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Hide your ISK, Team Security is out of control. (Allegedly)

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Callie Cross
Tax Code
#341 - 2013-02-12 17:47:59 UTC
De'Veldrin wrote:
Callie Cross wrote:


Again... I'm not asking for full disclosure. I just believe that amount of ISK deserves more than a one liner or canned response.


Why do people in possession of more ISK deserve more thorough treatment than anyone else? As long as they were being treated equitably to other people in this situation, that's all they have the right to expect.



True enough. Everyone has a right to ask those questions, the amount doesn't really matter.
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#342 - 2013-02-12 17:49:14 UTC
Callie Cross wrote:
Ranger 1 wrote:

If illegal isk were deposited in your or my wallet, we would have gotten the same breif response and the isk would have still be removed.


And you and I (as well as Kelduum or anyone else) would still have a right and reasonable expectation to ask "is all 300b illegal, can some still be saved?" and not be shut out of the process entirely.


Ranger 1 wrote:

Kelduum was not satisfied with that because of his "connections".



That's speculation and your personal opinion, and you seem a bit tilted. Show me the parts of the post that support this claim.

Ranger 1 wrote:


Being the recipient of illegally obtained isk does not entitle you to full disclosure, nor should it ever.



Again... I'm not asking for full disclosure. I just believe that amount of ISK deserves more than a one liner or canned response. The response that was provided in this thread was more than enough, and did not in any way disclose how he was botting, how they caught him etc.

Kelduum posted as much as he could and said that he wasn't receiving much information back. I don't think it's "entitlement" to ask simple questions in this matter. We are not "entitled" by having read CCP Sreegs responses in this thread. He replied to my statements saying that he said all this to Kelduum. Kelduum says in his original post that he didn't get that information.

In the end it seems that it's word against word. Did CCP Sreegs just say "we don't discuss this with 3rd parties"? Instead of taking the time to mention the few lines he said here? (Which doesn't give away any priveldged info) Or did Kelduum get the full story then go through all of this just to stir up drama?

I know who I believe... You make your choice.


Sreegs also said Kelduum was made aware of three facts:

1) The petition had been escalated to me which is the highest point possible of escalation
2) The isk was taken because it was made illegally
3) We don't discuss information about why other people have been banned with anyone but the people in question

I know this because in some cases I said it to him directly and in others it was part of a petition reply. As I stated the outrage about a lack of information is completely fabricated as all of the above information was given and that's absolutely all that should have been given. After multiple attempts to explain the same information petitions are closed as the case has come to a conclusion. Not liking the answer is not the absence of an answer.

The notion that we have no oversight is also patently false. On the EVE project I report to the Executive Producer for EVE Online. This has been made known to the CSM in past visits but given that the CSM opted not to receive a security presentation this time around perhaps there could be some misunderstanding on their part regarding how we are structured.

Will we see a thread next that Hilmar has no oversight? At what level is oversight acceptable? A director? A VP? At what level is complete fabrication designed specifically to cause my team and my company's reputation harm acceptable?

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#343 - 2013-02-12 17:49:48 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:


What's "BC" tool? I always used EvE Meep and another very famous manufacturing Excel File. I am always open to learn more P


Battleclinic. Its about the only thing I do use from that site.
John E Normus
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#344 - 2013-02-12 17:50:56 UTC
He was botting.

Well done CCP

Between Ignorance and Wisdom
Hannah Flex
#345 - 2013-02-12 17:51:22 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
This might also be cultural


It is. The bottom line is: this game is the property of CCP hf, it is their game, their server, their personnel and their policies, each and every one of you agree to these terms when you make a new account. We in the community are behind you 100% Sreegs, as a station trader myself I can greatly appreciate this situation and I hope that every last market botter gets banned and purged from this game.
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#346 - 2013-02-12 17:53:51 UTC
it is pretty apparent this scandal is 100% keledrum throwing a whiny fit because he was not treated with the respect he deserves as a Very Important Spaceship Person

shame on you sreegs are you not aware of how influential he is in the mmorpg community

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
Whitehound
#347 - 2013-02-12 17:54:37 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Imo CCP Sreegs does just one thing wrong.

No. CCP Sreegs is never wrong. He is God, he is the Grim-reaper, his word has power and when he speaks then it is judgement time!

Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#348 - 2013-02-12 17:54:41 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
Has anyone asked how this guy botted over 300 billion ISK before CCP caught on to what he was doing? Does the bot detector need some work, or was it just that he was sufficiently subtle in his botting that it took that long for CCP Sreegs's team to be sure it was actually a bot?


You will not get an answer to this as it gives out too much info on how they go about detecting bots. However I can say that 300 billion is not as huge a sum these days.
Annihilious
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#349 - 2013-02-12 17:54:45 UTC
Hannah Flex wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
This might also be cultural


It is. The bottom line is: this game is the property of CCP hf, it is their game, their server, their personnel and their policies, each and every one of you agree to these terms when you make a new account. We in the community are behind you 100% Sreegs, as a station trader myself I can greatly appreciate this situation and I hope that every last market botter gets banned and purged from this game.

I agree 1000% with this statement...
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#350 - 2013-02-12 17:54:55 UTC
Callie Cross wrote:
De'Veldrin wrote:
Callie Cross wrote:


Again... I'm not asking for full disclosure. I just believe that amount of ISK deserves more than a one liner or canned response.


Why do people in possession of more ISK deserve more thorough treatment than anyone else? As long as they were being treated equitably to other people in this situation, that's all they have the right to expect.



True enough. Everyone has a right to ask those questions, the amount doesn't really matter.


Having the right to ask the question and having the right to the answers is not the same thing. You know that, right?

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#351 - 2013-02-12 17:55:02 UTC
[quote=CCP Sreegs]

I'm not responding to copy pastes from another forum posted only there for the sole purpose of ensuring that I can't respond to them. I thought this couldn't get any more infantile but woo boy howdy was I wrong.

You must be new here......
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#352 - 2013-02-12 17:55:44 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:


What's "BC" tool? I always used EvE Meep and another very famous manufacturing Excel File. I am always open to learn more P


Battleclinic. Its about the only thing I do use from that site.


Ah, thank you. I used to use EvE HQ from the same web site, it had an unofficial sweet T2 invention plug in that made life so easy. But then the plug in stopped being updated Cry

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#353 - 2013-02-12 17:56:20 UTC
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Will we see a thread next that Hilmar has no oversight? At what level is oversight acceptable? A director? A VP? At what level is complete fabrication designed specifically to cause my team and my company's reputation harm acceptable?

the board of directors is the proper check on management malfesance that threatens shareholders but if you have any shareholders who care about this i would love to meet them and encourage them to invest in Weaselior's High-Yield Investment Program (these meetings and investments must take place in countries with no us extradition treaty or securities laws)

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#354 - 2013-02-12 17:56:44 UTC
Whitehound wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Imo CCP Sreegs does just one thing wrong.

No. CCP Sreegs is never wrong. He is God, he is the Grim-reaper, his word has power and when he speaks then it is judgement time!



Finally somebody gets it

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
Sariah Kion
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#355 - 2013-02-12 17:57:37 UTC
Eve Uni and its leadership are showing their arse with this nonsense. Reading the thread fully on their website I am embarrassed for them as a whole over their responses.

The thing is, backing a corpmate, even if guilty, is something I could understand, but the pettiness of fighting and making unfounded accusations only driven by greed for dirty isk, is just too much for a corporation that makes a living off of portraying a benevolence to the greater Eve community.

No one should donate to Eve Uni until there is a leadership purge.

[b]Librarian and Exotic Dancer Extraordinaire Champion of the Working Men and Women of Empire Space Anti-Null Sec Opium Den Movement President[/b] Not the woman high sec wants but the Woman high sec needs. [u]A modern girl for a modern world.[/u]
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#356 - 2013-02-12 17:57:39 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Will we see a thread next that Hilmar has no oversight? At what level is oversight acceptable? A director? A VP? At what level is complete fabrication designed specifically to cause my team and my company's reputation harm acceptable?

the board of directors is the proper check on management malfesance that threatens shareholders but if you have any shareholders who care about this i would love to meet them and encourage them to invest in Weaselior's High-Yield Investment Program (these meetings and investments must take place in countries with no us extradition treaty or securities laws)


I thought of that after I posted it and decided to pretend I hadn't instead

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#357 - 2013-02-12 17:58:44 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:


What's "BC" tool? I always used EvE Meep and another very famous manufacturing Excel File. I am always open to learn more P


Battleclinic. Its about the only thing I do use from that site.


Ah, thank you. I used to use EvE HQ from the same web site, it had an unofficial sweet T2 invention plug in that made life so easy. But then the plug in stopped being updated Cry


Yea I fear thats what happened with the maufacturing tool. The cruisers are now hoplessly wrong but on the bright side at least I'm using the old grey matter a bit more :ugh:
Callie Cross
Tax Code
#358 - 2013-02-12 18:00:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Callie Cross
CCP Sreegs wrote:


Sreegs also said Kelduum was made aware of three facts:

1) The petition had been escalated to me which is the highest point possible of escalation
2) The isk was taken because it was made illegally
3) We don't discuss information about why other people have been banned with anyone but the people in question

I know this because in some cases I said it to him directly and in others it was part of a petition reply. As I stated the outrage about a lack of information is completely fabricated as all of the above information was given and that's absolutely all that should have been given.



Agreed that is all that should have been said. Like I said, it all ends up as your word vs. his at this point.

CCP Sreegs wrote:


Will we see a thread next that Hilmar has no oversight? At what level is oversight acceptable? A director? A VP? At what level is complete fabrication designed specifically to cause my team and my company's reputation harm acceptable?


There's that "fabrication" word again. I get it, so Kelduum is lying (allegedly). But wait, are you saying that this was designed to hurt and cause harm to CCP?
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#359 - 2013-02-12 18:01:37 UTC
Whew. Late to the party.

I just have one observation.

I find it ironic but not surprising that the first reply in the linked forum thread is a call for legal action.

I also find that it seems that people really have no clue what it entails. Do you really have the $25,000.00 USD on hand just to get an action started? Is the final high six figure cost worth the wee bit of virtual currency you'd most likely never recover?

It always astounds me how fast an American (mostly) will jump on the least thing and shout "SUE THE BASTARD!!!", without a clue as to what it actually means.

Mr Epeen Cool
Callie Cross
Tax Code
#360 - 2013-02-12 18:01:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Callie Cross
double post...