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Carnyx release - General feedback

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Torxx Maxx
NemoThrax Mining Inc.
#1841 - 2015-06-19 02:29:22 UTC
The dev blog sealed my three accounts fate, all three are forever gone from my control and I will never play this game again, I'll either sell them or give them away I'm done with CCP's flawed logic..
Rio Bravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1842 - 2015-06-19 02:38:55 UTC
Why would you like someones post who says they are leaving the game? That's kind of weird isn't it?

“You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. I dig.”  - Clint Eastwood, misquote.
Ronarke
Dark Knowledge.
#1843 - 2015-06-19 04:29:05 UTC
I'm going to buck the system a little bit. I'm not seeing a problem with the new Icons, in fact, when dealing with POS structures, it has made things a bit easier for me.

Then again, I'm a carebear industrialist, not a master pvp artist.

Hmm... Maybe their BOT's don't recognize the new icons.
Ida Aurlien
HIgh Sec Care Bears
Brothers of Tangra
#1844 - 2015-06-19 05:12:45 UTC
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/bracket-icon-feedback/?_ga=1.183309925.2134134325.1394639977


wow what a response to 90 plus pages of ppl complaining basically just blowing all 90 plus pages off....Well guess that should be expected as took 3 weeks to get nothing
Circumstantial Evidence
#1845 - 2015-06-19 06:46:52 UTC

Looking at the post count for this thread, I see a huge number of posts are from about 30 unique characters with 10 or more posts each, that have probably been repeating the same opinion in different words, over and over again. I'm no exception, crossing into the 10-post category with this one ;)

CCP takes more into account than forum feedback to decide what to do, and, sometimes they don't go with what's popular. I'm looking forward to what they come up with, in regards the 90% scaling and NPC icon tweaks proposed in the new dev blog.
Jeven HouseBenyo
Vanity Thy Name Is
#1846 - 2015-06-19 09:54:30 UTC
From reading the Dev Blog link that was posted by another player not CCP...

Yuppers, Eve is a harsh cruel place. I'll catch up in your precious sandbox later when it won't give migraine triggers from a flat out bad design along with a blatant unwillingness to even give the option to use the old icons while the 'customization' buffet is added. Wondering if, out of spite, CCP will leave out the old ones just to be, well, hardcore PC gamer master race.

Meh, time to go play other MMOs (see who gets my entertainment dollars, Elite Dangerous, Star Citizen, or No Man's Sky), and toss some of the account sub costs in a jar towards a PS4. After all, FFVII remake is finally going to happen.

For all the less hostile more constructive feedback given from Sisi, then that Blog of buying your own hype...

Wow. Just. Wow.



Day-um.

Mkay, Icelandic customer service could use some coaching classes, if that's the SoP on your volcanic chunk of rock! Giving the world Bjork doesn't give enough cute credits to pay that Dev Blog debt of 'whiff! miss!'

>Jeven

Minny boat flyer, unofficial squeaky wheel.

'Game Ethics and Morality Monitor' I remember promises.

Snark at 11-24/7/365.25. Overshare? Yup.

Yes it's my fault. And if you don't staap it I'll do it again. ;-P

No you can't has my stuffs OR my SPs.
Kesta De'Kranken
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1847 - 2015-06-19 10:19:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Kesta De'Kranken
Typically arrogant response from CCP. No option to choose. Just a statement that user preference don't matter and that how we ingest information from our screens is up to CCP and not ourselves. "We'll dictate how you play the game and we don't care if you like it." You admit you have a problem with scaling and yet tell us to suffer with it until fixed (with no estimated completion date) and give us no remedy, even for the short term, of coping.

Extremely poor customer service and unbelieveably arrogant attitude.

Hilmar, you said Eve had transitioned from a Knowledge company to a Learning company after Incarana. Looks like you've reverted back to being a Knowledge company and forgotten the lessons of Incarana....or no longer care.
====================================================================================
21June2015: Subscription Cancelled. I literally just CANNOT see to play this game. Cancellation notification was essentially:

1. How dare you tell me how to ingest information int the game.
2. I have very bad eyesight and the change IS NOT SENSITIVE to people who have bad vision...
3. That saying my Overview was "not properly managed", and that CCP knows best how to display information, is complete BULL!@#$.
4. That CCP Surge's post was stupid insensitive to people with vision problems and is very similar to Metropolitan Edison's response to outrage over Three Mile Island... ie "who are you to question us..."
5. That I pay your salaries (oops..not anymore) and you should have listened to me/us.
6. I'll be back when you admit your mistake and allow us MULTIPLE CHOICES in how we view information...

I'm going to sit back and watch the subscription numbers. I'll be very sad to see if people lose their jobs over this but if you disregard the players in this game, you do so at your peril.

Some men just want to watch the world burn....and drink a beer and eat popcorn while it does so.... It's a tough Universe out there isn't it CCP.....
Neovenator
Xynodyne
The Initiative.
#1848 - 2015-06-19 10:50:59 UTC
Quote:
Those that managed to adapt quickly in the early days of the great Iconocalypse of 2015 certainly profited handsomely from the confusion it sowed.

But in New Eden space is merciless, and change is ever-present.


CCP's response about "Icongate" reminds me to Apples responses to the customers with "Antennagate" (iPhone 4) and "Bendgate" (iPhone 6). It's like "You are using it wrong. We are right".

Groetjes, Neo.

Mein EVE Online Blog: KLICK
Iphigeneia
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1849 - 2015-06-19 11:09:58 UTC
Hmm.

Yep, I'm definitely disappointed by this blog. I really don't think it addressed half of the concerns that were brought up. Pity.
Sophia Mileghere
Scandium Defense and Security Inc.
Sleeper Protocol
#1850 - 2015-06-19 11:20:57 UTC
Circumstantial Evidence wrote:

Looking at the post count for this thread, I see a huge number of posts are from about 30 unique characters with 10 or more posts each, that have probably been repeating the same opinion in different words, over and over again. I'm no exception, crossing into the 10-post category with this one ;)

CCP takes more into account than forum feedback to decide what to do, and, sometimes they don't go with what's popular. I'm looking forward to what they come up with, in regards the 90% scaling and NPC icon tweaks proposed in the new dev blog.


Certainly everybody does not write here in the forum.
But I'm sure for everyone who writes here, there will be many more who do not even like the icons.
So if CCP simply supposes that 90 sides are a minority, there they presumably lie wrong.


Red Deck wrote:
Just an idea...

CCP, if you are really interested in knowing what people think about the new icons and how strongly they feel about the issue, why don't you create a poll and link it prominently from the launcher? I recall participating in a poll on new features in EVE published by CCP before...

Trust me when I say there is a lot more pissed people than you can see in this (already monumental) thread...

The poll might be super simple like

Choose one from:
A) Love the new icons, keep the old ones buried.
B) Mixed bag, no strong feelings either way.
C) The new icons don't work for me, roll the whole thing back.

and as an extra yes/no question:
D) Make using the old icons an option.

This should provide you with data enough to possibly reconsider your current course of action (or a solid justification to tell all of us in this thread very plainly to shut the **** up because we are clearly just an insignificant, even if vocal minority).


So that can be simply ascertained what the customers want, CCP should really put up the idea with the survey.
So a survey gets itself relatively fast. If CCP did this, they would save all one amount of time and frustration.
Of course they would have to put the survey fairly and neutrally and they should publish the result.
Finally, CCP must implement the results only in the game.

Probably CCP assumes that the new icons should then disappear (or become optional). That's why I think there will be no survey.
But hope dies last Blink

CCP, a question I would still have. Because CSM does not speak to us:
What exactly has said the CSM to the Icons?
Sky Marshal
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1851 - 2015-06-19 11:21:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Sky Marshal
I am speechless.

Especially the reasons who explains the change, who are all false...

Quote:
Improving player’s situational awareness and reaction times in combat.
We wanted to give players more icon granularity within ship groups and items. And we wanted to increase the skill ceiling of reading the grid at a glance [...]

Objective failed, it takes a serious amount of time to analyze the battlefield BECAUSE of the granularity... With the new icons, the players will just depend more than before on the Fleet Commander to do anything, because it is human to go to the easier solution available (target broadcasted, targetting, shoot). It seems that the FCs didn't already have enough work to do...

The funny thing, is that I am pretty sure that I read - to explain the partial removal of fleet warp - that "the goal [...] is to encourage more individual fleet member participation". AKA making them using their brain... and at the same time, you make sure that the players will REFUSE to use their brain because of an overload of information...

Quote:
A clearer system for identifying different objects in space.
Intended for veterans and newbies alike to be able to better read situations and assess threat levels. A cruiser and a battleship represent wholly different tactical scenarios[...]

With the old icons, the cruiser was with a smaller square than the battleship. When was the last time that you login into EVE ?



The "next steps section" are even ludicrous :

Quote:
We agree with much of the feedback that the subtle interior fill to indicate NPCs is simply not drastic enough, so we’re looking at other ways to make NPC brackets more clearly identifiable compared to player-controlled ships.

Another common feedback was the drone icons were still too complex and easily confused with ships. We’re also looking at ways to make drones on grid easier to separate from ships at a glance.

A damn cross for ALL NPC like before and a damn "X" for ALL drones like before. Is that so hard for you to admit that you are the only ones in the world to have some uber-4K 37" monitors with IPS panel and so able to differenciate the concord BS from the player BS, etc.?

Quote:
We’ve heard the most benefit from the new icons was gained by those with properly managed overview setups. We’re looking to add an icon column to the customization window, to make it super simple to understand which items you want the tab to display and how.

In short, you seriously think that players will rely on the new icons for everything. How cute...

The reality is that a properly overview settings will make the icons useless for decent players, because they will switch between tabs to identify what there is in the field instead of relying of the icons in visual. This will permit to maintain the analysis delay at minimum.



In short, it is the usual "The users don't know what they really want, we know best" moronic policy in action. I guess I found where the idiots who programmed the Start Screen of Windows 8 managed to take refuge after the commercial failure caused by this UI absurdity, they are in CCP now.

We should make a list about everything you will have to rollback in the future, I think you will need it.
Farrah Abraham
Legion of Ares
#1852 - 2015-06-19 11:35:34 UTC
[quote]We’ve heard the most benefit from the new icons was gained by those with properly managed overview setups. [quote]

Forcing everyone to set all neutrals or unknowns to a different color on overview just to be able to spot them is not a success on your part. It makes it harder to see criminals or other baddies that newbies should have to watch out for.
Farrah Abraham
Legion of Ares
#1853 - 2015-06-19 11:40:55 UTC
Btw, are we going to have to burn jita again before ccp takes action??
John Lawyer
Doomheim
#1854 - 2015-06-19 12:22:13 UTC
Jeven HouseBenyo wrote:

Meh, time to go play other MMOs (see who gets my entertainment dollars, Elite Dangerous, Star Citizen, or No Man's Sky), and toss some of the account sub costs in a jar towards a PS4. After all, FFVII remake is finally going to happen.


I still hope there will be remedy for this fail, but meanwhile I've checked some alternatives and found Perpetuum as the most EVE-like game.
Panterata
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1855 - 2015-06-19 12:38:08 UTC
John Lawyer wrote:
Jeven HouseBenyo wrote:

Meh, time to go play other MMOs (see who gets my entertainment dollars, Elite Dangerous, Star Citizen, or No Man's Sky), and toss some of the account sub costs in a jar towards a PS4. After all, FFVII remake is finally going to happen.


I still hope there will be remedy for this fail, but meanwhile I've checked some alternatives and found Perpetuum as the most EVE-like game.


Xm...look nice..I will try it
Circumstantial Evidence
#1856 - 2015-06-19 13:41:17 UTC
Farrah Abraham wrote:
Btw, are we going to have to burn jita again before ccp takes action??
It worked or... at least helped, during the Incarna episode. Hundreds of players motivated enough to shoot the Jita monument 23/7 was quite extraordinary. The guys selling ammo probably thought it was great ;) But, it was everything combined: forum rage, in-game rage, and mass unsubs.

This game change is very different; it doesn't offend people as much as the planned "micro" transactions: fear (unfounded) about "gold ammo" and comparisons to luxury branded items in the real world costing hundreds and thousands, and why shouldn't EVE have items like that, so players could flaunt their wealth... ugh. Changes to overview icons simply don't offend on the same level as what went down during Incarna.
Desert Ice78
Gryphons of the Western Wind
#1857 - 2015-06-19 14:38:27 UTC
That new dev blog is right up there with Zulu's now fabled $1000 jeans blog.

I am a pod pilot: http://dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/DesertIce/POD.jpg

CCP Zulu: Came expecting a discussion about computer monitors, left confused.
Orm Magnustat
Red Serpent Industries
Red Serpent Alliance
#1858 - 2015-06-19 15:07:15 UTC
Circumstantial Evidence wrote:
.................... Hundreds of players motivated enough to shoot the Jita monument 23/7 was quite extraordinary. The guys selling ammo probably thought it was great ;) But, it was everything combined: forum rage, in-game rage, and mass unsubs.

This game change is very different; it doesn't offend people as much as the planned "micro" transactions: fear (unfounded) about "gold ammo" and comparisons to luxury branded items in the real world costing hundreds and thousands, and why shouldn't EVE have items like that, so players could flaunt their wealth... ugh. Changes to overview icons simply don't offend on the same level as what went down during Incarna.


Guess you you right there, all those "little" frustrations they add with the latest expansions wont lead to some uproar but rather end in a whimper ..... and thats actually tragic for CCP, as they will continue to loose players in a steady trickle instead of having to go through some cleaning storm.
Rio Bravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1859 - 2015-06-19 15:15:03 UTC
I think the icons in 'Club Penguin' have been the same since beta. Maybe you'll all be happier waddling around there. They do change backgrounds from time to time though. Players might change their penguins colors or clothes, so you might still have to adapt a bit everytime you log in.

“You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. I dig.”  - Clint Eastwood, misquote.
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#1860 - 2015-06-19 16:31:17 UTC
Rio Bravo wrote:
I think the icons in 'Club Penguin' have been the same since beta. Maybe you'll all be happier waddling around there. They do change backgrounds from time to time though. Players might change their penguins colors or clothes, so you might still have to adapt a bit everytime you log in.


Fanboi going to fanboi

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.