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Jester Trek Latest Blog

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Remiel Pollard
Shock Treatment Ministries
#2461 - 2014-03-26 11:18:31 UTC
Prie Mary wrote:
Just ban the narcissistic psychopath and be done with it. The only reason he is showing any kind of rational reasoning is because he has realised this might impact on him. Typical psychopathic behaviour


Actually, a typical psychopath would be much less likely to care about public opinion. And like you and half of this thread can talk. The bias is so blatantly obvious I'd be surprised if anyone could pry an ounce of rationality out of all of you combined.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Jarod Garamonde
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2462 - 2014-03-26 11:18:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Jarod Garamonde
Erotica 1 wrote:
I certainly do hope many of my critics here take the time to read www.minerbumping.com because you will find thousands of examples of utter filth spewed by highsec miners.

I assure you, we are the good guys. Take a look.



That brings me to my next point. Some of our carebears are some of nastiest, most foul-mouthed, ill-tempered people in this playerbase. You pop someone's ship because they trekked into a lowsec system for a mission, and presented you with a juicy target, and they flood your inbox with rage and IRL threats. It's absolutely disgusting.
I don't report them, or petition them, or anything. I delete the EVEmails, laugh about it, and watchlist them, then I keep popping them until they ragequit the game. I don't even want to know what their house looks like, or what their wives and children have to hear them shout, after I send them away in their pod. It's honestly scary to even think about.

On the other hand, I am a lowsec pirate in this game. I kill other people's ships because it's a challenge, and therefore, fun.
In my personal life, I am actively social in very healthy ways, and I am usually surrounded by people who genuinely like me. My girlfriend's biggest issue with me is when I say "Hey, we have a roam, tonight", and she mumbles something playfully sarcastic about where I *WON'T* be roaming, tonight.

See the difference?
James 315 was right.

That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right...

    [#savethelance]
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#2463 - 2014-03-26 11:18:40 UTC
Erotica 1 wrote:
Please show me some respect and do the same.


Maybe you should have shown the poor guy in the bonus round some respect, if you want others to respect you.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.

Bjurn Akely
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services
WiNGSPAN Delivery Network
#2464 - 2014-03-26 11:20:02 UTC
Navi Annages wrote:
Bjurn Akely wrote:
Navi Annages wrote:
Bjurn Akely wrote:

You'll have to explain that further, cause you're not making sense to me.


Simple Terms : If the EULA is not breached within the constricts of the fictional world of eve online then CCP is powerless.

Whatever occured outside the confines of eve online is up to the authorities. Now be attentive for this next part.

What constitutes a bigger threat? Making life threatening remarks or goading someone a lil over ts3? You choose. We all know a judge will laugh at this and toss it out or take it serious and put Sohkar in a Orange jumpsuit. Erotica's behavior may be immoral to some but to the real world they do this...../Shrug Shoulders.


Ah, I see now.

If it was inside the EULA or not is nothing I know much about. From what others have posted here one might make that interpretation that it is. I'll await CCP's decision on that.

As for the second part... It is not my opinion that the guy was goaded a little. It is no doubt that he was in severe distress. That distress was brought upon him by Ero and the others. Under that distress he lashed out (and later recanted and apologized). THe most disturbing part to me about Eros and the others behavior is that when their mark shows signs of severe distress they just tighten the screws a little more. That smacks of a severe lack of empathy to me. Lack of empathy is a crucial asset of really dangerous people. And don't say "but in other games..." like you did before. This was outside the game according to your previous statements. You can't have it both ways in order to further one line of your argument.

Where you live perhaps Sohk would be put in jail? I actually think not since he was under pressure at the time. But let's not debate that, neither of us are lawyers.

As for the question whether none, some or all should be banned... I'll leave that to CCP. Personally I'd let the involved explain themselves and then make a decision.


Then keep your senses about you. If this happened outside the game then simply put CCP has no case to interfere. Morally or Legally.

If the two parties choose to goto legal battle over this like mentioned before Sokhar will end up in an orange jumpsuit. His morale character as a decisive killing machine of a marine (yea right he's army) will be brought into question. If he snaps like this from time to time now his job as an air traffic controller will be brought into question. He will be portrayed as an ex military member that cannot keep ahold of his emotional outbursts. Who cares if he was under any sort of distress. He's been to boot camp in theory right? He's been to war right? Emotional distress over 20 bucks, making death threats ect ect. So your saying that all his training from the military is worthless. Judge will call into question if he's a suitable parent ect ect ect. You see where this is going. Everyone thinks something oh so bad will happen to Erotica. This will go both ways. It's a very dangerous road for Sokhar. Very dangerous because everything that makes up his morale character will be called into question. Have any of you even remotely considered that Sohkar had been drinking that night? Would that be something a judge would ask? Maybe he had been doing drugs that night. See how all the possibilities only hold one true fact. A lawyer will shred sohkar too and fro irl.

Does this make sense how deep this could go. Sohkar could end up losing his job over this in the long run. He could potentially goto jail. What then he's an ex military felon the rest of his life. All of you only give a crap what happens to erotica in the game. None of you give a rats *** what happens to this so called military vet in the long run.


No. It does not make sense. Or rather you do not. This will not go to court, and also I've told you: neither of us are trained in law. Well I am a bit, but that is not the point. I simple will not argue legal matters with you.

The statement that nobody cares about Sohk is conjecture at best. I do, in the sense that I think he was victimized by Ero and the others. I care for him as a fellow human. Do I care for him much, or as I do with my family. No, you're right there. But that was not your point. Frankly I doubt you care.
Remiel Pollard
Shock Treatment Ministries
#2465 - 2014-03-26 11:20:18 UTC
arabella blood wrote:
Erotica 1 wrote:
Big Lynx wrote:
Erotica 1 wrote:
I certainly do hope many of my critics here take the time to read www.minerbumping.com because you will find thousands of examples of utter filth spewed by highsec miners.

I assure you, we are the good guys. Take a look.


Fourth attempt:

Ok mate. Let's talk like adults. Concerning self-reflection, do you think you and your friends have gone too far?


read back a few pages. I have read every single post here. Please show me some respect and do the same.



Keep runing away from answers.

*I too read every word in this thread.


If you've read every word in this thread, you sure have ignored a lot of them. That, or you have no capacity for rational unbiased thought.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Icylce
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2466 - 2014-03-26 11:20:29 UTC
Big Lynx wrote:
Erotica 1 wrote:
Big Lynx wrote:
Erotica 1 wrote:
I certainly do hope many of my critics here take the time to read www.minerbumping.com because you will find thousands of examples of utter filth spewed by highsec miners.

I assure you, we are the good guys. Take a look.


Fourth attempt:

Ok mate. Let's talk like adults. Concerning self-reflection, do you think you and your friends have gone too far?


read back a few pages. I have read every single post here. Please show me some respect and do the same.


A simple YES or NO would be nice.

U will never get such an answer. Because when aswer is simple, u cant hide behind elaborate and long walls of texts and spin your story when its convenient.
James1122
Perimeter Trade and Distribution Inc
#2467 - 2014-03-26 11:21:13 UTC
Lucretia DeWinter wrote:
Okay... I've been reading this since page one and cannot resist contributing an opinion - which is what forums are for.


I have been aware of Erotica1 for a long time since I first saw the spam in Jita local. I have played the ISK doubling game and have played the bonus room. (no, there's no recording of me singing or throwing a fit, sorry...) I was interested in learning how it all worked and figured out pretty quickly that Erotica1 is quite possibly the sharpest and most cunning scammer in EVE.

The detailed rules that hook in the punters by stoking their greed with the legitimising and confidence inspiring early payouts encourage the gullible to dive right in.

Erotica1's skills at social engineering are very good and I have no problem with having such deadly sharks swimming in our EVE pool. The unwary should be able to be fleeced or robbed of every ISK and every asset they own in the game.


And this is where this breaks it for me. In the game. Characters are one thing - when in character, kill, threaten, steal, lie, cheat. All is good. On TS3 - I am me, not Lucretia DeWinter. That boundary is the extent of the New Eden universe.


Once you carry over a scam (or emergent gameplay) into the extra-game world, I believe it does actually cross a line. There are several reasons I hold this belief:


  • External communications are not protected by CCP - in game actions are logged and can be investigated.
  • EVE assets have value. Perhaps not real world court of law value, but they have emotional and psychological value which is no different to tangible material goods to the person who owns them.
  • Skilled communicators can deceive and coerce extremely effectively and easily over forums or voice comms - the impersonal protections offered by anonymity make it very easy for people to disregard all standards of conduct without accountability for their actions.


Taking the example of Jester's blog and the soundcloud, I believe that:


  • Erotica1 et al crossed a line into unacceptable behaviour. Although players enter the bonus room willingly, once they gave up their assets (which I don't deny is a stupid thing to do) they are then used as leverage to extort and coerce and it is at this point that the player becomes a victim.
  • That they could leave at any time is no defence. There is huge pressure, skillfully applied, to so massively disincentivse just quitting and walking away. Your boss could casually mention that times are hard and there might have to be layoffs, oh, and can you work late tonight? There's no threats or blackmail here, but its the same concept.
  • If ever somebody comes into the conversation and says, "Okay, Please stop" - and they continue to humiliate and denigrate their victim - that is way out of order.


If it were up to me, I would propose the following actions:

  • Erotica1 and helpers should be informed that although scamming is an accepted practice in New Eden, great care should be taken to preserve the dignity and wellbeing of the real life people behind the character. Humiliating people for public or private publication should be considered an ethical breach of the EULA (the conduct section) and moving forward, future events such as this example will result in a ban from CCP services. (and I mean a proper ban - with payment card/IP address blacklisting)
  • Sohkar receives a temp ban. This is a result of the language and threats made to Erotica1. This is mitigated from a permanent ban due to the duress under which the comments are made. It should be explained why a ban has been implemented.



I believe we as a community should make it known that this extra-EVE meta-scamming is not what we should want to be representative of the game and community we engage with.

I believe that CCP has a responsibility to investigate these cases and where they feel necessary, take action, regardless of whether it happens in game or out, these are EVE players, using our community and game world to drive and facilitate these scenarios.


It is not up to us or CCP to 'police the world' but they should be invested in protecting people from real world harm and protecting their reputation. As well as protecting the sandbox in game world as a harsh, unforgiving and dangerous place inhabited by psychopaths, zealots and all manner of unhinged capsuleers.

The several strawman arguments raised against the example of CCP interference are truly fallacious. I believe it is undeniable that the actions demonstrated here are reprehensible and should not remain unchallenged.

We are adults and should conduct ourselves with respect, keeping the villainy within the game.



best post i've read so far in this thread

....

Kyperion
#2468 - 2014-03-26 11:21:44 UTC
Bunnie Hop wrote:
Erotica 1 wrote:
I certainly do hope many of my critics here take the time to read www.minerbumping.com because you will find thousands of examples of utter filth spewed by highsec miners.

I assure you, we are the good guys. Take a look.


People who are good guys, don't need to assure others of that fact. You are not the good guys, but egocentric abusive individuals who are so self absorbed as to believe your own vitreol.


yes, read miner bumping
It is a prime example of the kind of hate filled, cult like vitriol that has festered thanks to the like of Erotica 1, James 315, and the Entire New Order filth.

This goes so far beyond just one player, anyone involved in the higher echelon of developing New Order and this 'Code' needs some serious time away from EVE to reflect on their depravity.
Remiel Pollard
Shock Treatment Ministries
#2469 - 2014-03-26 11:23:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
Bjurn Akely wrote:
Frankly I doubt you care.


Nobody cares. This is a vendetta against Erotica 1. Hence why people are simply dismissing his threats of violence and racism of Sokhar as if they were 'justified'. They're not. But no one is hanging him by the neck with anywhere near the same passion that they're going after Ero. This is a witchhunt, straight outta the 16th Century, run by the 'morality police' like a religious inquisition.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
End of Life
#2470 - 2014-03-26 11:23:23 UTC
dexington wrote:
Maybe you should have shown the poor guy in the bonus round some respect, if you want others to respect you.


So if you are advocating showing no respect because you judge that Erotica 1 deserves it, are you also advocating other action by CCP?

If you are advocating that CCP take action, where does that action stop? Should you be sanctioned for example?
Prie Mary
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#2471 - 2014-03-26 11:23:47 UTC
Erotica 1 wrote:

Typical argument for someone who has no desire to engage in an adult conversation. I don't think you know what a psychopath is. I am most certainly not one.



Feel free to go and educate yourself via google or any other search engine. There is a spectrum and you have scored very highly indeed.

If you care to go back through the thread I have posted informatively and constructively I just will not be dragged into a discussion with somebody who is beyond reasoning. The only action which will have any impact could possibly come from CCP and I hope it does.

Dont just [u]think[/u] outside the box, [u]Live[/u] outside of it...

Galdrak
Interplanetary Trade Federation
#2472 - 2014-03-26 11:24:19 UTC
Erotica 1 wrote:
I certainly do hope many of my critics here take the time to read www.minerbumping.com because you will find thousands of examples of utter filth spewed by highsec miners.

I assure you, we are the good guys. Take a look.



good guys >.< . only in your head your a good guy. to me your just a scammer who went too far because you could. you pushed that dude so far he lost it totally and you step back and say he is the one to blame. i bet you are smiling as you read everything posted in this thread.
Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
#2473 - 2014-03-26 11:25:31 UTC
I agree that was a very good post. Meanwhile I get someone asking very broad questions wanting yes/no answers which I assure you will be damned if I do/damned if I don't. The funny thing is I already gave the very answers they seek, just a few pages back.

See Bio for isk doubling rules. If you didn't read bio, chances are you funded those who did.

dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#2474 - 2014-03-26 11:25:39 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
dexington wrote:
Maybe you should have shown the poor guy in the bonus round some respect, if you want others to respect you.


So if you are advocating showing no respect because you judge that Erotica 1 deserves it, are you also advocating other action by CCP?

If you are advocating that CCP take action, where does that action stop? Should you be sanctioned for example?


I'm just saying he is a hypocrite.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.

Remiel Pollard
Shock Treatment Ministries
#2475 - 2014-03-26 11:26:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
Galdrak wrote:
Erotica 1 wrote:
I certainly do hope many of my critics here take the time to read www.minerbumping.com because you will find thousands of examples of utter filth spewed by highsec miners.

I assure you, we are the good guys. Take a look.



good guys >.< . only in your head your a good guy. to me your just a scammer who went too far because you could. you pushed that dude so far he lost it totally and you step back and say he is the one to blame. i bet you are smiling as you read everything posted in this thread.


If you can't take responsibility for yourself and have a little self control over virtual assets in a ******* video game then yes, you are to blame. The ONLY one to blame, for handing those assets over consensually in the first place, and jumping on TS consensually to get them back.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
#2476 - 2014-03-26 11:27:01 UTC
Prie Mary wrote:
Erotica 1 wrote:

Typical argument for someone who has no desire to engage in an adult conversation. I don't think you know what a psychopath is. I am most certainly not one.



Feel free to go and educate yourself via google or any other search engine. There is a spectrum and you have scored very highly indeed.

If you care to go back through the thread I have posted informatively and constructively I just will not be dragged into a discussion with somebody who is beyond reasoning. The only action which will have any impact could possibly come from CCP and I hope it does.


As a joke, I have taken these internet tests with some guys at bu/mb/etc and I score rather low.

See Bio for isk doubling rules. If you didn't read bio, chances are you funded those who did.

Remiel Pollard
Shock Treatment Ministries
#2477 - 2014-03-26 11:27:39 UTC
Prie Mary wrote:
Erotica 1 wrote:

Typical argument for someone who has no desire to engage in an adult conversation. I don't think you know what a psychopath is. I am most certainly not one.



Feel free to go and educate yourself via google or any other search engine. There is a spectrum and you have scored very highly indeed.



And you most certainly have not sat down long enough with him to make the diagnosis required to form the conclusion that you have. In other words, you're talking out your anus.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
#2478 - 2014-03-26 11:28:03 UTC
Erotica 1 wrote:
I agree that was a very good post. Meanwhile I get someone asking very broad questions wanting yes/no answers which I assure you will be damned if I do/damned if I don't. The funny thing is I already gave the very answers they seek, just a few pages back.

Post number please?
Incidentally, iv no grudge here, this is a game.Blink
Lady Areola Fappington
#2479 - 2014-03-26 11:28:13 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Bjurn Akely wrote:
Frankly I doubt you care.


Nobody cares. This is a vendetta against Erotica 1. Hence why people are simply dismissing his threats of violence and racism of Sokhar as if they were 'justified'. They're not. But no one is hanging him by the neck with anywhere near the same passion that they're going after Ero. This is a witchhunt, straight outta the 16th Century, run by the 'morality police' like a religious inquisition.



The saddest, most funny part is...switch some database numbers, log in a different toon, and suddenly this controversy gets flipped on it's head.

You know just as well as I do, if it were a +5.0 pillar of the community good guy pulling the same scam on a lowlife gankur, there'd be high-fives and backpatting galore.

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide

arabella blood
Keyboard Jihad
#2480 - 2014-03-26 11:28:45 UTC
Galdrak wrote:
Erotica 1 wrote:
I certainly do hope many of my critics here take the time to read www.minerbumping.com because you will find thousands of examples of utter filth spewed by highsec miners.

I assure you, we are the good guys. Take a look.



good guys >.< . only in your head your a good guy. to me your just a scammer who went too far because you could. you pushed that dude so far he lost it totally and you step back and say he is the one to blame. i bet you are smiling as you read everything posted in this thread.


Actually no. From his words you can already see he is sweating.

Troll for hire. Cheap prices.