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POSes: I am a small portion of the community

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Miss Vez
Perkone
Caldari State
#681 - 2013-01-17 13:51:18 UTC
for god sake :CCP: small part of the comunity my ass.
Sierruk
Inner Beard Society
Kvitravn.
#682 - 2013-01-17 13:52:12 UTC
Please don't ignore the POS system.. it's all wormholers live in.
Heimdallofasgard
Ministry of Furious Retribution
Fraternity.
#683 - 2013-01-17 13:52:36 UTC
JointVW
Remnants of the 8the armada
#684 - 2013-01-17 13:53:41 UTC
Time to fix posses damn what an anoyance.
KrakizBad
Section 8.
#685 - 2013-01-17 13:54:49 UTC
POS's suck, fix them
Eternal Error
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#686 - 2013-01-17 13:55:23 UTC
This is absolutely not acceptable. We understand that it will take a significant amount of time, but it NEEDS to be in the works. POSes in their current form are an unmitigated disaster. POS changes would positively affect WH pilots, supercap pilots, industrialists, and everyone in between.
Arkhamina
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#687 - 2013-01-17 13:55:41 UTC
I've spent the last 4 years as a director, or subdirector of a major alliance logistics department. Dear CCP Devs, yes, it is very important to me, and the people who live in null sec to fix these damned things. That my department of logistics people are consider the worst masochists in our alliance says something. I don't recruit newbies more out of charity and not wanting them to quit the game, than security.

My average 'new hire' working with POS lasts less than 2 weeks.

While better than the '5 hours to set up a POS' days, it's still currently about 3 hours, and the green BOX UI looks like something an unpromising student of Full Sail Game Design program would come up with.

There are whole classes of modules that are so laughably underpowered, no person or corp in their right mind would use them, Check your stats for how many blaster pos are set up outside of low sec? or even low sec?

Gunning in the age of logistics ship heavy fleets and supercap fleets is actually pointless. It used to be some of the best fun in the game, to go and pop battleships as they reinforced your pos. Now you scratch their paint, and if you're truly lucky, a cyno ship or warp in. POS don't have the teeth to deal with modern Eve.

The fact that you can't queue up modules to offline or online, that anchoring things is a 100% focus task - with your point of view changing if you accidentally click in space and drift - speaks more of bad back end programing than design. You can queue up other actions... why can't we have an elapsed time and a load out like the ship fitting screen with corp fits? 'Instead, I have MS Paint.
MS Paint POS tool

And I hope to seen an end to this:
I hate this green box


http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6162/6163475862_93d360ca50_o.jpg
Toxic Quantum
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium
#688 - 2013-01-17 13:55:57 UTC
Sedilis wrote:
Outrageous u-turn CCP!

Because of the terrible security on POS we w-space corp are forced to exclude large parts of the player base from our recruitment. When we explained this to Greyscale and Masterplan last March they could see this hits your bottom line.

We don't want the whole company for a whole expansion.

We don't even need a whole new pos system.

WE NEED SECURE SHIP STORAGE.

Please give us access control lists on Ship Maintenance Arrays!


C'mon you really think we are but a small part of the community and therefore not matter ? Sad
Ar madyl
Perkone
Caldari State
#689 - 2013-01-17 13:56:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Ar madyl
Glad to know W-space doesn't matter. Thanks, CCP....

(What have we gotten in the four years since wspace introduction? Corp bookmarks?)
Iniquita
Perkone
Caldari State
#690 - 2013-01-17 13:56:03 UTC
Here are a few things that are wrong with pos presently:

POS roles are horrible. In order to let someone do something with a single pos you have to grant them roles which allow them to mess with every other tower you have. You are not able to assign roles to specific towers, systems, constellations, individuals, or groups. This is a problem for wormhole dwellers as well who live in their pos for extended periods of time.

POS setup is a painful mechanic Right now when setting up a tower you must manipulate a green box into a position at least 45km or so from the pos in order to anchor it, you must do this for each module. The process of anchoring a large number of modules becomes one of tedious camera manipulation and counting modules to ensure they are placed properly.

The amount of keyboard time required to setup a large deathstar pos of the type used for staging in deployment systems can easily exceed 2-3 hours. This is the amount of time required simply to online all the modules, not move them, manipulate thier position, or fill them with ammo.

A large alliance requires significant out game tools to manage POS tasks such as: Notifying logistics when pos need fueled, notification of a structure attack, figuring out fuel needs, etc...

The stront timing mechanic is incredibly tedious, annoying to calculate, and strontium has an incredibly large volume.

If you've ever tried to move a supercap or especially a titan around in a pos bubble or during a mass login you'll understand how bumping and pos also present an interesting challenge. Additionally some pos modules such as a ship maintenance array have an incredibly small refitting range making it more practical to unanchor and move the module rather than try and navigate your titan in range.

You are also unable to swap t3 subsystems on a ship maintenance array requiring wormhole dwellers to find a station in k-space if they wish to swap subsystems on their ships.

Please do not abandon this pos revamp, it impacts more players than you are willing to admit
McDuglas
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#691 - 2013-01-17 13:57:06 UTC
POS-es only affect those, who actually do more than missions in highsec.
I agree with the need of revamping the POS-es, as a posmanager myself.
If you have lived in 0.0, lowsec, you had encountered poses, which required plenty of time to set up, and make them work.
Hell, I love the concept of owning things in middle of space, but the current pos-system just doesn't give me that feeling. Poses are just chains holding me and my time down...
Rotchink
Remnants of the 8the armada
#692 - 2013-01-17 13:57:26 UTC
I have a feeling ccp is mistaking in how many people use posses. From high to 0.0 to wh.
Nam Noissim
Red Lobsters Unilateral
#693 - 2013-01-17 13:57:29 UTC
CCP believes no (significant) additional income will come from reworking POS mechanics? Okay. CSM, CCP, here is how that belief is wrong.

Developers that do not update and enhance their game in accordance with their player base's wishes are known as scumbag developers. People wonder why they should bother giving that developer any money if the dev won't listen to what they want the game to be. This was proven by monaclegate nearly killing your game, followed by the Commissaring of a lead dev, followed by a patch entirely dedicated to new mechanics and bug fixes. You fixed your game, and bittervets came back.

At the same time, how many moons in high sec are not towered? Quite a few actually, once you get a bit out of the way. How many people would make 1-man research POSes if it was easier to figure out what to do in order to get one setup and working? Or how many people would venture into lowsec and try to deal with reactions for boosters? If you make something more attractive, people will try more, find things they like more, and tell their friends "Hey, this thing is awesome." and boom, you have a new subscriber.

Failing new subscribers, being good to your current ones is also a great idea, because when you do pull a dumb like monaclegate, they will have something to look back on and say "Ok, this is dumb, but they did X in the past, so I'ma stick with them and hopefully they'll right their dumb."
flakeys
Doomheim
#694 - 2013-01-17 14:00:53 UTC
Sierruk wrote:
Please don't ignore the POS system.. it's all wormholers live in.



It's not just wormholes.IF you look at the replies given here i think i can honestly say that this topic is the only thing that people in low-sec , null-sec ,high-sec and WH would agree on.

That alone speaks volumes.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Heimdallofasgard
Ministry of Furious Retribution
Fraternity.
#695 - 2013-01-17 14:01:53 UTC
Maybe CCP don't want to update pos's because... no-one at CCP has the faintest idea of how to use them?
rsantos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#696 - 2013-01-17 14:02:51 UTC
Just do it! Its broken.... fix it.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#697 - 2013-01-17 14:02:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
…I also have to question the whole “only a small portion” from a statistics standpoint. What are they actually looking at when they say that?

To my mind, using the last available numbers, some 6.5% of characters lived in w-space. They are affected to a man by how POSes (don't) work. 20% Nullsec? Yeah, pretty much everyone in that category as well. Lowsec? Eh, maybe a bit fewer, but it's not like every moon out there is empty… so let's add in half of them as well — another 4%. And finally highsec. The sheer amount of time required to find a free moon to park your POS at suggests that they're mighty popular in the highsec crowd as well. Can you find a spot? Sure. That doesn't mean that highsec isn't shock full of industrialists that rely on POSes for their work — it just means that there are an awful lot of moons out there. Their own surveys say that some 8% of the players are engaged in manufacturing, so let's be conservative and add in that proportion of highseccers as well — another ~5%.

That means at least a third of the players in this game are directly affected by how POSes work and interact with them on a regular basis, and pretty much everyone else will be indirectly affected.

That is not “a small portion”. It is a pretty large portion. It is a portion on the same scale as how many run missions. It is also a very weak excuse unless they can specify it further and explain what they mean.
Typo Interobang
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#698 - 2013-01-17 14:03:09 UTC
I have always avoided doing any work with a POS other than keeping some ships in a corp hanger. The things are too much trouble and take too much time. Please make them fun.
Mizhir
Devara Biotech
#699 - 2013-01-17 14:03:40 UTC
So they say that it will only affect a small portion of the players .... what about they redesign the system to make poses more accessable and desireable for more players, rather than keeping it as a "thing for a small portion of the players".

❤️️💛💚💙💜
Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#700 - 2013-01-17 14:04:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Alx Warlord
700

in a few hours (from 3:39 to 14:04).... will you wait for the whole player-base to say something to prove you wrong CCP?

You should read every comment here also... just for your suffering...as we suffer with the expectative and the POS system...

"Sand Castle POS" FTW

Please read these!

New POS system New SOV system