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[Vanguard] 350k added skillpoints for new characters!

First post
Author
CCP Rise
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1 - 2015-09-24 13:34:30 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Phantom
Hi!

This post is maybe a bit late but hopefully you will forgive me. TL;DR here is very simple, in Vanguard we are bumping starting skills for all newly created characters from 50k to roughly 400k.

The goal here is to get new players over as many early barriers to gameplay as possible. By throwing in a whole bunch of prereqs and adding to the basic support skill amounts we are hoping new players have faster access to a wider range of activities right out of the box.

I was going to type out the full list of skills but you know what, you guys are pretty much better at everything than us and have already created an imgur album of the skill list so I'll just give you that! It only has the list for one faction but they are almost identical except for a couple minor changes to support skills because of differences in weapon system.

IMGUR ALBUM OF SKILLS

One note: if you made your character in the last few days you will have less SP than people who created after Vanguard, that's not good! Some time soon after Vanguard (maybe a week or so) we will hand out 300k unallocated SP to all characters created in the two weeks leading up to Vanguard release. Sorry for having to wait a little but we gotchu.

Let us know if you see any big problems with the skill list here or any other feedback.

Thanks! And as always, thanks for taking care of all the noobs out there.

@ccp_rise

Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#2 - 2015-09-24 13:41:30 UTC
This is a MUCH appreciated change. Having those skills already plugged in will be a great simplification for new players.
Omnathious Deninard
Ministry of Silly Walks.
The Gurlstas Associates
#3 - 2015-09-24 13:43:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Omnathious Deninard
It looks like newbros will still need to buy and train there racial ewar skills up? It does look like everything else is there but that.

Edit: And remote repair methods, one thing I would like to see is newbros to be able to use all there T1 frigates from day one.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.

Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4 - 2015-09-24 13:52:00 UTC
Obligatory "SLAP IN THE FACE OF YOUR VETS" post before anyone post it unironically.
Dr Cedric
Independent Miners Corporation
Care Factor
#5 - 2015-09-24 13:53:05 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:
Hi!

I was going to type out the full list of skills but you know what, you guys are pretty much better at everything than us and have already created an imgur album of the skill list so I'll just give you that!




Can't tell if Rise is butt-hurt by players doing some of the work or excited that he gets 20 extra minutes to drink some kind of Icelandic adult beverage!

I would have liked to see these SP given out in a more NPE kind of way, but I'm sure people appreciate it anyway.

/me walks away thinking...300k SP's wouldn't even take a day off the 45 day training time for Capital Ships V

Cedric

Edward Olmops
Gunboat Commando
#6 - 2015-09-24 13:53:11 UTC
How would you think about a one-time SP boost for new characters once they accomplish something?
Say, 50k unallocated SP for completing a meta opportunity "Take opportunities: fully complete one/two/three other opportunities"

So there is
- an incentive to do something with opportunities (learn actively), but it's not restricted to a specific area (you are not forced to learn combat or learn EVERYTHING to max out bonusses if you dont want to).
- new players would quickly be able to customize their character AFTER they learned at least a little bit about the game (so hopefully they don't waste the one-time bonus)
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2015-09-24 13:57:04 UTC
Edward Olmops wrote:
How would you think about a one-time SP boost for new characters once they accomplish something?
Say, 50k unallocated SP for completing a meta opportunity "Take opportunities: fully complete one/two/three other opportunities"

So there is
- an incentive to do something with opportunities (learn actively), but it's not restricted to a specific area (you are not forced to learn combat or learn EVERYTHING to max out bonusses if you dont want to).
- new players would quickly be able to customize their character AFTER they learned at least a little bit about the game (so hopefully they don't waste the one-time bonus)


Because then it's only a real boost to alts while this is a boost to newbie being able to try anything from second 1 of their gameplay. Newbie would likely throw their un-allocated SP gift in place that does not open new options for them to discover while this flat allocation make them able to do close to anything.
Mag's
Azn Empire
#8 - 2015-09-24 13:59:10 UTC
The only issue I see with this approach, is the giving of skills one may not want. Could you look to making focused skill set choices.
I.E. PvP focused, Trader focused, mining focused etc.

This from a perspective of someone who has industry and mining at one, with no intention on ever using them. But no choice as to their inclusion.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.

Captain Awkward
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2015-09-24 14:00:03 UTC
Like this very mutch. It will help new players to get a little better start. Its not so funny to buy 30 skillbooks at the first 3 days because everything that you want to try out is not learned yet.

Do chars that were created in the last week(s) get some kind of free skillpoints (maybe fading out the older the char is) to compensate ?

I could create a new char now and one new week and the one next week would be better then the char now. My buddy who startet last weekend will probably shoot himself if he hears this Shocked

Just saying.
Unreal Blight
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2015-09-24 14:01:51 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:
I was going to type out the full list of skills but you know what, you guys are pretty much better at everything than us and have already created an imgur album of the skill list so I'll just give you that!

IMGUR ALBUM OF SKILLS

ty Rise ilu too bb :3

I actually would like to ask if we could get a list of the skills by race if possible, still. The small differences in support skills can make a difference for those of us who create skill plans for newbies.
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#11 - 2015-09-24 14:01:58 UTC
Captain Awkward wrote:
Like this very mutch. It will help new players to get a little better start. Its not so funny to buy 30 skillbooks at the first 3 days because everything that you want to try out is not learned yet.

Do chars that were created in the last week(s) get some kind of free skillpoints (maybe fading out the older the char is) to compensate ?

I could create a new char now and one new week and the one next week would be better then the char now. My buddy who startet last weekend will probably shoot himself if he hears this Shocked

Just saying.


CCP Rise wrote:


One note: if you made your character in the last few days you will have less SP than people who created after Vanguard, that's not good! Some time soon after Vanguard (maybe a week or so) we will hand out 300k unallocated SP to all characters created in the two weeks leading up to Vanguard release. Sorry for having to wait a little but we gotchu.




Did you even read the post?
Captain Awkward
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2015-09-24 14:06:24 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Captain Awkward wrote:
Like this very mutch. It will help new players to get a little better start. Its not so funny to buy 30 skillbooks at the first 3 days because everything that you want to try out is not learned yet.

Do chars that were created in the last week(s) get some kind of free skillpoints (maybe fading out the older the char is) to compensate ?

I could create a new char now and one new week and the one next week would be better then the char now. My buddy who startet last weekend will probably shoot himself if he hears this Shocked

Just saying.


CCP Rise wrote:


One note: if you made your character in the last few days you will have less SP than people who created after Vanguard, that's not good! Some time soon after Vanguard (maybe a week or so) we will hand out 300k unallocated SP to all characters created in the two weeks leading up to Vanguard release. Sorry for having to wait a little but we gotchu.




Did you even read the post?


Stopped at the link with the colofull picktures and got lost.

Never mind.
Aerasia
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2015-09-24 14:15:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Aerasia
Dr Cedric wrote:
I would have liked to see these SP given out in a more NPE kind of way, but I'm sure people appreciate it anyway.
There's likely a lot of bittervets who will express how much they dislike it. P

But this is exactly how the change in starting SP has to be handled. Sure, I'm going to enjoy some free unallocated SP and I'm certain a lot of others are already planning how to spend it. Newbies don't have that. They don't understand the where, why and what they need so any guaranteed SP is best given already assigned.

As for my thoughts the skills themselves*

  • Interesting that PG and CPU fitting skills are given at 4. Apparently CCP aren't fans of fitting skills either. Smile
  • Mechanic and Hull Upgrades and Repair Systems are at 3, but all the shield skills are is at 1. The 2 & 3 train isn't bad, but that's a bit odd from a tanking module standpoint. (ed. - maybe because this is an Amarr?)
  • Lots of gunnery at 1/2. Saves on skillbook costs mostly, but they're all there by default now.
  • Mining, Survey and Salvaging at 3. Nice, exploration and salvage are reasonable moneymakers for fresh faces.
  • Thermodynamics at 1 by default. Not going to make them PvP gods, but Thermo's one of those "at least have 1" skills, so this is nice.
  • Drones skills: I wonder if these are different for Gallente? Either way, until Drone Interfacing means that anything less than Drones V is wasted potential.

Other than that, a lot of good pre-reqs at one. Looking at the list I think 99% of fits are covered, so at least we have newbies able to get into whatever fit type they're looking at right from minute 1.



*As always, I'm in favor of simply removing SP entirely.
Matt Faithbringer
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2015-09-24 14:18:54 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:

One note: if you made your character in the last few days you will have less SP than people who created after Vanguard, that's not good! Some time soon after Vanguard (maybe a week or so) we will hand out 300k unallocated SP to all characters created in the two weeks leading up to Vanguard release. Sorry for having to wait a little but we gotchu.

Let us know if you see any big problems with the skill list here or any other feedback.



IMO you should just give the 300K SP to all characters.. me wanna some free SPs...
Mornak
Exotic Dancers Union
SONS of BANE
#15 - 2015-09-24 14:36:37 UTC
+1

Maybe you could go a tiny little step further and also award an additional 100-300k SP's or so when someone sub's after the trial period... I think this would be a nice little insta-satisfaction for subbing your trial-acc... plus it might be enough to get some ppl to sub that otherwise wouldn't.

But please make them freely allocatable, so that new player can specialize themselves a bit... i think that is very important for the RPG part of this game...

it's not like the difference between 400k and 700k SP's would make much of a difference....


(i dont know if anything like this is already in place, haven't created a new char in ages.... please ignore if there already is such a insta-satisfaction thingy implemented)
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
#16 - 2015-09-24 14:39:34 UTC
instead of free sp for every one created up to the release why not just credit everyone these skills no matter there age if they don't already have them. This way there no free sp being given most won't even gain anything but it sets everyone on the same foot.

Aerasia
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2015-09-24 14:40:31 UTC
Matt Faithbringer wrote:
CCP Rise wrote:
300k unallocated SP to all characters created in the two weeks leading up to Vanguard release.

IMO you should just give the 300K SP to all characters.. me wanna some free SPs...

I missed the restriction on the new SP I guess. Unfortunate, but I imagine all they were really looking to do was to make sure no characters were left under the new 400k minimum, not to simply boost everybody. Sad
Thanatos Marathon
Moira.
Villore Accords
#18 - 2015-09-24 14:45:11 UTC
Great change! Newbros around the verse rejoice!

Quick question though I may just not be looking at it right: Why not add the secondary missile skills like you have for gunnery?

- Than
Barubary Evans
Doomheim
#19 - 2015-09-24 14:47:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Barubary Evans
CCP Rise wrote:

One note: if you made your character in the last few days you will have less SP than people who created after Vanguard, that's not good! Some time soon after Vanguard (maybe a week or so) we will hand out 300k unallocated SP to all characters created in the two weeks leading up to Vanguard release.


I really, really hate looking a gifthorse in the mouth, but is there no way that CCP can go through and update the skills so that every char with less than the new starting skills gets them updated to the starting skill level? The new skills are a bit over a week of training (on the default remap, without implants). That isn't a small amount of time considering EVE has a monthly cost to the game.

Please don't punish me because I had to take off for the summer: http://puu.sh/kmxoN/fa87aea0e4.jpg

If I remake the third character (what I don't want to do for other reason) I'm only going to lose 9 (3 on the first char, 6 on the second) days of training. If I don't remake him, I'm going to lose 16 days of training.
Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#20 - 2015-09-24 14:49:39 UTC
I too like the idea of granting additional SP after subscribing for the first time. It's not pay-to-win by any means as most stuff is already covered by "cannot be trained on trial accounts".

I'd also like to see a better initial attributes mapping. Splitting all the AP between intelligence and perception for example, or, better yet, just killing the attributes and implants system entirely. I've had the conversation 4 times this week about remapping, and how the most efficient way of gaining skillpoints is the least fun.
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