Ships & Modules

The Actual Problem



...seems to be two fold.

1, miners do not understand the principle of "tank" because mining is a profession that does not connect to PVP skill in any way shape or form. Alternatively, someone should have figured out how to tank the hulks by now, and it should be common knowledge. People figured out optimal incursion fits fast enough now didn't they?


2. mining in general pays at such a **** poor rate, that miners see a fit without mining enhancers in their lows to be a waste of time. Truth is, mining is a waste of time and not maximizing ore yield per hour is an even bigger waste of time. So in order to curb the broken mining mechanic, they end up flying expensive and tankless paper bags.





The Real Solution


Is that a tanked Hulk should be able to make a reasonable profit comparable to other professions in the same sec status of space. But in order to do that, bots would have to be addressed. It is not about Hulks, or gankers... it's actually about the damn bots killing mining and the economy.

Gotta agree with T

But you should be required to keep those biomassed gank alts for a set time imo. Yeah its a exploit to biomass them but the ccp ppl are forever saying they dont have the ppl to watch every biomass so theres a big loophole

I think they do this now. It's 10 hours, right?

I'm not saying there's no room for change, just confirming that the mechanic is currently in-place if they ever did.

You guys are totally right, Why should the best and only top of the line mining ship for minerals be super tanky?

Lets review a few points.
1. It costs upwards of 200 million isk.
2. People have chosen to exploit its inability to tank. allowing it to be ganked from an over heated frigate class ship.
3. The cost to tank ratio makes it not even worth fitting to survive a gank from a cruiser / battle cruiser sized ship.
4. You are more likely to lose it during hulkageddon than to ever pay it off.
5. I'm running out of reasons to even consider flying it...

Which is probably why afk bots are the only things sane enough to do it in mass all the time. lulz

On a more serious note, you don't train to fly a faction battleship, command ship, or say a titan. Only to have everyone tell you it shouldn't be able to fill its own role and survive a gank from a frigate sized vessel... I don't know the last time i heard someone tell me about how they lost their Carrier or battleship because an overheated destroyer ganked them before concord could come. Admit it, you guys like to exploit its weaknesses and do so only for the sheer joy of griefing another player. Which I'm not going to say is wrong or bad. Hell I have done my fair share of trolling. But would it be so bad as to provide it with some buff?

A few suggested buffs.
1. A fourth non-hardpoint high slot. Cloaky hulks?! Oh my!
2. Increase in powergrid. You might actually have to try, and that is only if that hulk pilot chooses to be tank fit.
3. give it a higher armor and shield base value. Even it they buffed it up to 5000 of each, it would be a major improvement.

For those crying that this would make it to difficult to gank. Consider why you became a pirate. Did you do it because it was easy? Or did you do it because it provided a challenge with the rewards of making people upset. Also why should there be no risk versus reward for the ganker? Losing sec status isn't a risk, it is a constant. Anyone with half a brain can overheat a brutix and blaster down a hulk before concord shows.

But this is my rant. I'm certain I will get flamed for having an opinion on the subject. I don't really care, most the views of gankers is biased. Not to mention CCP would rather keep hulks gankable than fix mining.

When I compare prices, I compare prices from manufacturer or importer for both products so that I dont have a problem with not knowing how much middlemans were there and how big their margin were.
And you like to use price for one thing form one quy that bought that thing from manufacturer and second from 10th middleman.
Good for you.
I see now how you allways "win" a debate.

Over and out.

Where should said risk come from?

Answer that question correctly and you win Eve.

Answer it wrong and you forever label yourself a victim.

Why doesn't anybody do anything about it then?

The problem is mentality, not rules.

Oh, you're going to equivocate with "popularity", got it.



Ignoring arguments you don't like by trying to recast them into another black and white paradigm. Your game is old, learn some new tricks.

Sadly, the gankbears are just as protected by Concord as the miners. Here's to high hopes for crimewatch 2.0.

What's equivocal about CCP's numbers on which ships are used the most (among them the Hulk) and which are used the least (among them the Covetor, to the point where they're adjusting its price/performance ratio)?

What argument was being ignored? The fact is that bigger-isn't-better and marginal-improvement-for-huge-cost are fundamental design principles of EVE, and that a ship that adheres to these principles is thus well designed. It's not my opinion — it's how they've chosen to approach balance.