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Vote: Black Ops Battleships and Covert Cloaking Device

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Ginger Barbarella
#61 - 2013-06-11 01:03:10 UTC
AkatokuChaos wrote:
What do you guys think? Should Black Ops Battleships be able to fit Covert Ops Cloaking Devices instead of just up to Improved Cloaking?


Only on Wednesdays if the corner bistro has served some kind of gyro in the daily specials...

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#62 - 2013-06-11 02:45:17 UTC
The ability of black ops is extremely situational without covert ops cloak. As people have already mentioned other ships perform that role much better ie carrier. They can open a covert cyno but other ships perform that role better. The widow can jam like a falcon but falcon performs that role better. Theyre a battleship but other ships perform that role better.

There is nothing that blackops can do that other ships cant do better to justify using them when they cost so much. With a covert ops cloak that would probably still be true but it would bring them more in line with there ship role and type.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Rain6638
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#63 - 2013-06-11 05:52:58 UTC
Ginger Barbarella wrote:
AkatokuChaos wrote:
What do you guys think? Should Black Ops Battleships be able to fit Covert Ops Cloaking Devices instead of just up to Improved Cloaking?


Only on Wednesdays if the corner bistro has served some kind of gyro in the daily specials...

7-day passive covops cloak booster for 1200 AUR

[ 2013.06.21 09:52:05 ] (notify) For initiating combat your security status has been adjusted by -0.1337
Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#64 - 2013-06-11 14:43:01 UTC
Rual Storge wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
I blops, k? i love them. but really, for DPS, blops with covops cloak only needs to go as high as a rook. sig radius/strength in numbers. you don't need a covops cloak widow... you need more rooks and falcons, is the solution.


Nah, 2 classes would be the best solution, like all T2 ships has
I was unaware of the second line of T2 destroyers...

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Karash Amerius
The Seven Shadows
Scotch And Tea.
#65 - 2013-06-11 15:16:15 UTC
And to the person that suggested the AWESOMO kill stats of BLOPS on various killboard metrics: You know damn well that these ships are only committed when the battle is already more than favorable to them. BLOPS are only used in the Sun Tzu moments where you know the enemy is screwed, and you are just going through the motions. That is why most fits rarely have any sort of EHP and fit straight for gank (excluding the Widow).

While there are always exceptions...I would think most agree that BLOPS are used when the "It's a Trap" situation comes and they feel cozy in the fight.

Karash Amerius Operative, Sutoka
Caius Sivaris
Dark Nexxus
#66 - 2013-06-11 23:27:49 UTC
Karash Amerius wrote:
And to the person that suggested the AWESOMO kill stats of BLOPS on various killboard metrics: You know damn well that these ships are only committed when the battle is already more than favorable to them. BLOPS are only used in the Sun Tzu moments where you know the enemy is screwed, and you are just going through the motions. That is why most fits rarely have any sort of EHP and fit straight for gank (excluding the Widow).

While there are always exceptions...I would think most agree that BLOPS are used when the "It's a Trap" situation comes and they feel cozy in the fight.


Some people drop them in real fights with either triage carrier support or logistic T3. I've personally witnessed Snuff Box doing it to great effect.
Euripedies
Hot Droppin Cherry Poppers
#67 - 2013-06-13 00:24:24 UTC
yes +1 to covert ops cloak

it just makes sense for the end all, be all of sneaky ships should have the covert ops cloak. just having a BLOPs as a jump portal generator is lame. CCP could have done that in a frigate, but they had to make a gimpy battleship instead. Lame!Evil
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#68 - 2013-06-13 00:42:25 UTC
Amanda Chelian wrote:
Caius Sivaris wrote:
Amanda Chelian wrote:
They make for very lousy black ops due to not having the ability to warp while cloaked, and that's made obvious by how unpopular they are. I still don't understand why CCP decided that a ship type designed specifically for stealth doesn't get the same tools as other ship types in the same category.


You know using blackops successfully involves jumping to the target and not warping to it right? They could have no cloak bonus whatsoever and still be as good.


Really, now? What ever happened to roaming PvP gangs? Or are we just playing Hot-Drops Online now?

I'm not dismissing the usefulness of a Black Ops having a jump drive, but if the only merit of this ship type involves being cyno'd straight into battle, why wouldn't everyone just use a carrier for it instead? The difference in price isn't really that large, and a carrier can project a lot more DPS on target, tank like a champ, and even provide logistic support for the rest of the gang.


It covops bridges. The jumpdrive is there for extracting stealth gangs. The blops is not the marine, the blops is the medivac.

If you have a lucky day, you put 4 scouts out, and they all find an opportunity to "write interesting content", you can use a blops to send and retrieve your stealth gang to 4 totally different locations as fast as you can kill whatever is there.
Kor'el Izia
#69 - 2013-06-13 02:14:28 UTC
Trading the Cloaked Velocity bonus for ability to fit Covert Ops cloak? Yes!
Karash Amerius
The Seven Shadows
Scotch And Tea.
#70 - 2013-06-13 21:25:28 UTC
Caius Sivaris wrote:
Karash Amerius wrote:
And to the person that suggested the AWESOMO kill stats of BLOPS on various killboard metrics: You know damn well that these ships are only committed when the battle is already more than favorable to them. BLOPS are only used in the Sun Tzu moments where you know the enemy is screwed, and you are just going through the motions. That is why most fits rarely have any sort of EHP and fit straight for gank (excluding the Widow).

While there are always exceptions...I would think most agree that BLOPS are used when the "It's a Trap" situation comes and they feel cozy in the fight.


Some people drop them in real fights with either triage carrier support or logistic T3. I've personally witnessed Snuff Box doing it to great effect.


Thank you for agreeing with me that there are always exceptions.

Karash Amerius Operative, Sutoka
Garaba
Eternity INC.
Goonswarm Federation
#71 - 2013-06-13 23:24:19 UTC
I don't really see where them getting the cov-op cloak would cause any real problems. They have a poor tank for a t2 BS, they have pretty poor dps when compared to t1 BS's, etc, etc.


+1 to the cov-ops.

Maybe it would finally bump Blops out of the least trained ship skill in all of Eve. Yes, more people have a titan trained than blops, or at least that is what I remember from a little while ago.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#72 - 2013-06-14 01:10:21 UTC
BLOPS need to be turned into 2 ships per race

one covert ops cloak/bridge capable (like a big force recon)

one combat based but no cloaking bonus but has a e-war bonus to scram/distruper range (like a big force recon)

example: sin remains a domi but is focused to be a cloaky bridging ship

then you have the hyperion which becomes the combat version of black ops.

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#73 - 2013-06-14 09:20:09 UTC
no.
BO are already very powerful, covert cloak would make them super OP.
What noob must you be not to see this blatantly obvious result?!?
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#74 - 2013-06-14 13:46:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Sergeant Acht Scultz
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
it already has a 625% cloaked velocity modifier lol



You know when you fit a prototype cloacking device or improved cloaking device your ship speed is reduced between 75 and 90%?

Try it out and tell me how fast you go with your Blops all lvl's with and improved cloak device or a Prototype one.

Improved cloaking device

Prototype Cloaking Device

*Dump the speed bonus when cloak and let it use Cover Cloaking device

*Add dmg projection bonus OR tackling bonus OR tank bonus

removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#75 - 2013-06-14 14:11:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Bugsy VanHalen
I vote yes,

The BLOPS are already gimped in tank and DPS compared to even T1 BS's, using a Cov Ops cloak will not make them OP. It is not like you can activate the cloak and warp off in the middle of a battle. These ships are weak, their ability to move unseen is there only advantage, being the only stealth ship that can not use the cov ops cloak makes cov ops fleets much harder to manage.

either than or give them a much larger fuel bay so they can use the jump drive to move around. The need to be shadowed by a blockade runner full of fuel is another pointless hassle for a covops fleet.
Lady Spank
Get Out Nasty Face
#76 - 2013-06-14 14:16:52 UTC
Adding cloaked warping to these ships would completely overpower them. Anything you want to either sneak up on, or evade should be done so via the ships jump capability.

Essentially everything you would want a cloak for can already be done but requires a small degree of effort.

They are not intended to be solo win boats.

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Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#77 - 2013-06-14 14:20:38 UTC
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
it already has a 625% cloaked velocity modifier lol



You know when you fit a prototype cloacking device or improved cloaking device your ship speed is reduced between 75 and 90%?

Try it out and tell me how fast you go with your Blops all lvl's with and improved cloak device or a Prototype one.

Improved cloaking device

Prototype Cloaking Device

*Dump the speed bonus when cloak and let it use Cover Cloaking device

*Add dmg projection bonus OR tackling bonus OR tank bonus


72.5% with a cheap faction cloak

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Caldari_Navy_Cloaking_Device

means that the ship will be moving 72% faster while cloaked.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#78 - 2013-06-14 14:36:08 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
it already has a 625% cloaked velocity modifier lol



You know when you fit a prototype cloacking device or improved cloaking device your ship speed is reduced between 75 and 90%?

Try it out and tell me how fast you go with your Blops all lvl's with and improved cloak device or a Prototype one.

Improved cloaking device

Prototype Cloaking Device

*Dump the speed bonus when cloak and let it use Cover Cloaking device

*Add dmg projection bonus OR tackling bonus OR tank bonus


72.5% with a cheap faction cloak

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Caldari_Navy_Cloaking_Device

means that the ship will be moving 72% faster while cloaked.


...at under 200m/s lows full of nanos Lol

removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne
Aralieus
Shadowbane Syndicate
#79 - 2013-06-14 14:40:59 UTC
Who cares if it can move fastet while cloaked, you would need to warp to grid where target is uncloaked so target will already see you anyway and at that point a T1 BS would do the same job alot better for alot cheaper. It has covert cyno you say...and, you need to drop it right next to target and at that point a SB would be better or once again warp uncloaked to target. And yes I have been in plenty BO gangs and 90% of the time the bridger does only that, bridges.

Oderint Dum Metuant
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#80 - 2013-06-14 14:47:25 UTC
Aralieus wrote:
Who cares if it can move fastet while cloaked, you would need to warp to grid where target is uncloaked so target will already see you anyway and at that point a T1 BS would do the same job alot better for alot cheaper. It has covert cyno you say...and, you need to drop it right next to target and at that point a SB would be better or once again warp uncloaked to target. And yes I have been in plenty BO gangs and 90% of the time the bridger does only that, bridges.



There are some specific drops where you can bridge Blops on the field and kick stuff but as soon as someone with 2 neurons undocks with a couple gank talos the uber drop turns out in a 1B+ ships murder.

Black ops have a very good role and op against solo farming carebears, afk undock snowflakes in empty systems, smartbombing gates when known large frigate/dessies gang is moving around, otherwise yes, it's more about bridging stuff than actually get on the field.

Best dps ammo of black ops is still bombers torps and points.

removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne