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IMO it is not possible to get used to new icons because they are not new mechanic or new ability. New icons broke our ability to distinguish player ships, NPC ships and structures. Does not matter how much time we will endure this broken mechanic - it still broken. The only way to repair it is return to simple logic - equal icons for all player ships, anothe equal icons for all NPC, oh, you know how it must look. Like perfect old icons.
"Old icons does not allow to distinguish cruisers and battlecruisers". OK, with new icons we IN THEORY can do it. So what? How can it help me? Battlecruisers is more dangerouse than cruisers? Or cruisers more dangerouse? Eagle at 100 km is dangerouse, drake is not. So cruisers are more dangerouse? But stop, naga at 100 km is dangerouse, omen is not. So battlecruisers are more dangerouse?
This was simplified example, only for guys who have never played EVE. The reality is much more complicated. In PvP nobody care about ship class. We need (from icons) only first quick classification - this is player, this is wreck, this is structure, this is drone. Thats all.
PS: please, NEVER disable old system map. New map unsuitable and I seriously affraid it never will be. Old system map is almost perfect, because it work, because it work fast, and because it contain ONLY usable information. This is base rules how to create perfect instrument. New map is something completely different, like new icons. It is not work, it is not work fast, and it contain unusable graphic stuff.

Hello,

CCP please reply to your employers

I snipped the part where you explained how the difference between extenders and plates is there, and is bad. While I was never questioning that and I'm totally on board with you there, it sure was good to have another detailed look on it c:
It is also very interesting how diverse Eve is, because I wasn't talking about big fleet activities either and thought you were :D Because the small engagements I know are mostly armor. But again, this is how different people play eve, which is a good thing!

And yes, this is what it all boils down to, as I mentioned before. The intention was well meant, but the priorities were skewed and the outcome left wanting. Things started out good for the first two patches or so for the rapid deployment schedule, but then more and more issues came along.

You wrote quality stuff before in this topic, but what happened here? You claim things as fact which you simply have no idea about. Do you sit in the office of CCP ? Do you know if they squeeze in small things with large updates? No, you don't. You talk about what they should do, but who says they are not doing that already? Only because the result is broken does not mean they haven't been working on it for all that time. Also, if you have checked the updates website, you would have seen how the plans for future releases have been carved for quite some time, but this update schedule had less and less glimpse on future content as the patches went on. So there was very well development planned ahead. They sure spent their effort, but it isn't always coming out as good as we want to, which is certainly showing more and more as the release schedule keeps being on a tight leash.


And the next one. Do you sit in the CCP office and can tell if the developers are not hard pressed and need to push out half-finished products BECAUSE of the fast update schedule and because they simply don't have enough time to flesh them out properly? No, you don't. And only because you work for 20 years in the "software development" which is a pretty ambiguous and broad term doesn't mean your company relates to CCP or any other similar company.


THIS is a much more accurate depiction of the problem.

Even if we disregard the difficulties to adapt to a fast paced content schedule when there is not enough content ready to be delivered and even if we disregard the obvious presence of half-finished products, the mentality to work on this is clearly showing a lack of adaptability. Even if we disregard the possibility of management pushing half finished products instead of throwing in the brakes to get it right, it still looks fishy.

Something obviously is wrong but we cannot say for sure what it is.
What if the developers wanted to listen to the feedback, but management said "nope" ?
What if the developers were confident with the update schedule at first, but it turned out it was too much to keep up with and now there is an internal fight between the development teams and management?
What if the developers had a skewed view on what is going on in the game and their ideas on how to improve it were actually counter-productive, and now they have to face the consequences for possibly driving the company down?

We simply don't know.
All we can do is wait for official statements that explain what happened, similar to what was going on with Incarna. And of course, we can keep our feedback rolling while others cancel their subscriptions. Those are the only two things that will really matter in the end.

Still no patch for the icons and no new comment here in this post.

1) What was the opinion of our elected representatives (CSM) who do not log in here to speak?

2) What happens now with the icons? Will there be a choice between old and new?



CCP or one of the CSM-Members: Give us some good news, please.

HEY!!!! HELLO! TOC TOC TOC..... CCP,

CAN WE HAVE STATUS FOR ALL BUGS INCLUDING :

1- New Icons
2- Bad quality of Golem skins (basic skin and Kaalakiota skin)
3- Camera and option "Turn Tracking Camera = On"

Thank's for fast answer.... lol........and good day to you!

I don't need to. Inexperienced (in terms of software development) people tend to confuse the possibility of releasing fixes/changes frequently with the necessity of introducing new features frequently. A team can release what was finished in a sprint (I prefer the term iteration) and maintain a backlog of unfinished work for future iterations in a Scrum-like process much more easily than in monolithic releases.


Should I ever feel the need for (or even the slightest interest in) your blessing for anything I do, very successfully, I'll be sure to let you know.

do not forget about the tracking camera bug thats been around since the last "FIX"

CCP has to be reading this thread but why they don't respond is beyond me, the new icons are useless as well as a few other messes posted before me, it's the icons that made me unsub three accounts but the lack of caring for there paying member base is what will most likely keep me from coming back to Eve, I loved the game up to this point even with many other unneeded "fixes" before this but the longer this drags out with no response from CCP about a real fix for the icons (rollback or have them an option) the less I want to be involved with this game.

It looks as though another game will be getting my entertainment dollar very soon as it's a matter of days until all three of my accounts time runs out.

For real. Whiskey tango foxtrot, CCP? Give us the option to turn off your "improvements".

CSM - you're terrible. Resign.

I second this opinion.

Sadly, new icons and, especially, new map trade a lot of usability for 'fanciness'. This is frustrating for players that squeeze efficiency from UI. I am also concerned that UI deficiencies are not getting fixed in reasonable time frame. New map was made default some weeks ago, but until this very day it is simply no-go for scanning.

CCP should put a simple acceptance test for any important change to UI: can I use this efficiently when under time pressure and overloaded by in-game events.
Answering yes to this question would probably mean inertia in the map must go away. Spurious animations in the map probably must go away. Minute details here and there in the icons probably must go away. Circle may turn out to not be the best pointer after all. And d-scan support may end up being rather important part of the solar system map.
Or at least give us options that make scanning map a professional scanning map and overview icons a proper PVP icons.