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Containers and Industry

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CCP Nullarbor
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1 - 2014-07-24 14:26:09 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Logibro
We deployed an update today so that blueprints and materials can be used from secure + audit secure containers, while respecting corporation hangar roles.

An exception to this is password protected containers. If a container is password protected and configured to not allow it to be opened without the password, then any blueprints inside will NOT appear in the blueprint browser. You can right click a blueprint from the container and view in the industry UI to preview it, however it cannot be submitted from this location. Similarly you cannot use materials in password protected containers.

For anyone who has a lot of blueprints that you would prefer to not show in the blueprint browser, putting them in a station container with a password is simple way of excluding them. We are discussing alternative methods of doing this as well.

If you have any thoughts on the behavior of containers + industry, let us know in this thread.

CCP Nullarbor // Senior Engineer // Team Game of Drones
Shoogie
Serious Pixels
#2 - 2014-07-24 14:31:19 UTC
Oh nice. I just need a couple dozen small secure containers to sort all my BPCs now.
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#3 - 2014-07-24 15:00:12 UTC
re read the sisi threads, there were tons of ideas. None got implemented, but they were there

Boxes for categories like in contracts
Tabs of the pos modules

Those are 2 off the top of my head, I don't remember the rest

Maybe something BEFORE it tries to search for every blueprint in the friggin galaxy you own so your client doesn't lock up for the first few minutes while it finds everything, then you have to pare it down.


Set search parameters, THEN search for those items
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#4 - 2014-07-24 15:03:04 UTC
Also, for the record, you want to know what SUCKS about password protected containers

THEY CAN'T GO IN FREIGHTERS or JUMP FREIGHTERS

I long ago ditched every container that wasn't a freight container because it sucked to have stuff in a container and not be able to put it in a ship

I do have some station warehouses, but you can't get them to a pos cause they won't fit into anything that undocks
Balaster McNugget
Into The Plasma Inc
#5 - 2014-07-24 15:15:37 UTC
ya I never understood the container restrictions on freighters. Like "sorry Miss, but your purse doesn't fit on this train".
Industrious Mistress
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2014-07-24 17:44:27 UTC
Wow you guys decided to just mess up all of the industry in the game with this expansion huh...I can only imagine the CCP team meeting on this expansion..."ok guys, how can me screw over the entire logistical backbone of the game? How can we force the people in the sandbox to play in nulsec where we want them? Oh lets entirely change the industry of the game! Lets install a horrible UI that takes up 2/3 of the screen with useless information and blocks out all the useful info at the bottom 1/3, then lets make it as complicated as possible to use BPOs and while were at it lets make it super dangerous to use any valuable BPOs! I know its a sandbox, but those industry pilots in high sec are just not playing the game correctly, so lets force them into the Nul sec game, that sounds like a good idea!"

Thanks CCP for helping us high sec industry pilots! Thanks for helping keep the game running with low scale industry in high sec and not forcing people to play a certain style of play, I mean it is a sandbox right.

Oh yea and thanks CCp for giving me a reason to look for another MMO to play...wow this expansion was an EPIC FAIL!
Mal Isbad
House Of Serenity.
#7 - 2014-07-24 18:43:34 UTC
Thanks for that helpful reply.

It would be nice to be able to use password secured containers with freighters and jump freighters. There is no logical reason why it can't happen (might be difficult in the code).
CCP Nullarbor
C C P
C C P Alliance
#8 - 2014-07-24 19:19:16 UTC
Mal Isbad wrote:
Thanks for that helpful reply.

It would be nice to be able to use password secured containers with freighters and jump freighters. There is no logical reason why it can't happen (might be difficult in the code).


I will mention containers in freighters to a few people (Fozzie would be best to make a call on this) however I am more specifically interested in the use of containers for installing jobs from / to, since that is what we updated in Crius.

CCP Nullarbor // Senior Engineer // Team Game of Drones
CCP Nullarbor
C C P
C C P Alliance
#9 - 2014-07-24 19:21:00 UTC
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Boxes for categories like in contracts


Yep we agree, and will likely add this in an update next week.

Kenneth Feld wrote:
Tabs of the pos modules


If you mean corp divisions then yes you can already do that if you first select a facility.

CCP Nullarbor // Senior Engineer // Team Game of Drones
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#10 - 2014-07-24 19:36:38 UTC
CCP Nullarbor wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Boxes for categories like in contracts


Yep we agree, and will likely add this in an update next week.

Kenneth Feld wrote:
Tabs of the pos modules


If you mean corp divisions then yes you can already do that if you first select a facility.


Selecting the facility is what takes 12 minutes

Chicken <----> Egg
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#11 - 2014-07-24 19:38:58 UTC
CCP Nullarbor wrote:
Mal Isbad wrote:
Thanks for that helpful reply.

It would be nice to be able to use password secured containers with freighters and jump freighters. There is no logical reason why it can't happen (might be difficult in the code).


I will mention containers in freighters to a few people (Fozzie would be best to make a call on this) however I am more specifically interested in the use of containers for installing jobs from / to, since that is what we updated in Crius.



That is also the same thing

Q: How will i get a password protected can to a pos if it can't fit in a freighter

A: I won't


Therefore saying to use them is pointless, cause they will never be there no matter how convenient you make it, cause inevitable when I take the POS down, i will cuss for hours trying to fins something to come pick up the one F$%^$% can I can get rid of to unanchor a module
Dread Nanana
Doomheim
#12 - 2014-07-25 01:31:34 UTC
Kenneth Feld wrote:
CCP Nullarbor wrote:
[quote=Mal Isbad]Thanks for that helpful reply.

It would be nice to be able to use password secured containers with freighters and jump freighters. There is no logical reason why it can't happen (might be difficult in the code).

/quote]

That is also the same thing

Q: How will i get a password protected can to a pos if it can't fit in a freighter
A: I won't




You can be a pro and use

https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Small_Secure_Container Idea

and you can fit over 100 of these in even something as small as a blockade runner.
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#13 - 2014-07-25 02:31:28 UTC
Dread Nanana wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
CCP Nullarbor wrote:
[quote=Mal Isbad]Thanks for that helpful reply.

It would be nice to be able to use password secured containers with freighters and jump freighters. There is no logical reason why it can't happen (might be difficult in the code).

/quote]

That is also the same thing

Q: How will i get a password protected can to a pos if it can't fit in a freighter
A: I won't




You can be a pro and use

https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Small_Secure_Container Idea

and you can fit over 100 of these in even something as small as a blockade runner.



Even though you **CAN** fit prolly thousands in a freighter, this is what happens when you try:

http://imgur.com/csq43yU

We have some lovely parting gifts

NOW, if you could repackage at a pos, that would work, but I think pigs would fly first
Orovana
Infinity Works
#14 - 2014-07-25 10:40:38 UTC
On the topic of containers and industry I have noticed the following bug:

Example:
1.Install number of manufacturing jobs to produce the same item (my case 10 jobs t2 modules)
2.Make them to be delivered in specific container ( my case station vault)
3.When jobs are done press deliver.
4.Open delivery container and the items are there in neat stacks per job, e.g. 10 stacs of 10 modules.

5. Problem: open right click menu press "stack all" command

Results
1. The first time I noticed this none of the stacs moved even an inch as like they were locked and they are not. Manual stacking, e.g. via the mouse worked without a problem.
This happend yesterday

2. The second time I have seen this was that the 10 stacks get together in 1x 100 stack of items but refused to stack with the items of the same type in that container. Again manual stacking worked.
This happend today.

Maybe this should be looked into.. don`t know :)
Dearthair
Goibhniu Industries
#15 - 2014-07-25 12:41:34 UTC
I love the idea and utility of organizing BPOs and BPCs in containers at my POS. I am really irritated that I have to move those containers to a ship if I want to manage the contents of those containers. If using small containers to sort BPs at a POS is going to be the norm (and for any large industrialist, NOT using containers for the massive piles of BPs would be insane) then we need to be able to access the contents of containers inside POS arrays.

Some example use cases:

We have our BPOs sorted into containers inside the design lab to make copies, but need to produce directly from that BPO because we haven't had time to make copies of everything yet. We have to make sure we are in a ship that can fit small containers, move that container to the ship, find the correct BPO, and move it to the building array.

We have our BPCs sorted by container in the design lab, with output from copy jobs going directly to the correct container. We then need to go through the same process in order to move BPCs we intend to produce from to the building arrays.

NBLID (Not Blue Let It Die), the new motto for miners, manufacturers, and retailers everywhere.
Azarion Sinak
678 lost souls
#16 - 2014-07-26 02:34:05 UTC
Ok, found a cute problem:

Decided to play with the building to a container. I already had a few station containers laying around, so I picked one as a target for my 10 new shiney iteron V's. Diidnt even think about size restriction, and the interface certainly didn't bark.

Now that they are completed, it wont deliver them to the container since it isn't big enough, nor can I redirect them to a bigger container or hanger.

I went and bought a station vault container and renamed it to the original targets name, but that didn't have any effect, assuming its the internal ID's of the items that are connected.

So... how do I get the product delivered?
Oxide Ammar
#17 - 2014-07-26 13:38:50 UTC
Can we pls make the default output location is the same container that I picked the BPO to research from, when you are dealing with thousands of BPO in containers and every time I have BPO to research, I have to select the output container for every job for every time.

If BPOs are already organised in containers in the lab, most likely you want the BPO to return to the same container otherwise you will choose different location. Quality of life buff pls.

Lady Areola Fappington:  Solo PVP isn't dead!  You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
CCP Nullarbor
C C P
C C P Alliance
#18 - 2014-07-27 16:38:48 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Nullarbor
Azarion Sinak wrote:
Ok, found a cute problem:

Decided to play with the building to a container. I already had a few station containers laying around, so I picked one as a target for my 10 new shiney iteron V's. Diidnt even think about size restriction, and the interface certainly didn't bark.

Now that they are completed, it wont deliver them to the container since it isn't big enough, nor can I redirect them to a bigger container or hanger.

I went and bought a station vault container and renamed it to the original targets name, but that didn't have any effect, assuming its the internal ID's of the items that are connected.

So... how do I get the product delivered?


Yeah this is slightly annoying, if you move the container away from that division it will deliver into the division instead.

EDIT: Or move the container into your ship if its a personal hangar in a station.

I would like to add an option so you could change the output location before you deliver, but we won't be able to add that until a later release this year.

CCP Nullarbor // Senior Engineer // Team Game of Drones
CCP Nullarbor
C C P
C C P Alliance
#19 - 2014-07-27 16:40:47 UTC
Dearthair wrote:
I love the idea and utility of organizing BPOs and BPCs in containers at my POS. I am really irritated that I have to move those containers to a ship if I want to manage the contents of those containers. If using small containers to sort BPs at a POS is going to be the norm (and for any large industrialist, NOT using containers for the massive piles of BPs would be insane) then we need to be able to access the contents of containers inside POS arrays.

Some example use cases:

We have our BPOs sorted into containers inside the design lab to make copies, but need to produce directly from that BPO because we haven't had time to make copies of everything yet. We have to make sure we are in a ship that can fit small containers, move that container to the ship, find the correct BPO, and move it to the building array.

We have our BPCs sorted by container in the design lab, with output from copy jobs going directly to the correct container. We then need to go through the same process in order to move BPCs we intend to produce from to the building arrays.


This is very much in the realm of "ugh POSes", fortunately we will be having a serious look at them once this industry work is finished up.

CCP Nullarbor // Senior Engineer // Team Game of Drones
Fyrehn
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2014-07-27 20:53:57 UTC
I would like for secure and audit secure containers to function as they would in a hangar, at a POS.

Currently we are unable to open the containers in the Lab Hangar.

If we had the ability to control access to each container by a password set by each member, the POS would actually benefit all members of our corp without too much work.
They should also be listed by password or not, so you would only see the blueprints in containers you've entered the password for.


This would allow each member to safely store their blueprints, and to reclaim them at any given time.
It would also remove the need for much work with corporation management.
The only issue is the ability to deliver any job installed on behalf of the corporation.
Either a new role, junior factory managed would allow view of all jobs, and deliver for jobs you submitted.
Or remove the ability to deliver all jobs except CEO and Directors.
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