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Outside Corp Logi ship assistnace concordable
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Velicitia
XS Tech
#41 - 2013-04-13 13:05:18 UTC
Ruze wrote:
[quote=The Reaper J]
You missed their point. Logi's would only be flagged/killed for repping those who are in the process of performing a criminal act. If the individual getting repped is about to be concorded, so would the logi. If they were about to get a criminal flag (i.e baiting), so would the logi.

.


this used to be hilarious in Incursions from what I heard. get one ******* to call for reps, do something to get CONCORDOKKEN, get the entire logi cap chain nuked.

Syrias Bizniz actually has an even better solution. +1 internets to him.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Keeper O'Secrets
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#42 - 2013-04-13 13:16:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Keeper O'Secrets
TheSkeptic wrote:
Please biomass


^this +1

general idea -1

we have already had a major change in how RR works from neuts... if you cant field enough ships to deal with the now attackable neut logis... tough.

idea: field your own neut dps ships to attack the now flagged logi...
Gimme more Cynos
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#43 - 2013-04-13 13:25:26 UTC
Look, someone lost a 1 vs 5 and is crying about it on forums. :D
Z GTC
Bioxium Securities
#44 - 2013-04-13 15:03:51 UTC
Gimme more Cynos wrote:
Look, someone lost a 1 vs 5 and is crying about it on forums. :D



Agreed, Just because you, The Reaper J, lost to a player or group of players that fielded more ships than you is not the game's fault. You got Baited and you lost. Now learn from your mistakes and move on. This game is Pay-To-Win. The more alts you have and the better characters you have and the better fit ships you have mean EVERYTHING.
Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#45 - 2013-04-13 15:20:07 UTC
Actually, it's a MMO. Not a Massive Singleplayer Online game. So get FWENDZ not Alts.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#46 - 2013-04-13 15:42:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Velicitia
Z GTC wrote:
This game is Pay-To-Win. The more alts you have and the better characters you have and the better fit ships you have mean EVERYTHING.


"Pay-to-Win" -- I don't think it means what you think it means.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Z GTC
Bioxium Securities
#47 - 2013-04-13 16:03:32 UTC
Velicitia wrote:
Z GTC wrote:
This game is Pay-To-Win. The more alts you have and the better characters you have and the better fit ships you have mean EVERYTHING.


"Pay-to-Win" I don't think it means what you think it means.

Whoever has the most real life money can buy the best characters and best ships. Now obviously it is still an MMO so it's not like you can "win" or even take on Everyone else yourself. But you can still use your alts to turn the tide of hi sec small grouped skirmishes.

Pay-To-Win is a term used to describe people who spend hundreds, thousands, or even more to further themselves in games faster then the normal player. In some games this allows you to be the top dog. In EVE corporations and alliances are the ruling factor so a single player cannot rule everyone but it still stands. You can pay tons of RL money to advance yourself really high in this game.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#48 - 2013-04-13 16:12:23 UTC
Z GTC wrote:
Velicitia wrote:
Z GTC wrote:
This game is Pay-To-Win. The more alts you have and the better characters you have and the better fit ships you have mean EVERYTHING.


"Pay-to-Win" I don't think it means what you think it means.

Whoever has the most real life money can buy the best characters and best ships. Now obviously it is still an MMO so it's not like you can "win" or even take on Everyone else yourself. But you can still use your alts to turn the tide of hi sec small grouped skirmishes.

Pay-To-Win is a term used to describe people who spend hundreds, thousands, or even more to further themselves in games faster then the normal player. In some games this allows you to be the top dog. In EVE corporations and alliances are the ruling factor so a single player cannot rule everyone but it still stands. You can pay tons of RL money to advance yourself really high in this game.



And then you can still get your **** ruined by a day one newbie in a slasher.
Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#49 - 2013-04-13 16:44:59 UTC
Eve isn't pay2win. It's actually more of a 'pay2lose'. If you pay rl money and invest it on ships, you're actually losing your money. But it can still be quite fun!
Velicitia
XS Tech
#50 - 2013-04-13 17:04:34 UTC
Z GTC wrote:
Velicitia wrote:
Z GTC wrote:
This game is Pay-To-Win. The more alts you have and the better characters you have and the better fit ships you have mean EVERYTHING.


"Pay-to-Win" I don't think it means what you think it means.

Whoever has the most real life money can buy the best characters and best ships. Now obviously it is still an MMO so it's not like you can "win" or even take on Everyone else yourself. But you can still use your alts to turn the tide of hi sec small grouped skirmishes.

Pay-To-Win is a term used to describe people who spend hundreds, thousands, or even more to further themselves in games faster then the normal player. In some games this allows you to be the top dog. In EVE corporations and alliances are the ruling factor so a single player cannot rule everyone but it still stands. You can pay tons of RL money to advance yourself really high in this game.



"Pay-to-Win" = paying for things that you can't get otherwise (e.g. gold ammo -- EVE equivalent would be like no T2 or Faction ammo unless you buy it with AUR/PLEX).

There's nothing you can pay for to gain (much) of an advantage over other players. As it stands the only thing you can directly buy in EVE for RL money is ISK (via a PLEX).

Sure, ~1b ISK is a fair bit of cash (per GTC) ... but it's not going to really make me any better in the long run. Furthermore, all it does is move around assets that are already in the game.

1 GTC/2 PLEX/1b ISK in Eve Terms
- 60d gametime OR
- (approx) 4 fit exhumers OR
- (approx) 100 catalysts OR
- (approx) 4 fit BS OR
- set of +5 implants OR
- 2/3 of a Mining Mindlink OR
- 2/3 of Michi's Excavation Augmenter OR
- 2/3 of a (fit) Mach, or other faction BS OR
- set of pirate implants OR
- clone + non-mining links (1 clone each with siege/skirmish/armor/info), with enough left over to cover a few pod losses. OR
- capital ships + [racial] carrier/dreadnought OR
- 1 BS BPO OR
- 2 "Tier 3" BC BPOs OR
- a few months' POS fuel OR
- more stuff I'm too lazy to type out

alternatively, you could always use it to buy a character. But if you're terribad at 10m SP, you're not gonna be any better after buying a 100m SP character.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Red Kamel
Red Kamel Inc.
#51 - 2013-04-13 20:27:12 UTC
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
C'mon, show us that killmail Big smile
I'm sure it is as awesome as this oneTwisted



Maybe this one from BattleClinic here.

Lol


Also...

Mangala Solaris for CSM 8
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#52 - 2013-04-13 20:29:26 UTC
The Reaper J wrote:

Nothing has been mentioned really here about Neutral RR toons. This is a massive exploit, and most people i see don't care about flags. They rep up the targeted ship no matter what, even if they get flagged in high sec. Simple code needs to be done to have neutral RR logi's concorded for interfence in a battle between corps. Simple as that.


Then I am afraid you have failed to read my posts. Neutral RR is all we have been talking about, just various cases of it that do not include yours.

Remote repping is fine. People should not be auto-punished for benefiting players outside of flagging only in situations where the parties involved cannot shoot the remote repper helping their opponent.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.
Ruze
Next Stage Initiative
#53 - 2013-04-13 22:14:08 UTC
Velicitia wrote:
Z GTC wrote:
Velicitia wrote:
Z GTC wrote:
This game is Pay-To-Win. The more alts you have and the better characters you have and the better fit ships you have mean EVERYTHING.


"Pay-to-Win" I don't think it means what you think it means.

Whoever has the most real life money can buy the best characters and best ships. Now obviously it is still an MMO so it's not like you can "win" or even take on Everyone else yourself. But you can still use your alts to turn the tide of hi sec small grouped skirmishes.

Pay-To-Win is a term used to describe people who spend hundreds, thousands, or even more to further themselves in games faster then the normal player. In some games this allows you to be the top dog. In EVE corporations and alliances are the ruling factor so a single player cannot rule everyone but it still stands. You can pay tons of RL money to advance yourself really high in this game.



"Pay-to-Win" = paying for things that you can't get otherwise (e.g. gold ammo -- EVE equivalent would be like no T2 or Faction ammo unless you buy it with AUR/PLEX).

There's nothing you can pay for to gain (much) of an advantage over other players. As it stands the only thing you can directly buy in EVE for RL money is ISK (via a PLEX).

Sure, ~1b ISK is a fair bit of cash (per GTC) ... but it's not going to really make me any better in the long run. Furthermore, all it does is move around assets that are already in the game.

1 GTC/2 PLEX/1b ISK in Eve Terms
- 60d gametime OR
- (approx) 4 fit exhumers OR
- (approx) 100 catalysts OR
- (approx) 4 fit BS OR
- set of +5 implants OR
- 2/3 of a Mining Mindlink OR
- 2/3 of Michi's Excavation Augmenter OR
- 2/3 of a (fit) Mach, or other faction BS OR
- set of pirate implants OR
- clone + non-mining links (1 clone each with siege/skirmish/armor/info), with enough left over to cover a few pod losses. OR
- capital ships + [racial] carrier/dreadnought OR
- 1 BS BPO OR
- 2 "Tier 3" BC BPOs OR
- a few months' POS fuel OR
- more stuff I'm too lazy to type out

alternatively, you could always use it to buy a character. But if you're terribad at 10m SP, you're not gonna be any better after buying a 100m SP character.


I understand the use of pay-to-win the poster is using. It means, any player who has the extra money (or in some cases, isk) to own a second account, train/buy up a rep logistics, and possibly even use multiple screens/etc ... has an advantage.

EvE has been pay to win for a long time. Sure, I've got friends. But I never go anywhere without one of my own eyes scouting for me, or setting up cynos for me, or remote repping me. And my alts are almost assuredly not in my corp with me.

I pay more money/time then a player with one life, one screen, one account. I have the advantage. EvE is just built that way, and has been that way WELL before 'pay-to-win' began to mean buying third-party game advancements.

And truthfully, it is an unfair advantage, unless the player is like me and has a hard time multitasking after a hard day at work ...

If you're driven to threaten others with harm or violence because of what they do in game, you can't separate fantasy from reality. That "griefer/thief" is probably more sane than you are. How screwed up is that?
Xe'Cara'eos
A Big Enough Lever
#54 - 2013-04-13 22:49:27 UTC
I believe characters in NPC corps should not be able to logi anyone with either a suspect or criminal flag who isn't within their corp
characters outside NPC corps should inherit ALL timed flags from the person they're logi-ing

For posting an idea into F&I: come up with idea, try and think how people could abuse this, try to fix your idea - loop the process until you can't see how it could be abused, then post to the forums to let us figure out how to abuse it..... If your idea can be abused, it [u]WILL[/u] be.
Ullus Demos
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#55 - 2013-04-20 08:16:58 UTC
The Reaper J wrote:
New Idea.

Make any and all LOGI ship assistance that is outside a specific corp a concordable offence. No one cares about flags.


Please continue with the tears, they are delicious.

Here is the kill The Reaper J is so butthurt about: http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=17402337
Tora Bushido
Commonwealth Mercenaries
BLACKFLAG.
#56 - 2013-04-20 08:25:04 UTC
I think anyone with just a ship should be concorded..... and anyone being butt hurt too. P

DELETE THE WEAK, ADAPT OR DIE !

Meta Gaming Level VII, Psycho Warfare Level X, Smack Talk Level VII.
The Reaper J
Kings.Guard.
#57 - 2013-04-23 09:43:19 UTC  |  Edited by: The Reaper J
Ullus Demos wrote:
The Reaper J wrote:
New Idea.

Make any and all LOGI ship assistance that is outside a specific corp a concordable offence. No one cares about flags.


Please continue with the tears, they are delicious.

Here is the kill The Reaper J is so butthurt about: http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=17402337



You can brag all you want you butt bunny Ullus Demos seeing that your cheating got you killed yesterday as well. http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=19407308

And i also forgot, oh wow, http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=19420656 what a kill. Anyone can kill that, but then again, using 3 to 4 neutral logi's is the only way Ullus Demos can fight.

I have been doing a lot of studying on who and what you low and null sec players are doing. Although i find that many of ya are simply alts, and bored like little brats with a broken toy.

I have noticed a lot of scratching each others backs lately with CCP. But hey, no worries. I enjoy chasing away people from eve, the less there are the happier i get. 60% of eve are simply alt accounts. Trying to aim for 80% of them to be alts now. But hey, anything said by anyone else that is either not your friends or alts, or backers, is simply tears to people like you Ullus. Seems like you must have been bullied a lot in your childhood and this is a way to get back at others. But hey, if it chases more and more real players away from eve. Then i am happy. If it creates more and more alts, which is pretty much just a waste really, that's ok. So lets try to push the % of alts up as far as possible, making sure the real players leave. That's the new target now is it not.
The Reaper J
Kings.Guard.
#58 - 2013-04-23 13:27:30 UTC  |  Edited by: The Reaper J
Danika Princip wrote:
The Reaper J wrote:
Clearly this exploit and loop hole is not worried about by CCP, they support it. They support criminal activity. Otherwise they would have stopped it. Simple as hell.

1. Logi in corp, assists corp members = no problem.
2. Corp member in logi in alliance, helping alliance or corp member = no problem.

Logi ships OUTSIDE a corp or alliance assisting anyone that is not in their alliance or corp, should be CONCORDED. Otherwise CCP should allow combat ships outside a corp or alliance to assist without being Concorded which is not allowed.

Therefore allowing one and not the other, looks a lot like CCP is in full support of criminals and not all the players in eve. Most of you seem to forget, that the odd few new real players, not alts that join as learning how to play, but hey, who cares about flags. NO ONE. So Typical of CCP.



Why do you hate group content?


If i were an real bastard, i would have said, don't ask dumb*** questions, however, i am not as arrogant of an ***hole like some of the people on here i have met. Firstly there are constantly ways for cheaters, and exploiters to get away with whatever they want. Real people suffer the consequences. Real people that pay money.

Unfortunately for a lot of people in eve, they are not able to make isk like all of you, because they have to keep chaning their training to try and make isk another way. But unfortunately, it does not matter what you train, the arrogant pratts are all out there. They all high and mighty and they are the best of the best attitude, when they all started as noobs. That kind of attitude is more like a person that got bullied all his life as a kid.

Besides, this is no longer a game. People pay for it each and every month. Therefore its a business. No longer a full on game. It business, and business can get harsh. All of you spout, this is a game, only because you gang up on people and kill them. So, it seems more like you want ot chase players away, so now i do the same as all of you. I try to chase people away from the game and make them either lose interest, in it. No point in trying to learn and play and have fun when you got thieves in the game. So in this case, all that is left to a person, is to find real relatively new players and kill them over and over and over and over till they lose interest and leave the game, and i am not talking about alts.

Oh, and i don't hate group content. I hate cheating. If you fight, you fight honorably. Not some back stabbing poor excuse for a human being.
DJ P0N-3
Table Flippendeavors
#59 - 2013-04-23 14:10:02 UTC
The Reaper J wrote:
Oh, and i don't hate group content. I hate cheating. If you fight, you fight honorably. Not some back stabbing poor excuse for a human being.


Then why do you play EVE? Lies, scamming, and backstabbing is what the game is known for. If someone brings neutral reps to an LE, shoot the logi because as soon as the reps land, they're a valid target for you. If you get AWOXed by someone with a logibro, live, learn, and tighten up your recruiting process. If you don't like playing a game where everyone is out to get you, don't play EVE.
Ruze
Next Stage Initiative
#60 - 2013-04-23 14:22:40 UTC
"If you fight, you fight honorably."

I like this. I mean, somewhere in the mix a few people have come to the conclusion that it's CCP job to guarantee fairness. I mean, it would be fair if someone couldn't sell their loot on the market for any less than I'm selling mine, right (i.e. the Chinese server)?

I'll get on a complete tangent about communism and don't need to. Let me just say to the op:

Have you ever been in a real fight? You know, when you weren't in high school anymore and there was actual pain and blood involved?

See, in sports fighting, they heavily regulate combat so that it's one on one, can't run away, go till the bell rings. Pretty honorable really. But as has been shown over and over, a sports fighter will be killed if he tries that in the street. Because in the street, if you hit the ground your dead. Break the bone if you get ahold of it. Grab their clothes and pull out their ear ring. Don't hit with a closed fist. And bring more friends.

One is about putting on a show, and has lots of martial arts or styles of fighting like MMA that are just geared to training kids how to get in that ring. The other is about surviving.



Unless your in an alliance tournament hosted by CCP, you better realize that your fights are about surviving. Honor has to be thrown out the window. You use underhanded tactics. You go for the throat. You pod. Because if you don't? You will always be the one being 'cheated'.

If you're driven to threaten others with harm or violence because of what they do in game, you can't separate fantasy from reality. That "griefer/thief" is probably more sane than you are. How screwed up is that?