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Missions & Complexes

 
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Regarding AFK Complex Farming

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Suqq Madiq
#221 - 2012-08-09 17:13:45 UTC
Georgiy Giggle wrote:
Bring a balance to game between real players and bots, instead of beating REAL players only!!!


You think these players who park their Sentry ships in PLEXes 23hrs / day, 7days / week are real players. That's your problem. They're no better than bots and deserve to be banned.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#222 - 2012-08-09 17:14:36 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
CCP Sreegs wrote:

I'm merely going to quote this. It's not going to please everyone and certainly not going to please those who were making isk while going about their lives doing things other than playing EVE actively but at the end of the day we're only referring to situations in THIS PARTICULAR CASE where you could in theory generate isk 24 hours a day without ever touching your computer. This does not apply to every situation you might perhaps maybe possibly use sentry drones in and nobody's going to ban your accounts because you went to get a cup of coffee.

There were however cases where this was being abused and so we're stating publically that abusing it is wrong and from this point forward the automated systems will handle it.

Protip for the future: if your computer is logged in 24 (or way more than a person can) hours a day making money in a way that is meant to be active and you're not in front of it you're probably doing something wrong


Protip for CCPs higher ups if your PvE has withered so bad and is prone to such 'exploits' then it needs a serious revamp.
In CCP Unifex's last interview he was proud & crowing over only having 4 content designers in his employ while having many programmers. How about putting these programmers to work on the content so we don't have these issues... like say immediately start implementing sleeper & Incursion AI on missions & complexes you don't see these being AFK'd now do you?
This is not a case of the players doing something wrong this is a case of CCP doing something wrong.
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Vera Algaert
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#223 - 2012-08-09 17:15:11 UTC
Ghost Frog wrote:
You can't read. They are working on fixing it. UNTIL THEY'RE DONE FIXING IT, IT'S A BANNABLE OFFENSE.

they had about half a year (from the point where their false positives started to get discussed in GD) to fix it already, so what makes you think that they will actually take the hard route (digging through old & nasty code) instead of trying to keep the bandaid around for as long as possible?

.
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#224 - 2012-08-09 17:15:20 UTC
The level of reading comprehension in this thread is pathetic.

I'm not sure if you can take what Sreegs is saying out of context anymore than you idiots are.

Not today spaghetti.
SmashTech
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#225 - 2012-08-09 17:15:48 UTC
Seriously Sreegs, how much money is too much money?
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#226 - 2012-08-09 17:15:51 UTC
Naomi Shana wrote:
That boner, plus the plain old :CCP: knee-jerk heavy-handedness of "let's punish players for using what we've given them instead of addressing the code issue", has everyone concerned.


Except for the part where they said they're working on a way to fix the plexs that cause this issue, right?

Or is it more fun to pretend you didn't read that part so you can complain louder and look sillier?

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Daisy Vinthyn
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#227 - 2012-08-09 17:18:55 UTC
I've been "out of game" for about two years now but still log in to keep my skills changed. It appears in that two year span all the new players that have joined the game have the comprehension skills of a turtle.
Naomi Shana
Iron.Guard
Fraternity.
#228 - 2012-08-09 17:21:20 UTC
War Kitten wrote:
Naomi Shana wrote:
That boner, plus the plain old :CCP: knee-jerk heavy-handedness of "let's punish players for using what we've given them instead of addressing the code issue", has everyone concerned.


Except for the part where they said they're working on a way to fix the plexs that cause this issue, right?

Or is it more fun to pretend you didn't read that part so you can complain louder and look sillier?


Damage control detected.

CCP alt?

Yes, CCP says they are working on it. But that doesn't change the fact that they are going to punish players for doing something over HERE that's perfectly fine to do over THERE.
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#229 - 2012-08-09 17:23:05 UTC
Vera Algaert wrote:
Ghost Frog wrote:
You can't read. They are working on fixing it. UNTIL THEY'RE DONE FIXING IT, IT'S A BANNABLE OFFENSE.

they had about half a year (from the point where their false positives started to get discussed in GD) to fix it already, so what makes you think that they will actually take the hard route (digging through old & nasty code) instead of trying to keep the bandaid around for as long as possible?


I'd say the fact that they haven't implemented any of the quick and dirty half-baked suggestions that keep cropping up in this thread points to CCP digging through the old nasty code and looking for a way to genuinely improve it rather than slap a bandaid fix into the code.

Also - this probably isn't the highest priority in the world as far as programming time goes.

If CCP tells you "don't put your hand in the oven too long, you'll get burned", a reasonable human being ought to be able to understand and heed this warning until child-proof locks can be put on the oven door.

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Suqq Madiq
#230 - 2012-08-09 17:26:32 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
immediately start implementing sleeper & Incursion AI on missions & complexes you don't see these being AFK'd now do you?
This is not a case of the players doing something wrong this is a case of CCP doing something wrong.


This is most definitely a case of the players doing something wrong. That you can't see or comprehend that is down to your own narrow-sightedness. The mechanics that prevent Sleeper and Incursion sites from being AFK farmed 23 hours a day have absolutely nothing to do with what allows static PLEXes to be AFK farmed for 23 hours a day. Giving the static PLEX NPCs Sleeper AI would do nothing to curb this botting problem. Banning the botters will.
EvilweaselSA
GoonCorp
Goonswarm Federation
#231 - 2012-08-09 17:26:59 UTC
War Kitten wrote:
Naomi Shana wrote:
That boner, plus the plain old :CCP: knee-jerk heavy-handedness of "let's punish players for using what we've given them instead of addressing the code issue", has everyone concerned.


Except for the part where they said they're working on a way to fix the plexs that cause this issue, right?

Or is it more fun to pretend you didn't read that part so you can complain louder and look sillier?

Most of what you've been claiming in this thread is completely disproven by the actual sequence of events at issue.
Antal Jozsef
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#232 - 2012-08-09 17:27:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Antal Jozsef
Ghost Frog wrote:
Mike Head wrote:
Antal Jozsef wrote:
I'm very disappointed CCP.
Just wait a little bit and the forums will be filled up with requests(whines) to make other things you can do while being afk, to be made a bannable offense. AFK cloaking, AFK mining to name a few.
Others have said it, but here it is again; instead of fixing, you choose banning, which is always a stupid and lazy solution, and it's not even going to work. People will find a way around it in a short time.
You should be ashamed CCP...

edit: ... And this thing is around for ages, and you knew about it, and is this the best you could come up with?


You can't read. They are working on fixing it. UNTIL THEY'RE DONE FIXING IT, IT'S A BANNABLE OFFENSE.

I decided to play EVE because I was under the impression you had to have a certain level of intellectual ability to play. But if you can't read the entirety of an article and get the gist, I think you should retake the tutorial.

Perhaps your intellect isn't as sharp as you would like to believe. I was under the impression that everyone knew that the EVE forums were heavily populated with players looking to spin various arguments for their own purposes. "Meta" and all that. IF YOU READ CAREFULLY, MAYBE YOU WILL FIGURE IT OUT. But I doubt it.


And thats exactly why ccp should not do things like this.
EvilweaselSA
GoonCorp
Goonswarm Federation
#233 - 2012-08-09 17:27:55 UTC
Suqq Madiq wrote:
DarthNefarius wrote:
immediately start implementing sleeper & Incursion AI on missions & complexes you don't see these being AFK'd now do you?
This is not a case of the players doing something wrong this is a case of CCP doing something wrong.


This is most definitely a case of the players doing something wrong. That you can't see or comprehend that is down to your own narrow-sightedness. The mechanics that prevent Sleeper and Incursion sites from being AFK farmed 23 hours a day have absolutely nothing to do with what allows static PLEXes to be AFK farmed for 23 hours a day. Giving the static PLEX NPCs Sleeper AI would do nothing to curb this botting problem. Banning the botters will.

There is, according to everyone involved, no bots involved here. This is not botting. It never has been botting. It never will be botting.
Antal Jozsef
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#234 - 2012-08-09 17:29:44 UTC
Suqq Madiq wrote:
DarthNefarius wrote:
immediately start implementing sleeper & Incursion AI on missions & complexes you don't see these being AFK'd now do you?
This is not a case of the players doing something wrong this is a case of CCP doing something wrong.


This is most definitely a case of the players doing something wrong. That you can't see or comprehend that is down to your own narrow-sightedness. The mechanics that prevent Sleeper and Incursion sites from being AFK farmed 23 hours a day have absolutely nothing to do with what allows static PLEXes to be AFK farmed for 23 hours a day. Giving the static PLEX NPCs Sleeper AI would do nothing to curb this botting problem. Banning the botters will.


They are banning the botters for years, thats why we don't have any oh wait...
SmashTech
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#235 - 2012-08-09 17:36:22 UTC
can someone point out for me where the automatic keystroke and mouseclick generation parts are

because I must have missed them
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#236 - 2012-08-09 17:38:17 UTC  |  Edited by: War Kitten
Naomi Shana wrote:
War Kitten wrote:
Naomi Shana wrote:
That boner, plus the plain old :CCP: knee-jerk heavy-handedness of "let's punish players for using what we've given them instead of addressing the code issue", has everyone concerned.


Except for the part where they said they're working on a way to fix the plexs that cause this issue, right?

Or is it more fun to pretend you didn't read that part so you can complain louder and look sillier?


Damage control detected.

CCP alt?



CCP Common Sense** - You caught me!




** - not really, afaik, there is no one in CCP with Common Sense ++




++ - with Common Sense as their nickname that is!



:)



Honestly, I'm not a CCP alt, never worked for CCP, and am totally not impersonating anyone in any shape or form. When I think they deserve a good bashing, I'll bash 'em. When I think CCP is doing it right and people on the forums are being idiots, I'll speak up then too.

This would be another one of the "then too" moments.

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#237 - 2012-08-09 17:38:46 UTC
mkint wrote:

Probably should have mentioned that there's a bugged complex in the news post. I was all like "I wonder if afk missioning is on the chopping block next, or rookies mining in industrials, or etc." It sounds like I'm not the only one who was confused by it.

I think there is a bit of confusion on what a "complex" is. There are those that spawn, get completed and de-spawn. But there are many fixed complexes that sit in one spot and keep producing NPCs to shoot, indefinitely. Specifically, the COSMOS complexes in several high sec solar systems. Those are not bugged complexes, they supposed to do that.

Given those, players got this great idea: Get a Domi, fill the highs with remote reps, the mids with cap rechargers, and the lows with tank. Fly to a COSMOS site, launch sentry drones, target them all with the RR, and go afk all day.

Other people got the great idea of suicide attacking the Domi. All it takes is some neuting. The Domi is barely cap stable, so not much is needed to get a cap crash. Then you wait for the NPCs to finish it off and scoop the loot. Best of all the sec status hit for ship aggression is far smaller then it is for ship destruction, so only a little community service is needed to recover it.

But... all gone now.

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Frozen fanfiction
Psyise
Orderly Conduct
#238 - 2012-08-09 17:39:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Psyise
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Dregol wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
Octoven wrote:
Your point is valid; however, if they enforce that penalty on AFKing a complex then they must do the same with any other form of AFK actions


Says who? You're talking about two totally different things here.


No, you're wrong. AFK mining, AFK plexing, AFK missioning, AFK god damn ******* industry then should be policed as it makes isk while afk. Even if tending to the ship to empty ore or change drones or get new ones that popped, it's still an afk action while making isk. So no, you're wrong. Goon.


Wrong.

If you'd take the time to read this thread, you'd realize that there was a broken complex whereby people could AFK and have drones kill respawns 23/7. This is /not/ working as intended. AFKing through something that isn't respawning (regular complexes) is fine. What CCP is addressing is a mechanic whereby you can do nothing for hours on end and continue to make isk.

My point from earlier still stands: isk should not be as easy to make as it is in high sec. I'm glad CCP is actively fixing bugs/broken mechanics, but there are mechanics far more broken than this.


I'm merely going to quote this. It's not going to please everyone and certainly not going to please those who were making isk while going about their lives doing things other than playing EVE actively but at the end of the day we're only referring to situations in THIS PARTICULAR CASE where you could in theory generate isk 24 hours a day without ever touching your computer. This does not apply to every situation you might perhaps maybe possibly use sentry drones in and nobody's going to ban your accounts because you went to get a cup of coffee.

There were however cases where this was being abused and so we're stating publically that abusing it is wrong and from this point forward the automated systems will handle it.

Protip for the future: if your computer is logged in 24 (or way more than a person can) hours a day making money in a way that is meant to be active and you're not in front of it you're probably doing something wrong


I don't AFK or play the game this way but I disagree with your logic and would support players who do. You designed the game but then want to punish people for playing the game within the confines you have setup?

It's not cheating or an exploit and players shouldn't be punished. You should fix the game rather than wasting time coming up with a method to make people play the way you want or punish them if they don't.

ie. Fix the game, keep people from being able to idle like this for 23 hours at a time, change the way the respawns occur. Create a timeout on sentry drone operation. The "universe" is the limit in the way you can shape and mold the game but don;t punish players for operating within the confines you have setup.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#239 - 2012-08-09 17:40:48 UTC
The 67% wrote:

It has come to our attention recently that there are pilots in New Eden engaging in AFK MOON GOO farming. Specific examples of this include such activities as warping into a particular tech MOON in NULL, dropping a POS, then going to do your laundry or perhaps watch a month long Lazytown marathon. While this activity does not necessitate the use of a 3rd party program in order to carry it out you ARE generating income in an automated fashion while sleeping which is not being present playing the game. As such our automated systems will continue to detect and institute administrative actions for this activity. We do not find this to be acceptable gameplay.




Fixed Lol
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#240 - 2012-08-09 17:45:33 UTC
EvilweaselSA wrote:
War Kitten wrote:
Naomi Shana wrote:
That boner, plus the plain old :CCP: knee-jerk heavy-handedness of "let's punish players for using what we've given them instead of addressing the code issue", has everyone concerned.


Except for the part where they said they're working on a way to fix the plexs that cause this issue, right?

Or is it more fun to pretend you didn't read that part so you can complain louder and look sillier?

Most of what you've been claiming in this thread is completely disproven by the actual sequence of events at issue.


A challenge!

Accepted - where's your reference to the "actual sequence of events"? I'll take a look at your sources and gladly reconsider my standpoint.

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.