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What keeps you from PvPing?

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Marconus Orion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#361 - 2012-07-15 22:28:57 UTC
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
I don't even think the OP is reading this thread anymore.

I have read every word of every post, even the ones from the trolls. Big smile
Hicksimus
Torgue
#362 - 2012-07-15 23:08:25 UTC
There is a fine line between excitement and fun if you take some time to think about that idea. Angry birds has never been exciting but a lot of people have had hours of fun playing it. The same goes for downhill mountain biking, I enjoy the excitement of it today and even more so when I was young but ripping through trees at speeds where they can kill you on the edge of control wasn't fun to me, it was just incredibly exciting. Given the IQ of forum trolls I should probably add several more examples to make the point but the smart trolls will have a small victory if I do that.

Also, have you looked at my kill board.....whenever I can put serious at the keyboard time in to EvE I'm looking for PvP. It has the excitement I want from a game but like I said, it's a shin kicking competition (unless you are in blobbing PvP) so it's not amazingly fun. I know quite a few different carebears and carebear corps, it just doesn't appeal to them because they frequently don't have the numbers to do it. When they do engage in PvP they do find it exciting, but for some people it takes more than excitement to donate 15m SP into a part time activity.

Recruitment Officer: What type of a pilot are you? Me: I've been described as a Ray Charles with Parkinsons and a drinking problem.
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#363 - 2012-07-15 23:17:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Jorma Morkkis
I don't own working mic and can't mine my moon goo and read overview at the same time.

A bit difficult to be part of small gang warfare.

Small gang = 500+ peoples.
Pipa Porto
#364 - 2012-07-15 23:29:28 UTC
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:
You know whats funny? You really know who to blame for this? Its the gankers.

Miner gets ganked, its pretty 50/50 on what he does:
Rages out an goes PVP capable
Rages out on the forums and hates PVP after that.
And it looks that most of the miners do number two

Pipa Porto wrote:


That's fine. If you don't like PvP that's just fine. But when the Carebears try to break my game the way the got SW:G broken and killed, I'm going to argue against them, because I don't want EvE to get broken and killed.

If you don't like PvP, then a game that explicitly allows non-consensual PvP may not be the game for you. And that's fine, no hard feelings.


as usual; you dont get it.

I figure youve never read anything Ive ever said in the past, but Im one of the nonconsentual PVP LIKING carebears.

If this game DIDNT have the nonconsentual PVP flare, it would be boring as ****.

Take last night for example. I took a Hulk from highsec to my null system. MYSELF. I didnt pay to have it shipped cause I thought it might be fun.
AND IT WAS. I had a guy follow me for several gates cause I wasnt paying near enough attention as I should have - until I got locked. Then I was praying "jumpjumpjumpjumpjumpjumpjumpjumpjumpjump" until I was gone.
When he caught me after the next gate, I was aligning and aiming at the station not the gate and he locked me, attempted to scram (I had 2 stabs, yeah I thought ahead) and got a shot off but I got away and THAT WAS FUN.
Currently Im stuck one jump away from my destination in a friendly station but still lol

Blobbing thousands of ships on a hundred ships, not fun
Getting suicide ganked in high sec? Yea thats not fun either

One combat ready guy in an Enyo vs my Hulk (with the tank off, I was looking to gtfo not fight, I didnt even have time to THINK about turning it on) FUN AS HELL (when I got away).
But yeah this, TOTALLY not my game right?

trollololol


I have read your stuff in the past. That's why I use "If... then..." statements. The thing about public forums is that you need to strike a balance between talking specifically vs generally. "If... then..." statements are great for that.

If you are the type of miner who rages out on the forums about getting ganked, then EvE might not be the game for you.
If you are the type of miner who's suicidally brave enough to run a Null pipe in a Hulk, then you'll probably fit in just fine.

Like I said, if someone doesn't like non-consensual PvP, that's fine. I just ask them to not try to break the only large MMO where it's available the way EvE has it available, and instead pick another product that might suit them better.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Skogen Gump
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#365 - 2012-07-15 23:52:24 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:
They're afraid to lose their stuff.


Laconic but surprisingly efficacious;
When I first started, all I heard about was epic ganks, PvP (I thought it was some kind of arena based game!) and people loosing everything.

The very thought of that scared me into not touching PvP until I taken by the hand, so to speak, and shown how it all works.

Also, regardless of the benefits of emergent play and the sandbox; the game is generally unfair to t hose of a nervous or cautious disposition. Knowing that Concord will *avenge* my gank is not equivalent to doing it myself and 9 times out of 10, you've got no chance to avenge yourself anyway.

Yes the sandbox is open and awesome; but the very rights that we cherish as a mature and experienced community often drive away new players. If you don't understand space combat (and lets face it, it's not necessarily a natural ability), getting your hulk ganked by someone who really doesn't get any *real* punishment will drive you away from PvP.

TL;DR? People feel impotent because Concord will protect bullies as well as people trying to get revengel Then - people are scared of Pvp.
Jamyl the Great
Doomheim
#366 - 2012-07-16 00:31:24 UTC
Almost every time I have gone out and looked for a fight (I even moved to npc null a few times) I end up getting blobbed by 20+ hostiles. I guess I just haven't learned how to chose engagements wisely. Eventually I always run out of cash, or find it too annoying getting blown up trying to bring more ships in, and return to highsec.

I'm not afraid to lose ships or even expensive ships, its just super frustrating after a month or two. Also I don't condemn the blob at all: I understand that pvp is about winning, why not use every advantage at your disposition?

TL;DR teach me how to avoid gangrape plz
Anya Ohaya
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#367 - 2012-07-16 00:48:27 UTC
On the odd occasion that I find someone who isn't clearly a clueless noob, or a hardcore PVPer with a dozen friends on the other end of a batphone I'll engage. But since those two groups are about 99% of potential targets I don't open fire too often.

Sometimes I think I should fire a couple of warning shots at the clueless just to scare them off. The ones that aren't bait usually end up getting blown up by real pirates pretty quickly anyway.
RADTrooper
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#368 - 2012-07-16 00:53:43 UTC
I never got into PvP because I suck at it.

In high sec, the only PvP I've participated in is after being baited by can flippers and those who steal loot. It took me a few weeks to learn that I save myself money and have more fun with the game by NOT shooting at them.

After I got my courage back and some money to lose, I eventually went into lowsec a couple of times with a T1 frig, but all I ran into there were T2 Battleship Pirates or gate/station camps.

I don't like losing. I lose at PvP. PvP is not fun for me.
Antisocial Malkavian
Antisocial Malkavians
#369 - 2012-07-16 01:06:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Antisocial Malkavian
Hicksimus wrote:
There is a fine line between excitement and fun if you take some time to think about that idea. Angry birds has never been exciting but a lot of people have had hours of fun playing it. The same goes for downhill mountain biking, I enjoy the excitement of it today and even more so when I was young but ripping through trees at speeds where they can kill you on the edge of control wasn't fun to me, it was just incredibly exciting.


Yeah running the 20j nullsec pipe in a Hulk for example lol exciting and fun, especially when the guy almost caught me at the end but REALLY DUMB lol

Pipa Porto wrote:


I have read your stuff in the past. That's why I use "If... then..." statements. The thing about public forums is that you need to strike a balance between talking specifically vs generally. "If... then..." statements are great for that.

If you are the type of miner who rages out on the forums about getting ganked, then EvE might not be the game for you.
If you are the type of miner who's suicidally brave enough to run a Null pipe in a Hulk, then you'll probably fit in just fine.

Like I said, if someone doesn't like non-consensual PvP, that's fine. I just ask them to not try to break the only large MMO where it's available the way EvE has it available, and instead pick another product that might suit them better.


But yeah the dipshit crew of "I hate nonconsential PVP lets make flags" need to get the hell out.
Moreso the ones that actively lobby CCP to do it, with more and more and more forum alts so they look like a lotta ppl

Quote:
If you are the type of miner who's suicidally brave enough to run a Null pipe in a Hulk, then you'll probably fit in just fine.


lol I never thought I WAS that guy till I did it.
I got complacent. I made the trip in a Fully fitted CNR for the purpose of complexing days earlier and thought it was "safe" and thankfully someone proved me wrong

And, isn't sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.

Johan Civire
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#370 - 2012-07-16 01:09:04 UTC
Ok let me say this. Many answer are correct but here is the deal for me i have done pvp and its boring. waiting and first target its no fun. The game is just to slow for pvp. iam more for fast pvp not slow. In the onther hand pve its more my thing in eve. There are better ways to spend time than wasting time for some blowing up a random ship no. Its to slow my tast of pvp.
Antisocial Malkavian
Antisocial Malkavians
#371 - 2012-07-16 01:11:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Antisocial Malkavian
man... I may just jump in a implantless clone and look for ppl to blow up lol

...I think I got bit by the PVP bug O.o

atm whats keeping me from it is an entry route in lol

"jump in a rifter pew pew" doesnt work cause Im in 0.0, there any basic guides to teach to go out scan down your prey and murder them?

Cause Im BETTING something like that thats visible and available would get more ppl to enter PVP and discover that its fun lol

And, isn't sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.

Celeste Taylor
Ruby Dynasty
#372 - 2012-07-16 04:45:14 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Simple: he flies it very, very poorly and would be more effective in a thorax.


I am very confused. If someone could please answer this simple question. Is it easier for a rookie who has no interest in combat to complete the 4th level story mission Shipyard Theft with a Thorax than it is to complete with a Navy Megathron? The post clearly is built around level four PvE mission and is more about surviving mission running more than just effectivene use of a ship. Are level four missions easier to complete with a cruiser than they are with a battleship?

I am under the impression that level four missions are harder to complete with T1 cruisers, am I wrong???
Herr Hammer Draken
#373 - 2012-07-16 05:37:45 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
More Bullshit




No. No. and... you guessed it.... Absolutely No.


Without question, under no circumstances, can a 2 day old player kill 3 fully fit and properly flown Tengus. No way, no how and no exception. You, and the other guy, are completely full of crap if you claim otherwise. Further more, IMO, everyone should be insulted that you would think that we're so stupid as to believe you.


Only the sheer and unimaginable stupidity of said Tengu pilots could allow this to happen. Or, it was an intentionally orchestrated lul mail on the part of said Tengu pilots just to spread more "prol33tPVP'ers" propaganda. Take your pick.


Akeiri never said that Evan Drinker soloed them. She said that he "accomplished some hilarious clutch moves." In a battle that resulted in 3 Tengu kills.

A 2 day old newbie can certainly keep 3 tengus pinned down long enough for them to get deadified over the course of a short battle.


Here is the part Ruby is not telling you. Yes a 2 day old player can keep the tengu tackled as long as the 2 day old player is flying in a fleet with enough power in the fleet to kill those tengus and assuming the tengues do not target the 2 day old player to get rid of the tackle. If you get you lost ship replaced by the fleet is for a different thread. Some do some do not.

If that is your thing then it is fine if not and most 2 day old players will say it is not their thing then Ruby is right and wrong at the same time. In the end only working as part of a team will get those tengues killed. Teams are not for everyone in eve for a whole host of reasons. Again a subject for a different thread. The subject for this thread was why do you not PvP.
PvP can be 1v1 or fleet battles. Ruby is not telling you it is possible as a solo player that you can beat those tengues. That is not possible.

Herr Hammer Draken "The Amarr Prophet"
Anna Shoul
#374 - 2012-07-16 05:44:30 UTC
Marconus Orion wrote:
I have read every word of every post, even the ones from the trolls. Big smile


But once you have satisfied your curiosity, do you plan to do anything? Because the only people with the power to seriously affect the situation would be the developers, most of those reasons have their roots deep in the game mechanics. Even the social reasons.
Pipa Porto
#375 - 2012-07-16 05:46:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Pipa Porto
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
More Bullshit




No. No. and... you guessed it.... Absolutely No.


Without question, under no circumstances, can a 2 day old player kill 3 fully fit and properly flown Tengus. No way, no how and no exception. You, and the other guy, are completely full of crap if you claim otherwise. Further more, IMO, everyone should be insulted that you would think that we're so stupid as to believe you.


Only the sheer and unimaginable stupidity of said Tengu pilots could allow this to happen. Or, it was an intentionally orchestrated lul mail on the part of said Tengu pilots just to spread more "prol33tPVP'ers" propaganda. Take your pick.


Akeiri never said that Evan Drinker soloed them. She said that he "accomplished some hilarious clutch moves." In a battle that resulted in 3 Tengu kills.

A 2 day old newbie can certainly keep 3 tengus pinned down long enough for them to get deadified over the course of a short battle.


Here is the part Ruby is not telling you. Yes a 2 day old player can keep the tengu tackled as long as the 2 day old player is flying in a fleet with enough power in the fleet to kill those tengus and assuming the tengues do not target the 2 day old player to get rid of the tackle. If you get you lost ship replaced by the fleet is for a different thread. Some do some do not.

If that is your thing then it is fine if not and most 2 day old players will say it is not their thing then Ruby is right and wrong at the same time. In the end only working as part of a team will get those tengues killed. Teams are not for everyone in eve for a whole host of reasons. Again a subject for a different thread. The subject for this thread was why do you not PvP.
PvP can be 1v1 or fleet battles. Ruby is not telling you it is possible as a solo player that you can beat those tengues. That is not possible.


It's not reasonably possible to Solo 3 Tengus no matter how many SP you have. So what's your point?

If you're flying Solo, then taking a 3v1 is usually a bad idea, unless you outclass them in some way.

A 2 day old newb is demonstrably able to meaningfully contribute to PvP against much higher SP pilots. Add some more time (6 weeks or so), and a newb can keep a Super tackled just as well as anyone else.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#376 - 2012-07-16 06:06:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Halete
Boudicca Arbosa wrote:
This game is filled to the brim with people that have years of accumalated wealth, modules, knowledge and PVP skills that get a raging hard on killing. That's fine. It's part of the game...but that doesn't make it any less intimidating. THAT'S why a vast majority of ppl sit in high sec.

The game is simply not noob friendly in any way, shape or form. And I don't see a mass exodus to lowsec by newbs if the system remains intimidating. THis is just the nature of the game now. Lowsec is a circlejerk of vets, while us noobs sit in HighSec because we wouldn't even know how to start a fight.


Citation needed.

EDIT: Actually, I was surprised this thread was arrive when I opened GD this morning. Then I read through it a bit and realized that it's come down to one side of the argument being purely conjecture.

Chief Radomir wrote:
Marconus Orion wrote:
I am very curious as to what barriers, if any, keep you from PvPing?


-Snip-


As someone who has been playing video-games for 15 years, including the PvP of dozens of MMOs, you couldn't be more wrong (although I'll concede on the UI point).

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21
Marconus Orion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#377 - 2012-07-16 08:05:36 UTC
Anna Shoul wrote:
Marconus Orion wrote:
I have read every word of every post, even the ones from the trolls. Big smile


But once you have satisfied your curiosity, do you plan to do anything? Because the only people with the power to seriously affect the situation would be the developers, most of those reasons have their roots deep in the game mechanics. Even the social reasons.


Well I am not sure there has ever been a thread like this actually. Every post or thread there has been on these forums is someone thrusting their opinion why other people don't PvP. If there has been one before, it has been an extremely long time.

I am not sure what I will do with the information. Not really sure if I should do anything with it.

What I have seen mentioned several times by people has things to do with time invested to get to the action of PvP, cost associated with it and the general attitude of the PvP community. I guess I am just enjoying sitting back and listening for a change. Some of the perceptions about all things associated may not be correct in my eyes, but I am starting to understand more how players come to these conclusions.

It is not like they just wake up one day and say, "Hey. I'm going to play EVE-Online and HATE PvP with a passion!" There is usually many factors that drive them to this. For me I will continue to try and listen.
Hestia Mar
Calmaretto
#378 - 2012-07-16 10:07:07 UTC
I've been following this thread with interest, even though I'm a player who isn't interested in typical PVP.

What I don't want is any change to the game mechanics that mean that non-consensual PVP can take place - I simply accept that as part of the game.

However what it seems to me is the one of the main problems with PVP is the people that do it 'as a living', especially their desire to only fight when they are sure of a win - as someone has already said, these leet PVP'rs are as afraid of losing their stuff as any hi-sec carebear, so they fight when losses are very unlikely; rr they are willing to flaunt their ability to replace any ships without a second thought (witness last night's AT, and the use of Malleus frigs by PL)

You have to ask these PVP'rs: in a hypothetical situation, lets say a fleet with Logi, EWAR and DPS is camping a gate, and an absolutely identical fleet warped into the system, would either side fight against a fleet that matches them exactly...?

While this thread has been and continues to make interesting reading, in the end we all know that nothing is going to change!
S'No Flake
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#379 - 2012-07-16 13:52:47 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:

Here's the difference.

EvE is a Game that people CHOOSE to play. If they don't enjoy some core aspect of the game, then I don't understand why they play.

You don't have a choice about participating in RL.


Blinders. Remove them some times.


I don't understand, are people being forced to play EvE?


Yes.
(Unfortunately) EvE it is one of a kind.
No other game compares with EvE :)
Cameron Vayle
Dreadnoughtz Conclave
Northern Coalition.
#380 - 2012-07-16 15:29:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Cameron Vayle
What keeps me out for the most part is simple.

I like to build the stuff that you all like to blow up Big smile.

It is hard to find a corp/alliance that will allow me to do this the vast majority of the time that I am in low sec as they want you to go on roams and such almost all the time.

I will fly out to defend our space when needed as I don't really care if I lose my ship for a good cause. But hunting just to hunt? Nah, I would rather be stocking up on things that were going to be needed for the future.

Soooo....if anyone out there would honestly like someone like this just let me know. Of late just been changing skills out of boredom. Though finally did break 100 million skill points which was nice.