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lol

You heard it here first people... It's confirmed! Some guy in local said so.

It's a lie.
The logs show nothing.

:D

Only way to top it is to announce removal of concord and police in hi-sec

Note that with 5ly jump range there's _no_ JF route from drone regions to highsec at all that goes near stations, none. There are only 2 stations in the Great Wildlands and they are not within jump range to either empire or drone regions. And you can't have Cynosural Arrays in Great Wildlands either, so you'd have to jump near a POS (and get ganked with 100% confidence by capital gankers watching for cynos with logged off stalker toons in every system and jumping 3 naglfars from a nearby NPC station and alphaing the JF instantly).

So JF logistics to drone regions will actually become more or less impossible.

So this will nerf the drone regions disproportionately compared to most other regions i think.

Stain will also get hit hard but at least there's a route through Catch/Providence.

If i were CCP I'd think about this for a minute before making such a drastic change, the map just doesn't seem to be designed for 5ly jumps.

So, after 7,700 posts, I guess CCP will just implement without changes? I mean, since it is such a simple and straight forward change, and everyone is in agreement. And I'm sure the CSM has now discussed ALL the changes, for more than 12 hours, since you didn't talk about 50% of this dev blog with them beforehand.

This has now had more debate than when T20 magicked T2 BPOs into existence. Maybe you guys could just do that instead.

But don't worry guys! They'll modify it to 'fix' it after it goes live. Just like Dominion Sov. And that door on your captains quarters. And POSes. and Super's ewar immunity. And anomalies. And war decs. And Faction Warfare. And heavy missiles. And the half a dozen hulls that nobody uses. And the blue donut. Oh wait, this is the fix for that, right? Yeah, totally trust they're going to fix this post patch.

So, 5 LY is too restrictive for you to get anything done, but everyone else will magically have their capital fleets within 5 LY of you when they want to gank you?

I find that highly unlikely. The crux of the rage in this thread is that people haven't spread their capital assets for short tactical jumps because they've never needed to previously. They teleported from across the cluster. Ergo, it's hard to believe that every nullsec boogeyman has a capital fleet within a 5 LY jump range of wherever you might go.

Why wouldn't they be?

To answer your question:
1. Null sec is not broken by any means, stagnant certainly, but not broken.
2. Power projection is an issue for smaller alliances, but there are 2 sides of a coin, nerfing power projection also sucks for those who have worked hard at getting it. But CCP is mainly concerned with the powerless small person, so i guess thats that.
Furthermore:
3. The proposed changes are, in my opinion, mostly ok/good. nerfing jump capability of capitals means that they could potentially become more used on a smaller scale. Which would be epic!!!
4. The fore mentioned power projection problem, as far as i understand it, lies with 200 archons, supers and titans dropping. Nerfing Jump freighters seems unnecessary. JF are used to haul everything including sub-cap ships. Nerfing this means that null-sec pvp will mostly die. Quite simply because its retardedly hard to get ships into null. Killing logistics also means death to the market and t2 production. Nerfing logistics makes eve a lot of effort and a lot less fun.
5. Carriers using gates; there are as many arguments for it than against it, but perhpas restrict carrier to only being able to use nullsec gates, and not lowsec. (same for supers)
6. Supers docking has been mentioned several times, I think it would be amazing, but no. The jump nerfing will make supers safer anyway, so no need to.
7. As for jump distance, 5LY is actually not so bad, but perhaps revisit the fatigue mechanics. I would suggest a 10min flat rate no-jump timer, AND then make the fatigue additive not exponential. This would restrict long distance travel in the power projection way that is being attempted here, but still allow for capital movement without it taking weeks.

This hopefully answers a question or two of what some discussions have resulted amongst players.

All in all, bring the proposed changes without the logi nerf.

Well you're partly right, but the poster was only referring to logistics - it is not wholly unreasonable to expect an approximately uniform nerf as opposed to certain areas suffering far worse.


Perhaps some new NPC stations are in order?

Still running on..... MY MYMY. Just caught up from a coupla days off and skimming threadzilla here Is easier. I know the trolls and block hater/posters and can generally ignore them. What is really shocking is the number of posters who don't understand how nullsec works at all. Posters who say "All the good systems are taken" are just comically ignorant. Good systems are BUILT. Level 4 and 5 upgrades boost the ratting, mining, and complex incomes of 'home' systems far beyond the old 'moon based' passive revenue system of days gone by. Anyone who thinks this is gonna alter the map has never watched whole alliances fall apart because their F1 pilots either balk, quit logging in, or just plain quit in the face of endless days and hours of bashing structures only to see them repped back up by the residents when you are asleep. Given the tools, and just a bit of help from the landlord, these much maligned renters almost always win the battle of wills with their invaders.... motivation is EVERYTHING here.


Speaking of grinding, that looks to be where the biggest changes will be. Having gotten a pretty good idea what my corpies and everyone in this thread thinks, I reached out to some older associates in chat and TS just to get some fresh input, and found concensus where I wasn't expecting it. It seems that plex grinding is gonna take the biggest hit. I've already gotten tired of it :).. my 3 accounts have been on the year sub plan since July. It was fashionable for a while, but just too much work:). Non 'boxing' players who maintain alts for manufacturing and logisticsare saying they will unsub many accounts. The logistic chaos is gonna seriously hamper T2 and POS fuel distribution. I find the wild schemes for the megacorps to raise an army of alts to move stuff funny. No one I talked to was gonna rage quit the game, but just about everyone with more than 2 or 3 accounts is gonna be dropping cyno and research alts. Caldari moon POSs are likely to be either shut down or replaced with locally fueled towers. Ratting is looking really good at this point. Cyno drops on pimped out rattlesnakes or carriers will be much less of a threat than before, and there is over a month left to slip in those level 5 military upgrades, so Isk per hour won't take that big a hit, aslong as you don't mind the rat parade. Who all remembers bounty inflation? Wormholes to hisec will provide limited logistics and access for basic necessities... the rent will get paid.... and life will go on. I got no volunteers to take a JF to hisec through gates :D.


It will be interesting to see where plex prices go. It looks like demand might really be off since once regular buyers will not be buying them, even for alt training, which will lose its urgency without the need for all that research or cyno fields. Possible inflation from high ratting incomes and lower production rates will probably not prop up plex prices since they are largely game market independent. What's really funny is that just about everybody talks about buying plex to use, but nobody talks about when they buy them to sell for Isk. It's kind of Eve's dirty little secret. Players who don't really like to do anything but PVP and have to sell plex to support their ship habit aren't likely to admit to this weakness. Of course we all know that SOMEONE has to buy plex from CCP in order for us to be able to buy them in game, but it seems to me that those who do aren't talking. So If plex prices DO drop, and those nice shiny Ishtars cost more from the T2 crunch, we surely won't hear any crying from the shipaholics. Or will we?

One thing the next few months will NOT be is BORING