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New dev blog: Unified Inventory Changes

First post First post First post
Author
CCP Soundwave
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1041 - 2012-05-26 11:48:34 UTC
Captain Praxis wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:

...
This feature is not what we want it to be, for that you have our apologies and we'll do everything we can to fix it.
...


Thanks Soundwave, I think that's what we all want to hear.

It's a real shame we got into this situation, but we can't turn back the clock, so the main thing now is to get the UI to an acceptable level of functionality as soon as possible.

o7
Captain Praxis


Agree. As mentioned, my apologies once again and let's hope we can rectify this situation swiftly.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#1042 - 2012-05-26 11:49:10 UTC
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Mentet wrote:
Strange how CCP have gone very quiet.



It's the weekend, we won't be able to reply at the same pace as we can during the weekdays.

In general though, I'll happily push changes to the inventory out every single week until we're happy.


Bolded the part that CCP CEO Hilmar apologized about.
I am sorry, evidently Incarna did not teach enough.

Your AWESOME <> Our awesome.
disasteur
Tellcomtec Industries.
#1043 - 2012-05-26 11:51:50 UTC
Spanking Monkeys wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Jebediah MacAhab Dallocort wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Mentet wrote:
Strange how CCP have gone very quiet.



It's the weekend, we won't be able to reply at the same pace as we can during the weekdays.

In general though, I'll happily push changes to the inventory out every single week until we're happy. That's something I don't think we've ever done before, but if that's what it takes to make this good, then so be it.

Oh, changes you're happy with. So much for what we (you know, the people paying you money) might be happy with, right?

What the hell are you smoking? You're representing CCP, and yet continue to stand here twiddling your thumbs denying there's a problem. So, let me make this simple for you.

Look at your forums. See how there's lots of threads about people wanting this crapfest gone? See this topic, right here, where the overwhelming majority want the new UI rolled back? I know, it might require opening your eyes, which may be tough, but you can do it, man.

Now, I want you to follow along, here.


  1. Open up your SCM.
  2. Open up the commit log.
  3. Find which commit removed the legacy inventory.
  4. Hit "Revert".
  5. Send to QA Oh wait, you don't have a QA department.
  6. Deploy to SiSi.
  7. Listen to SiSi testers, apply necessary fixes.
  8. Rinse and repeat until SiSi is satisfied.
  9. Deploy to TQ.


See? That wasn't too bad, was it?


Just to clarify, when I say "we're happy with" I mean getting the inventory into a shape that's satisfactory to the playerbase.

No one has at any point denied there is a problem. The fact that I'm telling you we're willing to basically patch this feature every week should tell you as much. I'll happily put it in writing though (again): This feature is not what we want it to be, for that you have our apologies and we'll do everything we can to fix it.


if this feature isnt what you want it to be and the bulk of the feedback is negative, why in gods name would you waste more time on it. surely it has to be faster and easier and less anoying on your customers, if you just say we will revert it and not waste time and cash patching failure



then stop fixing and work on a roleback
Maraner
The Executioners
#1044 - 2012-05-26 11:52:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Maraner
@ soundwave.

Are you happy the way this is going?

Do you feel the player base has a positive opinion of the UI?

Are you happy that the server peak these days appears to be around 25k - what happened to the 60K + we used to get.


Everyone one with the exception of one German guy that I fly with HATE the UI, please for the love of god roll it back. This **** is getting out of hand, and all we are hearing is that we will improve it, one of your dev's admitted that POS tower management is 'horrible' with the new system. My god, what is the issue with taking it back to SIsi and fix it there or coding it to let people have their ship hangers back.

This is genuinely turning into a first order disaster for CCP again, I am honestly amazed. Its the most basic functionality of the game - the place where I keep my stuff has been degraded by your feature. And despite all of CCP's words your not backing down an inch.

It's INCARNA all over again man, how long til someone shops a picture of you burning in a box. Get to it, roll it back.
Gnast
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#1045 - 2012-05-26 11:55:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Gnast
Well, since I stopped doing production/trade/industry in general, I find that the UI is rather nice.

So, for me, on a SMALL causual scale, the UI is quite nice and userfriendly.

Meaning; for % of the community this UI is nice, and for us large scale indy duders its a living nightmare.

The solution with the fewest questionmarks and least effort; Stop doing industry P

Ofcourse, having to change your playstyle completely isnt really a good scale of userfriendliness of a feature.
Spanking Monkeys
ZC Omega
Goonswarm Federation
#1046 - 2012-05-26 11:58:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Spanking Monkeys
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Captain Praxis wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:

...
This feature is not what we want it to be, for that you have our apologies and we'll do everything we can to fix it.
...


Thanks Soundwave, I think that's what we all want to hear.

It's a real shame we got into this situation, but we can't turn back the clock, so the main thing now is to get the UI to an acceptable level of functionality as soon as possible.

o7
Captain Praxis


Agree. As mentioned, my apologies once again and let's hope we can rectify this situation swiftly.



surely it woudl be faster at restoring functionality back, if you revert the inventory back to its old self. and put this feature back on sisi, where it can be worked on there, rather than anoying you paying costomers any more.

as it stands you have turned a game ive enjoyed playing into a clicky nightmare, tahts why im pissed at your reluctance to get it fixed as quickly as you can. i dont belive that you patching the the hell out of the new ui will get my enjoyment back as fast as a revert to the old.

why are you so set on not reverting this?
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#1047 - 2012-05-26 11:59:38 UTC
Maraner wrote:
@ soundwave.

Are you happy the way this is going?

Do you feel the player base has a positive opinion of the UI?

Are you happy that the server peak these days appears to be around 25k - what happened to the 60K + we used to get.



I am sorry for contributing on the low amount of concurrent players.
I used to 5 box EvE for a ton of hours a day but since the new patch I just cannot self violence myself to play.

Imagine this, I have multiple POSes, multiple corps all with lots of used divisions. For my 3rd party service I have lots of cans with my clients collaterals stored at Jita. I just CANNOT give back the wrong collateral, it's almost 100B worth of stuff that it's not mine.

In the spare time I did missions. They also turned into a nightmare.

So for now I let 1 account go, the others sadly are still subbed for months. But even then, I can't stand the tedium, it's asinine and evil.
Ribikoka
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1048 - 2012-05-26 12:00:43 UTC
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Captain Praxis wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:

...
This feature is not what we want it to be, for that you have our apologies and we'll do everything we can to fix it.
...


Thanks Soundwave, I think that's what we all want to hear.

It's a real shame we got into this situation, but we can't turn back the clock, so the main thing now is to get the UI to an acceptable level of functionality as soon as possible.

o7
Captain Praxis


Agree. As mentioned, my apologies once again and let's hope we can rectify this situation swiftly.


Just a question. If CCP would produce sportcars and their customers wanna drive with sportcars and they hate agricultural machines, what would happen then, if CCP create a tractor for sportcar users ?
They are really want to buy a tractors instead sportcars ?


disasteur
Tellcomtec Industries.
#1049 - 2012-05-26 12:02:08 UTC
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Captain Praxis wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:

...
This feature is not what we want it to be, for that you have our apologies and we'll do everything we can to fix it.
...


Thanks Soundwave, I think that's what we all want to hear.

It's a real shame we got into this situation, but we can't turn back the clock, so the main thing now is to get the UI to an acceptable level of functionality as soon as possible.

o7
Captain Praxis


Agree. As mentioned, my apologies once again and let's hope we can rectify this situation swiftly.



im sorry for asking, but what are your intentions, and how do you think this to rectify?
i understand this is a bizar situation but a little more specific answer would be verry nice
CCP Soundwave
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1050 - 2012-05-26 12:03:46 UTC
disasteur wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Captain Praxis wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:

...
This feature is not what we want it to be, for that you have our apologies and we'll do everything we can to fix it.
...


Thanks Soundwave, I think that's what we all want to hear.

It's a real shame we got into this situation, but we can't turn back the clock, so the main thing now is to get the UI to an acceptable level of functionality as soon as possible.

o7
Captain Praxis


Agree. As mentioned, my apologies once again and let's hope we can rectify this situation swiftly.



im sorry for asking, but what are your intentions, and how do you think this to rectify?
i understand this is a bizar situation but a little more specific answer would be verry nice


Restoring as much of the old functionality in the new framework.
disasteur
Tellcomtec Industries.
#1051 - 2012-05-26 12:05:55 UTC
thank you for the quick response, all we can do now is wait and see if it will live up to our expectations
Spanking Monkeys
ZC Omega
Goonswarm Federation
#1052 - 2012-05-26 12:09:18 UTC
CCP Soundwave wrote:
disasteur wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Captain Praxis wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:

...
This feature is not what we want it to be, for that you have our apologies and we'll do everything we can to fix it.
...


Thanks Soundwave, I think that's what we all want to hear.

It's a real shame we got into this situation, but we can't turn back the clock, so the main thing now is to get the UI to an acceptable level of functionality as soon as possible.

o7
Captain Praxis


Agree. As mentioned, my apologies once again and let's hope we can rectify this situation swiftly.



im sorry for asking, but what are your intentions, and how do you think this to rectify?
i understand this is a bizar situation but a little more specific answer would be verry nice


Restoring as much of the old functionality in the new framework.



not all of the functionality? why do we have to have a reduction in functionality?
Maraner
The Executioners
#1053 - 2012-05-26 12:10:00 UTC
You can restore 100% of the functionality of the previous system, you know how. Now make the step and suggest a roll back, the community would applaud it.

It would be a demonstration that CCP has learnt from the past and is able to adapt when things are not rolling your way. By your own Dev's admissions the UI in certain circumstances is terrible, it's laggy and the player base granted with many exceptions dont like it.

Please soundwave, please act and roll it back, or make it optional, this is going to escalate and turn savage. And the outcome will either be the restoration of the old system or you will lose a **** ton more players and we will be looking at sub 20K routinely on the server.

Salpun
Global Telstar Federation Offices
#1054 - 2012-05-26 12:10:43 UTC
How hard would it be to add saved UI setups? The new right click drop down on the neocom is better, just needs a way to close the window, for quick look checks but if you can't hold inventory windows over the difrent states. Let us make a UI setup, lock each window into a specific fuctionality and then save the setup with a neocom link

If i dont know something about EVE. I check https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/ISK_The_Guide

See you around the universe.

Gnast
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#1055 - 2012-05-26 12:10:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Gnast
For me it hasnt been as much issue with the functionality as its the unbearable performance.
Meaning the loading/processing time for each action which is presived as lag at the user end.
I guess its the combination of the design and loadingtime that makes the preception of the UI to such a unpleasant expirience.
And often the expected lag makes you sit and wait for the move of modules, while in reality it just didnt accept the transfer command you issued, adding to the frustration.

Its rather low now that Ive sold off most my stuff and are only dealing with very small quanitities of items, but
unplayable whenever it comes to normal industry level quantities.
Salpun
Global Telstar Federation Offices
#1056 - 2012-05-26 12:13:41 UTC
Gnast wrote:
For me it hasnt been as much issue with the functionality as its the unbearable performance.
Meaning the loading/processing time for each action which is presived as lag at the user end.
I guess its the combination of the design and loadingtime that makes the preception of the UI to such a unpleasant expirience.

Its rather low now that Ive sold off most my stuff and are only dealing with very small quanitities of items, but
unplayable whenever it comes to normal industry level quantities.

If you still have all the stuff you sold of on the Sisi server jump on and see if the bug you are conserved about got fixed. I would like to know the results.

If i dont know something about EVE. I check https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/ISK_The_Guide

See you around the universe.

Maraner
The Executioners
#1057 - 2012-05-26 12:14:42 UTC
CCP Soundwave ..... Restoring as much of the old functionality in the new framework.


Oh and whilst we're at it, does this seem logical or even sane.... your working to restore the functionality of the old system! take a breath man and call a meeting.
Gnast
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#1058 - 2012-05-26 12:15:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Gnast
I did a big logistics run yesterday evening on TQ, and the lag was still there in heaps which put the nail in the coffin for me with regards to industry.

The transfer "bug" is still there, but thats just the "normal" issue when you try to drag and drop onto a window that already got items infront of your mousepointer (which has always been there). The annoyance with that issue is just amplified greatly by the general poor loading performance of the UI.
CCP Soundwave
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1059 - 2012-05-26 12:17:10 UTC
Gnast wrote:
I did a big logistics run yesterday evening on TQ, and the lag was still there in heaps which put the nail in the coffin for me with regards to industry.


We have a few performance fixes coming out on Tuesday as well. That should help, especially with towers.
Ribikoka
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1060 - 2012-05-26 12:18:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Ribikoka
CCP Soundwave wrote:
disasteur wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Captain Praxis wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:

...
This feature is not what we want it to be, for that you have our apologies and we'll do everything we can to fix it.
...


Thanks Soundwave, I think that's what we all want to hear.

It's a real shame we got into this situation, but we can't turn back the clock, so the main thing now is to get the UI to an acceptable level of functionality as soon as possible.

o7
Captain Praxis


Agree. As mentioned, my apologies once again and let's hope we can rectify this situation swiftly.



im sorry for asking, but what are your intentions, and how do you think this to rectify?
i understand this is a bizar situation but a little more specific answer would be verry nice


Restoring as much of the old functionality in the new framework.


If CCP want to fix this, give back the old windows back to us.
Give back our shiphangar icon, and forget to merging the ships/dronebay with the inventory.
Give back to us, the loot all button.
Fix lags, because the eve clients everytime want access the full unusable items too below the all unopened treefolders from serverdata. Not need loading all items just the opened panel needed and the folderstructure. Load items when the subfolder is opened.

Why see a posmanager all guns inside inventory when can uploading them and need to move to 2500m ?
Why have ships dronebays on treepanel when some ships not have dronebays ?

Separate from new inventory from crophangars because just bring a big mess to all.
But the most important thing just forget the cr*p unusable treepanel instantly, that is the biggest mistake what they did with inventory panel.
Oh and i forget another important thing, kick it well into bottom with double feets those developers who did this crap inventory.