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Erica Dusette
Division 13
#6561 - 2014-03-27 23:18:06 UTC
Xuixien wrote:
I clicked on your avatar and I have to say that I'm impressed and inspired. You should join that avatar competition thing they have. I think it's annual or biannual.

Thanks! Oops

Confirming the whole Dusette family and our associated lackeys/alts have been entered!

Minus our fugly brother.

Jack Miton > you be nice or you're sleeping on the couch again!

Part-Time Wormhole Pirate ツ Full-Time Supermodel

▷ worмнole dιary + cнaracтer вιoѕ ▷ вσss
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#6562 - 2014-03-27 23:19:12 UTC
Bloodmyst Ranwar wrote:
Kristalll wrote:
Bloodmyst Ranwar wrote:


Well I suggest the following.

Step 1

Permanently Ban Eroticas account and make an example of him. Let the Eve community base know that bullying is not tolerated. It does not matter what is in the EULA or TOS, rules or any contracts... If people need rules for morals, let them learn the hard way. Referring to the EULA\TOS as an excuse to bullying others is pathetic. I'm sure I speak for many when I say this, if CCP wants to promote Eve as a platform for Bullying, you can consider many accounts to be closed. I for one, do not want to be apart of a community or game that will accept this filth. To make matters even worse, this recording was released to the public, subject to further humiliation and bullying!

Step 2

Temporary Ban Sohkars account. Simple, people say things when provoked. Yes, it's not acceptable what Sohkar said in the recording. However, this behavior can be expected of "many people" when put in similar situations. You corner a dog, and it's going to bite. The fact is, Sohkar wouldn't of said such things in the first place if he wasn't dragged through the mud for 2 hours. The guy was already scammed, why does 2 hours of bullying need to follow?


I'm just interested for CCP's official response. Surely, they will not allow Eve to be used as a platform for this vile, filthy, inhumane behavior. If so, I'm not so sure if I want to stick around and see what happens in future.




So what do we do about Graath https://soundcloud.com/johny-snow/pl-comms-after-revenant-loss ?


So what do we do about the dog beating on the cat down the road?...... We are here discussing the case at hand. There are many other threads to derail and/or troll available.


So what you're saying is that this is a witch trial.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Muestereate
Minions LLC
#6563 - 2014-03-27 23:19:23 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
Muestereate wrote:
I see the intellect of the conversation has gone down a notch or three.

People don't agree with me, the conversation now sucks!



Why do you suppose that is? seriously.

My personal opinion is starting to be that its a form of avoidance. WHen confronted with conflicts, external and internal, the instinctual fight or flight reponse kicks in. Since we are not animals, the escape is veiled. I still can't catch its new drift but I suppose that the people that have enjoyed making other people feel bad about themselves in the past are starting to see a bit of themselves.

But theres a few new conversations going.
Kristalll
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6564 - 2014-03-27 23:20:27 UTC
Coffee Rocks wrote:
H aVo K wrote:
Dani Dusette wrote:
But it's legit gameplay within the boundary of this game. Unlike the issue which this thread is about.


Maybe you can answer where so many have failed, then:

What makes this gameplay less legit than other acceptable types of "tear extraction"?


Go back and read the last 220+ pages and numerous blog posts that are now out there on this subject (Ripard, myself, Mabrik, etc etc). It's been said.

Also, NOT gameplay.

Scamming? Gameplay. Drawing the victim out till he snaps? F**king sick.


I admittedly haven't read all 300 pages, but I have read a lot, and as of yet, I can't find any explanations of what the difference is.

Your last paragraph assumes the goal is to get the "victim" to snap and that all actions are taken to get them to snap. This couldn't be further from the truth.

“Die trying” is the proudest human thing.
Salvos Rhoska
#6565 - 2014-03-27 23:21:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
Apparently in every Bonus Room the following question is asked as part of the required tasks:

"What if this was all just some sort of elaborate scam, what would you do next?"

So far Kristalll, Riot Girl, Scipio Artelius, Danalee, Xuixien have all been UNABLE to provide the correct answer for this.

If these people, many of which whom are very associated with the Bonus Room, cannot even provide the correct answer, then its not really likely that some random participant they sucker up the victim selection process is going to be able to either, is it.

I know it sad for them.
The ISK they fleece through this, and the suffering they so dearly need to fap to, could all now potentially be lost.

But you will adapt. That is what EVE is about, afterall.

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
H aVo K
Tycheon Industries
#6566 - 2014-03-27 23:21:23 UTC
Coffee Rocks wrote:
H aVo K wrote:
Dani Dusette wrote:
But it's legit gameplay within the boundary of this game. Unlike the issue which this thread is about.


Maybe you can answer where so many have failed, then:

What makes this gameplay less legit than other acceptable types of "tear extraction"?


Go back and read the last 220+ pages and numerous blog posts that are now out there on this subject (Ripard, myself, Mabrik, etc etc). It's been said.

Also, NOT gameplay.

Scamming? Gameplay. Drawing the victim out till he snaps? F**king sick.


So if a coalition comes into my rental space and camps me in station, while taunting me in local until I snap... does that count? Or does it only count if they record it on teamspeak?
Sapheni
Black Moon Mining
#6567 - 2014-03-27 23:21:51 UTC
Kristalll wrote:
Sapheni wrote:
LUMINOUS SPIRIT wrote:
Look what Microsoft is doing in cases like this:

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-26766098

EVE should do similar.


Obviously it would need something to prevent abuse, but the concept is good. In EVE players with a red card could lose forum posting and local posting 'privileges'. No more forum trolls and no more scammers in Jita. Self regulation 4tw.


So essentially you can clean the forums of all dissenting opinions!

Brilliant!


No, just the trolls. Although there might be some collateral damage and we'd lose the frequent posters who aren't trolls (if there are any), but that would be no great loss. 30 red cards would probably be enough to restore the EVE forums to the nice warm fuzzy place they used to be pre-2006.
Kristalll
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6568 - 2014-03-27 23:21:55 UTC
Bloodmyst Ranwar wrote:



So what do we do about Graath https://soundcloud.com/johny-snow/pl-comms-after-revenant-loss ?
[/quote]

So what do we do about the dog beating on the cat down the road?...... We are here discussing the case at hand. There are many other threads to derail and/or troll available.[/quote]


Obviously the point went over your head.

Why is politely making requests of someone harassment and should be bannable, while Graath spent a good while verbally berating someone and that is celebrated as entertainment?

“Die trying” is the proudest human thing.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#6569 - 2014-03-27 23:21:59 UTC
Danalee wrote:
Disclaimer: As my previous posts, this is not a derail.
I will however take my tongue out of my cheeck where it has been lodged for the past few days.

This girl posted some bad things about EVE online and it's playerbase.
CCP hires her.
Everyone grabs a pitchfork and tries to burn her at the stake.
CCP defends her and steps in hard on everyone commenting on the topic.

A guy drunkenly tells someone to kill himself at fanfest.
Everyone grabs a pitchfork and tries to burn him at the stake.
He becomes the most powerfull dude in the universe and is more popular asked by the media than actual game devs.

This other dude totally humiliates a fellow player and calls him retarted.
Nobody moves.
Suddenly I see this guy commentating an official EVE tournament.

A guy gets shouted at by a racist for asking said racist to sing a song.
Nobody moves.
A CSM member a month later reposts said recording and adds to it: THIS IS TORTURE
Everyone grabs a pitchfork and tries to burn him at the stake.

That's what has been happening over the years. There are many more examples. Please stop with the double/tripple standards. Please stop with your faux-offended reactions, please just enjoy our game.
Don't try to fix what isn't broken and get some perspective.

D. OUT (for now)

Bear


Yes but in this case, the "victim" got REALLY MAD!!!!

That makes it wrong, because we're all responsible for other people's subjective feelings.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Erica Dusette
Division 13
#6570 - 2014-03-27 23:22:46 UTC
H aVo K wrote:
Dani Dusette wrote:
But it's legit gameplay within the boundary of this game. Unlike the issue which this thread is about.


Maybe you can answer where so many have failed, then:

What makes this gameplay less legit than other acceptable types of "tear extraction"?

Do I really have to go all text walls again? Straight

I did my serious posting yesterday, I'd really just like to interject with spam today.

Jack Miton > you be nice or you're sleeping on the couch again!

Part-Time Wormhole Pirate ツ Full-Time Supermodel

▷ worмнole dιary + cнaracтer вιoѕ ▷ вσss
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#6571 - 2014-03-27 23:23:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Xuixien
Sapheni wrote:
Kristalll wrote:
Sapheni wrote:
LUMINOUS SPIRIT wrote:
Look what Microsoft is doing in cases like this:

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-26766098

EVE should do similar.


Obviously it would need something to prevent abuse, but the concept is good. In EVE players with a red card could lose forum posting and local posting 'privileges'. No more forum trolls and no more scammers in Jita. Self regulation 4tw.


So essentially you can clean the forums of all dissenting opinions!

Brilliant!


No, just the trolls. Although there might be some collateral damage and we'd lose the frequent posters who aren't trolls (if there are any), but that would be no great loss. 30 red cards would probably be enough to restore the EVE forums to the nice warm fuzzy place they used to be pre-2006.


I go to bed every night and that small part of me that's dedicated to thinking about EVE when I'm not actually playing is filled with fuzzy warmth knowing that no one like you and your ilk will ever become a GM or Dev or have any influence or impact upon the game besides making whiny call for "street justice" style posts on the forums.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Effect One
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6572 - 2014-03-27 23:23:37 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Effect One wrote:
Go and find a legal definition of torture if you want to discuss legal principles.


Amnesty International is the world leader in legal counsel on matters of human rights.

If you wish to provide other definitions, feel free to do so.

Have you read the link submitted in my sig?


No. If you wish to play the part of the internet lawyer and attempt to formulate a real world legal argument to tackle an in game event, you may source your own legal definitions. Sadly, a quote from Amnesty International is not such a definition.

If Erotica1's Bonus Room is to be closed as per previous posts I think that is a sad turn of events and a fruitless one also. Others will fill the void I am sure; two parts of the human condition that can always be relied upon in order to make easy ISK are idiocy and greed.

I may even start my own bonus room.

'This might be internet spaceships, but it's not rocket science to protect yourself and fly with a little common sense' - CCP Falcon
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#6573 - 2014-03-27 23:25:33 UTC
Effect One wrote:
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Effect One wrote:
Go and find a legal definition of torture if you want to discuss legal principles.


Amnesty International is the world leader in legal counsel on matters of human rights.

If you wish to provide other definitions, feel free to do so.

Have you read the link submitted in my sig?


No. If you wish to play the part of the internet lawyer and attempt to formulate a real world legal argument to tackle an in game event, you may source your own legal definitions. Sadly, a quote from Amnesty International is not such a definition.


Rekt, dunkt, servd and rolld.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
H aVo K
Tycheon Industries
#6574 - 2014-03-27 23:26:27 UTC
Ssieth wrote:
H aVo K wrote:
Dani Dusette wrote:
But it's legit gameplay within the boundary of this game. Unlike the issue which this thread is about.


Maybe you can answer where so many have failed, then:

What makes this gameplay less legit than other acceptable types of "tear extraction"?


OK - I'll take a punt at this one.

Other types of 'tear extraction' - ganking etc is generally about targetting in-game assets in-game. It is an extension of other in-game activities.

This is about enticing someone to an external comms channel for the specific purpose of publically humiliating them.


is that the line, then? The fact that public humiliation was the end-state sought by those pulling the scam, rather than just a byproduct of whatever they were doing?
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#6575 - 2014-03-27 23:26:46 UTC
Besides OP and any CSM or CCP representative, is there anyone in this thread who has only posted once?

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Salvos Rhoska
#6576 - 2014-03-27 23:27:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
Effect One wrote:
you may source your own legal definitions.


I have sourced it.

The post that is linked in my sig is written on the definition provided therein.

@ Xuixien: You scared you might lose your ISK income from this? No more fapfap to listening to peoples suffering?
Getting a little desperate?

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#6577 - 2014-03-27 23:27:57 UTC
H aVo K wrote:
Ssieth wrote:
H aVo K wrote:
Dani Dusette wrote:
But it's legit gameplay within the boundary of this game. Unlike the issue which this thread is about.


Maybe you can answer where so many have failed, then:

What makes this gameplay less legit than other acceptable types of "tear extraction"?


OK - I'll take a punt at this one.

Other types of 'tear extraction' - ganking etc is generally about targetting in-game assets in-game. It is an extension of other in-game activities.

This is about enticing someone to an external comms channel for the specific purpose of publically humiliating them.


is that the line, then? The fact that public humiliation was the end-state sought by those pulling the scam, rather than just a byproduct of whatever they were doing?


So Bonus Rounds would be okay, then, if they took place within the game client?

Seems like a pretty arbitrary line to me.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Coffee Rocks
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6578 - 2014-03-27 23:28:18 UTC
Danalee wrote:
Disclaimer: As my previous posts, this is not relevant

A sociopath gets shouted at by a victim for torturing him.
Nobody moves.
A CSM member a month later reposts said recording and adds to it: THIS IS TORTURE
Everyone grabs a pitchfork and tries to burn him at the stake.

D. OUT (for now)

Bear


*puts his thumbs in his bibs* Yar... that thar wus broke *spits* so I went and fixt it fer ya.

Here's the thing. I didn't know this thing existed till Ripard posted it. Everyone I've talked to claims the same.

As CSM member, he did his job by pointing out a subject that needs debated to the player base. The fact that we reacted so strongly was surprising to him, obviously surprising to you, and probably a wee bit to the folks responsible for this crap.

Now that it's in the spotlight you can't put it back in the dark, no matter how much they want to try. Now that we see how ugly this is, no amount of painting it another color will help you to hide it.

It took a month, but we've seen it now. It's dominating the conversation on twitter. It's causing the bloggers to express their thoughts. It has made gaming news.

Ban him, those involved in the bonus room crap, and all alt accounts.

You never fly alone - Broadcast 4 Reps | Twitter: @thecoffeerocks | Steam: CoffeeRocks
Kaisen Anabuki
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#6579 - 2014-03-27 23:28:56 UTC
Xuixien wrote:
Besides OP and any CSM or CCP representative, is there anyone in this thread who has only posted once?


Me Lol
Mario Putzo
#6580 - 2014-03-27 23:29:23 UTC
Muestereate wrote:
Mario Putzo wrote:
Muestereate wrote:
I see the intellect of the conversation has gone down a notch or three.

People don't agree with me, the conversation now sucks!



Why do you suppose that is? seriously.

My personal opinion is starting to be that its a form of avoidance. WHen confronted with conflicts, external and internal, the instinctual fight or flight reponse kicks in. Since we are not animals, the escape is veiled. I still can't catch its new drift but I suppose that the people that have enjoyed making other people feel bad about themselves in the past are starting to see a bit of themselves.

But theres a few new conversations going.


Whats your point man. Your opinion should be the base line for what is and is not allowable in the game? Give me a break, you white knights are worse for this game than ANY number of Erotica 1's.

If you want to go play the bitchmade kiddyland games, go sub to WoW or hop on one of the Free to play piles of **** so poorly designed they couldn't retain even a paying community.

There has been worse things than the bonus room in EVE's 10 years, and there will be worse things than this bonus room over the next 10 years. If you do not like the fact that you can get scammed and made fun of while it happens, don't associate with known scammers.

Sohkar made his own bed, he had EVERY chance to just leave, in fact he did and came back. It is no ones fault but his own.
If he was so upset about it. Why isn't he in here telling us all how bad the experience was. Why didn't he make a thread about how much of an evil person Erotica 1 is.

What gives you the authority to white knight on his behalf? Did he ask you to come here? Did Sohkar ask Ripard to make an extensive blog about his experience? Did Sohkar make any comment at all in that blog or is it just Ripard, like you projecting your opinion on the other several hundred thousand players in this community?

If you don't like the fact someone can scam you and laugh in your face while you WILLINGLY give them all your assets, Go find a different game that caters to your Candy Land Morality.