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New Marauders and Incursions.

Author
Xequecal
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#21 - 2014-05-02 17:44:44 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

It was an incredibly stupid design, with predictable results.
End of story.

do you remember what happened the last time you said that?


I was proven right, yet again?


People had issues with your posts because you insisted the new Marauders would be worse at literally everything, not just incursions. They are much better than they were at PvP in general, level 4 missions, and WH PvE, and you insisted that they would be worse at all of these.
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
#22 - 2014-05-02 18:18:25 UTC
Xequecal wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

It was an incredibly stupid design, with predictable results.
End of story.

do you remember what happened the last time you said that?


I was proven right, yet again?


People had issues with your posts because you insisted the new Marauders would be worse at literally everything, not just incursions. They are much better than they were at PvP in general, level 4 missions, and WH PvE, and you insisted that they would be worse at all of these.

And then,
enter stage left:ccp fozzy with statisticsBig smile
Arronicus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#23 - 2014-05-03 01:12:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Arronicus
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
As detailed when the idiotic Bastion module was first introduced, no self-respecting Incursion FC will seriously entertain a Bastioned Marauder, unless the fleet is running under it's cap of pilots.

The capacitor requirements and tank modules required completely gimp the effective DPS of the ship.
And yes, 11 Bastioned Marauders will still get owned by 9 DPS / 2 Logi in VG's, and Bastioned ships can't tank Assaults.

If they were so great, the major incursion channels would have adopted them by now.
And they have not.

It was an incredibly stupid design, with predictable results.
End of story.


Fortunately, this is very wrong. Bastioned vargur fleets will outperform any other fleet for VGs. They have ridiculous damage projection, cruiser level tracking, and can fit a solid tank without the need to sacrifice much dps, or field logi. As a result, a bastioned vargur fleet will outperform any other same number of ships composition, for VGs.

But then, you have proven time and time again, to completely ignore facts, in favour of your own silly beliefs.
Darvanile
Immortal's Council
#24 - 2014-05-05 13:18:31 UTC
Armor fleets are happy to accept paladins in most scenarios. However, a bastion set up will be frowned upon. Its not a matter of it not being viable, just more a matter of it not being necessary. You wont be able to tank the upper level sites, and your damage will suffer from trying to make yourself viable under the pressure of neuts. Do not let this discourage you however. The dps a paladin can put out is very respectable, and its engagement range makes it easy to fit for any level of incursion site. You will be a welcome addition to a fleet! Join the Ditanian Fleet armor mailing list to find out more about acceptable paladin fits.
Dorian Wylde
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#25 - 2014-05-05 22:04:47 UTC
Last Wolf wrote:
11 Marauders that each need to be able to solo tank the entire VG, will have less dps/tracking/webs/painters than 9 ships fully fit for dps/tracking/webs/painters and can leave the tanking up to the 2 logis.

Not to mention mobility if the NPC's get out of range.... All the the Incursions fleets I've ever joined required an AB/MWD to be fit.



Putting aside the fact that the Bastion module also vastly increases the range of your weapons, if everyone is clustered together why would the NPCs be out of range? Granted I haven't done incursions in a couple years, but I'm pretty sure they never fly away unless you're jamming them.
Reiisha
#26 - 2014-05-06 14:23:25 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
As detailed when the idiotic Bastion module was first introduced, no self-respecting Incursion FC will seriously entertain a Bastioned Marauder, unless the fleet is running under it's cap of pilots.

The capacitor requirements and tank modules required completely gimp the effective DPS of the ship.
And yes, 11 Bastioned Marauders will still get owned by 9 DPS / 2 Logi in VG's, and Bastioned ships can't tank Assaults.

If they were so great, the major incursion channels would have adopted them by now.
And they have not.

It was an incredibly stupid design, with predictable results.
End of story.


They were designed for solo PvE...

What a surprise they're not as good for incursions as other ships without this specific design focus. Why complain about bastion when you've got so many other ships you can use?

If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all...

FunGu Arsten
Ascendance
Goonswarm Federation
#27 - 2014-06-18 18:19:46 UTC
Paladins work great - vargurs op..
2low +1rig on paladin - 1 repper +crystal set on vargur

How is this wasting slots.... With 11/12dos on the grid...

Somany baddies here
Lunkwill Khashour
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#28 - 2014-06-18 19:27:46 UTC
The Incurions Guild is a group that runs Vanguards with nothing but bastioned Vargurs, Kroni and Paladins.

A pimped out Vargur will tank an Assault but it's not very viable getting 20 of those on the same grid.

Apart from the bastion module, the Paladin especially is a welcome sight for armor fleets. The Kronos tends to be worse than the Vindicator and the Vargur is comparable to a Machariel.
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