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[Citadels] Supercarriers

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Niriam DoT
F0XIC
#81 - 2016-04-01 22:08:27 UTC
Just took a look at Revenant on Sisi. Gues what - it has 58 000 km lock range listed under attributes tab.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#82 - 2016-04-02 02:57:12 UTC
Archeras Umangiar wrote:
Sooo looking at align times specificly.... how is the Nyx more agile than the Hel, sorry but that make little to no sense for me...

have some differing stats really, the align time being EXACTLY the same for the aeon and the wyvern... comn ccp...


This is the same amongst many sub caps.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Archeras Umangiar
V0LTA
WE FORM V0LTA
#83 - 2016-04-02 10:26:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Archeras Umangiar
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Archeras Umangiar wrote:
Sooo looking at align times specificly.... how is the Nyx more agile than the Hel, sorry but that make little to no sense for me...

have some differing stats really, the align time being EXACTLY the same for the aeon and the wyvern... comn ccp...


This is the same amongst many sub caps.



not really, the align time between a Raven and a Armaggedon is different, i can understand that they have the same it doesn bother me, but give the hel its faster align time than others, its litteraly what made it so *special*

Caldari has always and should stay a BRICK align time wise, while amarr is slightly better but in the end is the same as the wyvern due to the plates, the hel is the fastest followed by the nyx, thats how its been for ages and should stay imo
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#84 - 2016-04-02 19:11:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Daichi Yamato
You know you just compared an attack BS with a combat BS right??

Incursus - 4.5
Rifter - 4.7

Maller - 8.7
Moa - 8.7

Thorax - 7.7
Stabber - 7.9

Harby - 12.2
Drake - 12.2


No its not gospel. But its quite frequent.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Archeras Umangiar
V0LTA
WE FORM V0LTA
#85 - 2016-04-02 19:57:51 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
You know you just compared an attack BS with a combat BS right??

Incursus - 4.5
Rifter - 4.7

Maller - 8.7
Moa - 8.7

Thorax - 7.7
Stabber - 7.9

Harby - 12.2
Drake - 12.2


No its not gospel. But its quite frequent.



Still the Revenants inertia hasnt been fixed, this looks litteraly like a copy pasta of stats to me vOv
Mr Floydy
Questionable Ethics.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#86 - 2016-04-03 09:03:52 UTC
Been playing around with Carriers and SuperCarriers on Sisi a little. Liking the changes a lot so far despite only barely scratching the surface in the gameplay they now offer. One thing that might have already been highlighted but wasn't as expected, being able to effectively instant reload drones.
Fire off a Torp Volley from the heavy fighter drones, redock, relaunch - able to fire again straight away. Is this accepted as it's at the expense of you being right next to the thing you are shooting?
Oukonunaka
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#87 - 2016-04-03 18:25:01 UTC
Since the EHP on the ships are going to be lowered, will there be a construction reduction in materials to compensate for this. I dont think it makes any sense to lower EHP on a ship of this size and cost without reducing its material amounts.
HandelsPharmi
Pharmi on CharBazaar
#88 - 2016-04-03 18:54:54 UTC
Mr Floydy wrote:
Been playing around with Carriers and SuperCarriers on Sisi a little. Liking the changes a lot so far despite only barely scratching the surface in the gameplay they now offer. One thing that might have already been highlighted but wasn't as expected, being able to effectively instant reload drones.
Fire off a Torp Volley from the heavy fighter drones, redock, relaunch - able to fire again straight away. Is this accepted as it's at the expense of you being right next to the thing you are shooting?



CCP hat this problem already! They have fixed it, by a countdown of the fighter's cycle time. Instead of shooting instantly and reloading, it took on full cycle to get ready to shoot.
To prohibit the problem you mentioned. Docking and relaunching all drones increased the DPS exorbitantly... by two to three time more DPS.
Edriahn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#89 - 2016-04-04 14:32:56 UTC
CCP Larrikin wrote:
Hey Mates,

We've tweaked the bonuses & stats a little. We've upped the damage bonus of the Nyx and Hel up to 10% per level, and brought the amount of shield/armor a little closer together between the Aeon/Nyx & Wyvern/Hel.

Let us know what you think :)


It's nice to see somebody is actually listening, but it's still far from perfect.

Looking at it objectively, you have 8 tank slots + 20% resist bonus on the Aeon, vs 7-slot tank + 25% damage bonus on the Nyx. This is not much different than the current situation and as you know, aeon's are the go-to for armor tank and a lot of people have switched from the fragile nyxes. If the Aeon fits 1x DDA, it compensates for the nyx bonuses and still has 1 free slot for its primary tank, while the Nyx only has a +1 utility, which isn't as useful.

C'mon, you can think of something better, I haven't extracted my gallente Carrier V yet.

[20:46:05] Komahal > pl is cancer
Mr Floydy
Questionable Ethics.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#90 - 2016-04-04 18:34:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Floydy
HandelsPharmi wrote:
CCP hat this problem already! They have fixed it, by a countdown of the fighter's cycle time. Instead of shooting instantly and reloading, it took on full cycle to get ready to shoot.
To prohibit the problem you mentioned. Docking and relaunching all drones increased the DPS exorbitantly... by two to three time more DPS.

It's definitely still broken on Sisi (evading the reload timer) - but if CCP are aware then that's fine by me!


A request - any chance of an icon against locked targets showing what drones are attacking the object? The lines in space are all well and good, but with 1000+ people on grid they're not going to be helpful!
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#91 - 2016-04-05 18:16:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Rowells
Giuseppe R Raimondo wrote:
Mr Grape Drink wrote:
Giuseppe R Raimondo wrote:
Mr Grape Drink wrote:

Hel - Dank counter fighters




so a super thats totally useless if you fit smartbombs on all your supers in fleet




Im failing to see how extra speed on the fighters makes it less useful than any other fighters when it comes to smartbombs?


i am saying that having the hel has the role of counter fighters is useless because other supers will easily kill enemy fighters with smartbombs wih out having to give up dps

i geuss that would only apply to targets within ~10km. Which would be a terrible under-utilization of the range of control they now afford.

Unless you're getting hotdrop per I geuss. In which case you've got other problems.
Oxide Ammar
#92 - 2016-04-10 06:00:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Oxide Ammar
Anyone feel that new super EW/ Energy weapons under whelming ? they require heavy water (it wasn't before) to use, the generated AOE effect doesn't last long and it is easily avoided.

Edit: are bombers usually never crit like drones ? or I missed news about that. I never flown a super before so I don't know if they crit on live servers or only doing steady dmg like in sisi right now.

Lady Areola Fappington:  Solo PVP isn't dead!  You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
d0cTeR9
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#93 - 2016-04-11 00:16:26 UTC
Glad i sold my motherships... i mean supercarriers...

Been around since the beginning.
Donedy
Lulzsec Space
#94 - 2016-04-15 00:31:45 UTC
What about a 6/6/6 slot layout on the Hel? :)
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#95 - 2016-04-16 06:11:26 UTC
Inasmuch as supercaps will be able to dock at the new XL citadels, I suggest that all ships which are undocked when logged off should always remain in space, rather than disappear into an other place, where they are both undetectable and invulnerable.

The tactic of hiding/protecting ships by keeping them logged off has always been an unrealistic, borderline exploit. Now is a good time to correct this long overdue problem.

Note: I always laugh when I think of the Empire protecting the Death Star by simply logging off, until the Rebels go home.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#96 - 2016-04-16 17:22:45 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
Inasmuch as supercaps will be able to dock at the new XL citadels, I suggest that all ships which are undocked when logged off should always remain in space, rather than disappear into an other place, where they are both undetectable and invulnerable.

The tactic of hiding/protecting ships by keeping them logged off has always been an unrealistic, borderline exploit. Now is a good time to correct this long overdue problem.

Note: I always laugh when I think of the Empire protecting the Death Star by simply logging off, until the Rebels go home.



... how do you expect whs to be sieged

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Lugh Crow-Slave
#97 - 2016-04-16 17:24:09 UTC
Edriahn wrote:
CCP Larrikin wrote:
Hey Mates,

We've tweaked the bonuses & stats a little. We've upped the damage bonus of the Nyx and Hel up to 10% per level, and brought the amount of shield/armor a little closer together between the Aeon/Nyx & Wyvern/Hel.

Let us know what you think :)


It's nice to see somebody is actually listening, but it's still far from perfect.

Looking at it objectively, you have 8 tank slots + 20% resist bonus on the Aeon, vs 7-slot tank + 25% damage bonus on the Nyx. This is not much different than the current situation and as you know, aeon's are the go-to for armor tank and a lot of people have switched from the fragile nyxes. If the Aeon fits 1x DDA, it compensates for the nyx bonuses and still has 1 free slot for its primary tank, while the Nyx only has a +1 utility, which isn't as useful.

C'mon, you can think of something better, I haven't extracted my gallente Carrier V yet.


That extra utility slot is more applied damage or more speed it's not that bad of a trade off

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
LakeEnd
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#98 - 2016-04-21 08:02:58 UTC
CCPls if you think about how fleet combat works, please realize the Hel burst projector bonus is WAY weaker than the others, you still have time to change it!

Tracking Disruptor AOE = results in massive loss of DPS from affected fleet
ECM AOE = results in massive loss of DPS, loss of ability to run effective logistics and increase general chaos
Damping AOE = Same as ECM really

Target Painter AOE = Because in fleet fights you always focus fire on single target (or if multiple fleets are shooting the same area maybe 2-3) this is in no shape or form better than just one guy in subcap fleet fitting a target painter, it will most likely be a subcap fleet anyway doing the shooting. The only REALLY marginal usecase for AOE paints would be if you manage to time it and place it with a bomb wave and unlike any other AOE burst effect this requires co- ordination with second fleet to get working at all. The usecase is marginal and the effort to get it working is lot more for much smaller gains.


CCPls change the painter AEO to web AOE, it will be more useful and more in line with power with the other AOE bursts.
Anthar Thebess
#99 - 2016-04-21 08:15:09 UTC
LakeEnd wrote:
CCPls if you think about how fleet combat works, please realize the Hel burst projector bonus is WAY weaker than the others, you still have time to change it!

Tracking Disruptor AOE = results in massive loss of DPS from affected fleet
ECM AOE = results in massive loss of DPS, loss of ability to run effective logistics and increase general chaos
Damping AOE = Same as ECM really

Target Painter AOE = Because in fleet fights you always focus fire on single target (or if multiple fleets are shooting the same area maybe 2-3) this is in no shape or form better than just one guy in subcap fleet fitting a target painter, it will most likely be a subcap fleet anyway doing the shooting. The only REALLY marginal usecase for AOE paints would be if you manage to time it and place it with a bomb wave and unlike any other AOE burst effect this requires co- ordination with second fleet to get working at all. The usecase is marginal and the effort to get it working is lot more for much smaller gains.


CCPls change the painter AEO to web AOE, it will be more useful and more in line with power with the other AOE bursts.

AOE combined with a stasis web effect could be nice.

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ReK42
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#100 - 2016-04-22 00:37:05 UTC  |  Edited by: ReK42
So to recap the changes from current to Citadel, using the Aeon:
  • Big raw HP nerf means you need to fit 2 plates to get to the same EHP as before.
  • Losing those 2 low slots to plates means your average resist drops from 95.0% to 92.8%
  • That resistance drop equates to a 44% increase in damage taken
  • We're losing the ability to refit in combat (eg: go from gank fit to tank fit, or to DD tank)
  • Spider tanking is being removed completely
  • Capital reps are being nerfed heavily (FAX only, ineffective outside of triage, will be easy to blap while in triage)
  • Can now be tackled by just 6 frigates worth 10m each
  • Cost is not being reduced
  • Still can't insure the hull to offset a loss
  • Still no rework of jump fatigue to be less cancerous

I have one question: Why would anyone want to fly a super after patch day? Sure the fighters stuff seems cool but really? Rule one of eve is never fly something you can't afford to lose. Given how expensive supers and titans are that rule isn't practical but people still got them because of how hard they were to kill. Now that they're so much easier to kill you're going to see a lot less of them fielded in actual fights where the enemy might show up unless you address those last four points.

Edit: The increase in damage taken will likely be significantly more than 44% because we're dealing with averages here and one of the low slots you're losing is a Reactive Hardener which would have meant your resistance to incoming damage should be higher than the average.