 'complex'

I commented to point out that requesting an additional option toggle is not as helpful as explaining why the feature bothers you, because the graphics software team (my team) is currently working on simplifying the graphics settings options.

A different team than mine is responsible for the docking animation, and despite that they haven't posted here, they are reading all of the feedback.


As if pages of statements by dozens of others doesn't detail the issues? Seriously??? Shocked
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#250 - 2016-06-29 17:08:46 UTC
Bad Bobby wrote:
CCP Darwin wrote:
I commented to point out that requesting an additional option toggle is not as helpful as explaining why the feature bothers you

So "Please publicly describe your disability to me so I can see if I am willing to accommodate it".

And you wonder why our response is "get some sensitivity training"?

I suggest you take a deep breath, let the the idea that you may be on the wrong side of the argument enter your mind, then come back with an apology.

Well, in reply to all of this, here is something which you can do and fits the situation:

Take 3 pictures and place them in a row, quickly look from one to the other.

-> It simulates looking at different windows/screens with still images or cameras fixed in similar directions. There is almost no discomfort, unless you really try hard to experience some.

Now look at the center picture, then turn your head to the right one, while your eyes slide to the picture on the left, ... rinse and repeat both ways.

-> It simulates moving backgrounds in different directions while trying to focus on still images. If this doesn't make you queasy and sick, then you are a medical anomaly (maybe a jet pilot or astronaut), not the norm.



On a funnier note,

....you all know the experience, sitting in a train or car, when another car/train slowly starts to move and you jolt up and think you are moving or rolling (maybe hitting the brakes hard on a car) ?! Blink

Well, I was reading the scope news while docking ... tried to grab the screen while thinking 'stop - stop' Shocked

So much for my subconscious realizing the lack of control and moving my hand from the mouse to the screen in despair.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#251 - 2016-06-29 17:10:02 UTC
Norrin Ellis wrote:
I'd like to thank CCP for taking me back to patch days of old that were always nightmarish and resulted in all kinds of broken things. With the event NPCs, I now get to go tediously reconfigure my overview for each tab preset! While not as tedious as reconfiguring all the game settings--a common side effect of patches in the old days--it still makes me feel a bit nostalgic.

On the bright side, that cinematic docking sequence every time we change ships works perfectly.

I'd give this more than two enthusiastic thumbs up, but I only have two thumbs.


This. All because features/bugs be damned - we're gonna tick that schedule box!!
Kaivarian Coste
Whale Patrol
#252 - 2016-06-29 17:13:33 UTC
Is there a hotfix for the docking/undocking?

Subliminally Famous
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#253 - 2016-06-29 17:16:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Subliminally Famous
Just sat there for an hour in a venture and mined 162k+/100k units of Velspar for 500 reward points. No reward points.

Completed 3/5 Serpentis Shipyard and Research Facility Sites, progress = 0/5.

Killed 8/5 Guards for the "Kill 5 Guard" mission to complete.

CCP. Please :(
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#254 - 2016-06-29 17:16:44 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
KIller Wabbit wrote:
Aid Bringer wrote:
Drigo Segvian wrote:
Love the little +/- wallet display as transactions process.

+1 CCP



Yeah, its not bad, though I notice they DIDN'T HAVE A PROBLEM CREATING AN ON/OFF TOGGLE FOR THIS ONE.


Sort of just blows what the Dev said to justify not adding a toggle for the station animation right out of the water, eh?

Common, CCP. Be big, learn to admit mistakes and expedite changes.


Different menu, different team, different circumstance.

The wallet toggle is off in its own little thing. Darwin commented that his team was trying to reduce the complexity of the graphical menus, which the wallet toggle is not among.


As if one more menu tab in the ESC menu would be the end of the world. If they actually researched it I'm betting a significant number of EVE customers would be happy with one or more additional ESC menus that would provide toggles for over a dozen or more "features" that the customers actually hate. The issue is the Dev's don't like us pushing back.

It's okay Devs, be "right". One account expiring in 3 days, the others rippling down in the next two weeks.
Niraia
Starcakes
#255 - 2016-06-29 17:19:20 UTC
CCP Darwin wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:
7 pages in 12 hours and much of it requesting ONE (docking animations - ON / OFF) thing be altered.

Our focus with the settings menu right now is on reducing complexity, rather than adding it.


You could make a menu for advanced settings. Come on.

Tao Dolcino
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#256 - 2016-06-29 17:21:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Tao Dolcino
What bothers me is that the only feedback they seem to accept from us is when it comes to our health, because it's politically correct and who knows, they are maybe afraid of being sued or whatever.
But all the other feedbacks concerning the gameplay, for which we pay our monthly subscribtions which pay their salaries is regarded with disdain, or plainly ignored.
CCP guys, you want to attract more teen customers and be succesful like other mmos ? It's very simple : make advertising with EVE girls in space-bikinis with huge boobs Roll Honestly, what you are doing with your fluff animations is not of a higher level.
Tamazaki
Doomheim
#257 - 2016-06-29 17:27:02 UTC
Is there a way to turn off the animation when you dock at a station? Something about the camera movement makes me dizzy What?
Rain6637
NulzSec
#258 - 2016-06-29 17:31:10 UTC
Tamazaki wrote:
Is there a way to turn off the animation when you dock at a station? Something about the camera movement makes me dizzy What?

Is it because it's basically that party game where you put your forehead to the handle of a bat and spin?
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#259 - 2016-06-29 17:55:59 UTC
Niraia wrote:
CCP Darwin wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:
7 pages in 12 hours and much of it requesting ONE (docking animations - ON / OFF) thing be altered.

Our focus with the settings menu right now is on reducing complexity, rather than adding it.


You could make a menu for advanced settings. Come on.



They could, but that would 1) hurt the feelings of the Devs who put so much time into this and 2) CCP would have to admit they made a mistake.

This has happened before and it will happen again. The Jump animation thread for a refresher: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=243438

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.

Rain6637
NulzSec
#260 - 2016-06-29 18:09:25 UTC
"It was cool the first time."

The undock camera should only play once, just like the EVE intro video. It IS a cool concept, but it loses its impact faster than the player loses their sense of wonder. It's valid as a cinematic shot, just not over and over.