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[Oceanus] Cyno Displacement Zone around starbases

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MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#221 - 2014-09-18 19:10:50 UTC
shimiku wrote:
now that we are at it why don't we just add this to station also and kill logistic



yes!!!! 1000 times yes!

Imagine you cant just use non kickout waypoint stations to insta cap your ships... every mid point would have to be those scarry safe spot ones where there is a huge risk of getting hot dropped.

0.0 is supposed to be full of risk at every corner... we need to remove all the safe tranport ability to properly nerf power projection.

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#222 - 2014-09-18 19:13:10 UTC  |  Edited by: MeBiatch
Hairpins Blueprint wrote:
cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy Shocked you wona kill low secQuestion no more jump freighters lol


IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics.

JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship.

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Jessica Duranin
Doomheim
#223 - 2014-09-18 19:18:43 UTC
Drak Fel wrote:
Jessica Duranin wrote:
Drak Fel wrote:
Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between.

Don't fly in between then? Roll


Because a titan has never bumped a little out of a shield. He should still be permitted to light a cyno to try to save himself when he is. This is bad for everyone with a super/titan, not just one group.

You can still have someone else light a cyno outside the 25km range. If you can't protect your caps you shouldn't be using them.
Drak Fel
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#224 - 2014-09-18 19:25:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Drak Fel
Jessica Duranin wrote:
Drak Fel wrote:
Jessica Duranin wrote:
Drak Fel wrote:
Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between.

Don't fly in between then? Roll


Because a titan has never bumped a little out of a shield. He should still be permitted to light a cyno to try to save himself when he is. This is bad for everyone with a super/titan, not just one group.

You can still have someone else light a cyno outside the 25km range. If you can't protect your caps you shouldn't be using them.



Because the only way to keep Eve's subscriber count rising is to create the artificial need for even more alt accounts?
Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate
#225 - 2014-09-18 19:36:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirk MacGirk
Drak Fel wrote:
You should really make it so that you can still light a cyno withing 25km but ships jumping in land beyond 25km.

Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between.


Very legitimate point here. Not allowing any cyno within 25km of the shields could be worked out slightly differently than proposed. the only thing that really matters is where the ships that cyno in are supposed to land
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#226 - 2014-09-18 19:42:09 UTC
Dirk MacGirk wrote:
Drak Fel wrote:
You should really make it so that you can still light a cyno withing 25km but ships jumping in land beyond 25km.

Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between.


Very legitimate point here, unless it is somehow covered by this part of Fozzie's remarks:

"If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno)."

Not sure how else a cyno could be active if it is a dead zone, unless it's referring to a cyno that is lit and coasts or is bumped into the dead zone.

pos was not online when the cyno was lit, so there was no forcefield creating a barrier, then the pos came online
Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate
#227 - 2014-09-18 19:47:41 UTC
Retar Aveymone wrote:
Dirk MacGirk wrote:
Drak Fel wrote:
You should really make it so that you can still light a cyno withing 25km but ships jumping in land beyond 25km.

Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between.


Very legitimate point here, unless it is somehow covered by this part of Fozzie's remarks:

"If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno)."

Not sure how else a cyno could be active if it is a dead zone, unless it's referring to a cyno that is lit and coasts or is bumped into the dead zone.

pos was not online when the cyno was lit, so there was no forcefield creating a barrier, then the pos came online


Yeah. Agreed that is what he meant
DaGreat Cornholio
Doomheim
#228 - 2014-09-18 19:54:07 UTC
Hmm what was it that nullsecers were telling wormholers with regard to the recent wormhole mass spew mechanic here:

Forum Post

I believe it was HTFU. Sounds like things have come full circle.
Alp Khan
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#229 - 2014-09-18 20:04:56 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
Hairpins Blueprint wrote:
cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy Shocked you wona kill low secQuestion no more jump freighters lol


IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics.

JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship.


While at it, why don't you ask CCP for a button to instantly teleport you on top of nearest JF in null space and automatically get it tackled for you?

You are not making any sense. Nobody would live in null if logistics was tangled with your weird vision.
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#230 - 2014-09-18 20:11:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Retar Aveymone
I have no fundamental problem with ending jumping to docking rings (though you'd need to do some thinking about if jump freighters would need a corresponding buff of some kind), but it seems silly to extend the discussion that far without figuring out what the goals are here.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#231 - 2014-09-18 20:13:18 UTC
Alp Khan wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
Hairpins Blueprint wrote:
cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy Shocked you wona kill low secQuestion no more jump freighters lol


IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics.

JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship.


While at it, why don't you ask CCP for a button to instantly teleport you on top of nearest JF in null space and automatically get it tackled for you?

You are not making any sense. Nobody would live in null if logistics was tangled with your weird vision.


So according to you no one lived in 0.0 before red moon rising?

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Alp Khan
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#232 - 2014-09-18 20:16:03 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
Alp Khan wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
Hairpins Blueprint wrote:
cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy Shocked you wona kill low secQuestion no more jump freighters lol


IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics.

JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship.


While at it, why don't you ask CCP for a button to instantly teleport you on top of nearest JF in null space and automatically get it tackled for you?

You are not making any sense. Nobody would live in null if logistics was tangled with your weird vision.


So according to you no one lived in 0.0 before red moon rising?


Null was a different place with different variables in logistics before Red Moon Rising. CCP moved away from that vision, to the current vision. Now, CCP has another vision that they are building towards with the player built stargates and all, but that is not a discussion pertaining to this forum thread.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#233 - 2014-09-18 20:18:25 UTC
Retar Aveymone wrote:
I have no fundamental problem with ending jumping to docking rings (though you'd need to do some thinking about if jump freighters would need a corresponding buff of some kind), but it seems silly to extend the discussion that far without figuring out what the goals are here.


I know people wont like it but IMO. Only tech 1 freighters should be able to hold regular non packaged items.

I would the make jump freighters have a 4million m3 sma instead.

If you want to import items up the 0.0 pipe from jita then you should need an escort fleet like in 2007.

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#234 - 2014-09-18 20:22:33 UTC
Alp Khan wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
Alp Khan wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
Hairpins Blueprint wrote:
cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy Shocked you wona kill low secQuestion no more jump freighters lol


IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics.

JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship.


While at it, why don't you ask CCP for a button to instantly teleport you on top of nearest JF in null space and automatically get it tackled for you?

You are not making any sense. Nobody would live in null if logistics was tangled with your weird vision.


So according to you no one lived in 0.0 before red moon rising?


Null was a different place with different variables in logistics before Red Moon Rising. CCP moved away from that vision, to the current vision. Now, CCP has another vision that they are building towards with the player built stargates and all, but that is not a discussion pertaining to this forum thread.


You mean null sec was a fun place back then. Logistics is one of tge main problems with emipre sprawl.

Jf are some of the most important components of 0.0 empires yet they do not generate content and do not die that often outside of low/high sec...


There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Jessica Duranin
Doomheim
#235 - 2014-09-18 20:38:38 UTC
Drak Fel wrote:
Jessica Duranin wrote:

You can still have someone else light a cyno outside the 25km range. If you can't protect your caps you shouldn't be using them.



Because the only way to keep Eve's subscriber count rising is to create the artificial need for even more alt accounts?

Yep. They already did it to w-space. Now it's your turn to feel the pain. Twisted
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#236 - 2014-09-18 20:52:40 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
Retar Aveymone wrote:
I have no fundamental problem with ending jumping to docking rings (though you'd need to do some thinking about if jump freighters would need a corresponding buff of some kind), but it seems silly to extend the discussion that far without figuring out what the goals are here.


I know people wont like it but IMO. Only tech 1 freighters should be able to hold regular non packaged items.

I would the make jump freighters have a 4million m3 sma instead.

If you want to import items up the 0.0 pipe from jita then you should need an escort fleet like in 2007.

freighter ops were stupid as all ******* hell in 2007 and have gotten no better since

plus the thing that carries packaged ships already exists, it's called a carrier
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#237 - 2014-09-18 20:54:15 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:

Jf are some of the most important components of 0.0 empires yet they do not generate content and do not die that often outside of low/high sec...



the content that does exist in 0.0 exists only because of jump freighters, and although there's little content in killing or saving them they are a necessary factor in any other content
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#238 - 2014-09-18 21:02:58 UTC
Retar Aveymone wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:

Jf are some of the most important components of 0.0 empires yet they do not generate content and do not die that often outside of low/high sec...



the content that does exist in 0.0 exists only because of jump freighters, and although there's little content in killing or saving them they are a necessary factor in any other content


so you are saying that the current stagnation of null sec is contributed threw safe logistics and if this was changed would act as a paragim shift in the way 0.0 works?

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#239 - 2014-09-18 21:06:34 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
Retar Aveymone wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:

Jf are some of the most important components of 0.0 empires yet they do not generate content and do not die that often outside of low/high sec...



the content that does exist in 0.0 exists only because of jump freighters, and although there's little content in killing or saving them they are a necessary factor in any other content


so you are saying that the current stagnation of null sec is contributed threw safe logistics and if this was changed would act as a paragim shift in the way 0.0 works?

i am saying what i posted, not whatever nonsense you understood

logistics that exist in a way that permits transport of goods to and from highsec in volumes and effort levels that only jump freighters can supply is an absolute necessity for any content in 0.0

you can tweak the safety in which they do so (though that is an increase in effort and can cause issues if not balanced) but the idea of going back to freighter ops is one of those mind-bogglingly stupid ideas only ever put forth by people who have never been on a freighter op
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#240 - 2014-09-18 21:09:58 UTC
it also requires a stupendous amount of poor thinking to think that freighter ops would benefit the little guy

we could do freighter ops: the various small groups we fight who live in npc null could not (and would quickly run out of stuff)