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So I was unable to kill some pirate frigates earlier...

Author
Count of MonteCylon
Anti-Pirate Enforcement
#1 - 2012-04-17 10:13:31 UTC
After like four hours of research and attempts (I'm persistent) I had to give up on killing some Centii Loyal Slavehunter frigates.

I tried some lasers (I'm Amarr) but was doing nothing.

I was able to deal some damage with drones, missiles and rockets (I tried both) but couldn't actually kill a single one despite trying a bunch of things.

At one point I was in my Caracal (I learned how to use Caldari ships), and I had a target painter, a webifier, two drones, two rockets and two light missiles on a single one of the frigates, which was only moving at 89 m/s. I also had an energy neutralizer on it, so I'm pretty sure that it had no capacitator energy to work with. But, my attacks even under those conditions seemed to be doing no damage.

Anyone know what I might be overlooking? I am primarily an industrial player but have I think all of the weapon skills learned to level 2.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. -- Ephesians 6:12

Ravnik
Infinate Horizon
#2 - 2012-04-17 10:18:54 UTC
More training! there are a LOT of skills to train up in missiles, each one will help. Energy neuts wont help with npc, im sure those guys have infinate cap!

The light that burns twice as bright burns half as long - and you have burned so very, very brightly..........

Eryn Velasquez
#3 - 2012-04-17 10:26:17 UTC
Belongs more to missions and complexes, but - it sometimes depends on the order, in which you kill the ships in some missions.
If i remember correctly, there are some missions, were NPCs do remote repair - please correct me if i'm wrong ^^

_“A man's freedom consists in his being able to do whatever he wills, but that he should not, by any human power, be forced to do what is against his will.” ― Jean-Jacques Rousseau _

Abbadon21
Ignotis Imperium
Usurper.
#4 - 2012-04-17 22:19:29 UTC
Can't say I'm familiar with that specific Rat but it sounds to me like you need to web them and make sure you are tracking them.

Learn How PRO Players Make Billions of ISK and Dominate PVP: http://www.EVEProGuides.com

Count of MonteCylon
Anti-Pirate Enforcement
#5 - 2012-04-17 22:36:19 UTC
Abbadon21 wrote:
Can't say I'm familiar with that specific Rat but it sounds to me like you need to web them and make sure you are tracking them.

I did have it webbed, but what is tracking? I read that tracking computers don't effect missiles?

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. -- Ephesians 6:12

Astroniomix
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#6 - 2012-04-17 22:48:13 UTC
Count of MonteCylon wrote:
Abbadon21 wrote:
Can't say I'm familiar with that specific Rat but it sounds to me like you need to web them and make sure you are tracking them.

I did have it webbed, but what is tracking? I read that tracking computers don't effect missiles?

Its sounding like you need more support skills. Missiles are notorious for not applying their full damage even under ideal cirumstances. Also elite rats have very small singature radiuses which make them take even less damage from missles. Also a fair number of them self repair. (non sleeper rats to not remote repair each other)
Abbadon21
Ignotis Imperium
Usurper.
#7 - 2012-04-18 00:44:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Abbadon21
Count of MonteCylon wrote:
I did have it webbed, but what is tracking? I read that tracking computers don't effect missiles?


It could be skills like Astrononiomix said. There are skills that effect how much damage missiles do to small and fast targets.

(and yes, tracking computer have zero effect on missiles)

Learn How PRO Players Make Billions of ISK and Dominate PVP: http://www.EVEProGuides.com

Dradius Calvantia
Lip Shords
#8 - 2012-04-18 00:50:33 UTC
I know you are just a new player, but this is the incorrect sub forum for this topic. In the future, please stick to one of the dirty carebear sections =P
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#9 - 2012-04-18 00:51:09 UTC
Along with what others have said, be aware that Nuets have 0 effect on rats.
Hrett
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2012-04-18 05:37:56 UTC
Count of MonteCylon wrote:
After like four hours of research and attempts (I'm persistent) I had to give up on killing some Centii Loyal Slavehunter frigates.

I tried some lasers (I'm Amarr) but was doing nothing.

I was able to deal some damage with drones, missiles and rockets (I tried both) but couldn't actually kill a single one despite trying a bunch of things.

At one point I was in my Caracal (I learned how to use Caldari ships), and I had a target painter, a webifier, two drones, two rockets and two light missiles on a single one of the frigates, which was only moving at 89 m/s. I also had an energy neutralizer on it, so I'm pretty sure that it had no capacitator energy to work with. But, my attacks even under those conditions seemed to be doing no damage.

Anyone know what I might be overlooking? I am primarily an industrial player but have I think all of the weapon skills learned to level 2.


I have no recollection of that specific rat, but if this isnt a troll, here is a good place to start:

http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Fitting_Guidelines

Some of the links at the bottom go to mission fittings. I think that may be where you want to start.

Basically, it sounds like you need support skills. Dont mix guns/missile bays. Use either rockets or light misssiles, but not both.

Some other general tips:

Just because you can fly a ship - doesnt mean you should. This game does not reward, and in fact, penalizes, people who rush to the "bigger is better" ships before they have the proper support skills.

Dont fly a ship unless you can afford to lose 5 of them. Again - just because you can buy something and sit in it, doesnt mean you should. A guy attacked me a few days ago in low-sec and I killed him. He was in a navy faction cruiser - cost him about 60M isk. He was less than a month old. Dont do that. I sent him the same fitting link.

Also - generally - no matter what the skill is, its at least worth it to train it to level 3 at a minimum. The vast majority of starting skills can be trained to level 3 in less than a day. Basic Capacitor, fitting and tank skills should be trained to a 4 when you start out.

And I recommend checking out one of the teaching corps, if you are so inclined. If you dont like it, you can always leave. Eve has a steep learning curve, and Eve University and others like it help you get over the hump.

This describes it just about perfectly. :)

spaceship, Spaceship, SPACESHIP!

Adunh Slavy
#11 - 2012-04-18 06:09:30 UTC
Acolyte drones, Infiltrators if you've got some decent drone skills.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt

Count of MonteCylon
Anti-Pirate Enforcement
#12 - 2012-04-18 06:59:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Count of MonteCylon
Dradius Calvantia wrote:
I know you are just a new player, but this is the incorrect sub forum for this topic. In the future, please stick to one of the dirty carebear sections =P

Will do cap'n. I have to say, I love the expression your avatar has on. Up until now I thought mine had the most character that I've seen, but yours is definitely better.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. -- Ephesians 6:12

Demonicly Posessed
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#13 - 2012-04-18 08:53:51 UTC
Arcan Winter
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2012-04-18 09:04:12 UTC
Im not sure which mission you tried to do (but I assum it was a mission). If yu dont have seen it, the following link will give you some advive on missions http://eve-survival.org/wikka.php?wakka=MissionReports.

For Centii Loyal Slavehunter Lazers should be a good chooise since they are week to EM and Therm, which are what lazer boats do. However, for lazesr as for all other guns taking and distance to target are importent.
Tracking - make you able to hit target the orbit better (having a spped not directly against ot away from you)
Optimal/fall off - give you information for what range you can apply ok damage (I will not go into any ditails here)

So, for a laser ship you might need mods that increase your tracking. But also choose the right crystal to get one that have optimal/fall off that match the distance to the target. using the wrong crystam can reduce your dps alot.

For missiles, which you tried. first, missile do only one kind of damage, so if you pick teh wriong one the target will have to good resist.

Independen of if you will continue to use missiel or lasers, you should get the support skills up a few levels it will make a big difference, the same for drones.

If you are really young the differencers between unable to break a tank on a rat and killing it very fast can be one or 2 levels of a skill that take a few h each or less.
Count of MonteCylon
Anti-Pirate Enforcement
#15 - 2012-04-18 09:10:08 UTC
Arcan Winter wrote:
Im not sure which mission you tried to do (but I assum it was a mission). If yu dont have seen it, the following link will give you some advive on missions http://eve-survival.org/wikka.php?wakka=MissionReports.

For Centii Loyal Slavehunter Lazers should be a good chooise since they are week to EM and Therm, which are what lazer boats do. However, for lazesr as for all other guns taking and distance to target are importent.
Tracking - make you able to hit target the orbit better (having a spped not directly against ot away from you)
Optimal/fall off - give you information for what range you can apply ok damage (I will not go into any ditails here)

So, for a laser ship you might need mods that increase your tracking. But also choose the right crystal to get one that have optimal/fall off that match the distance to the target. using the wrong crystam can reduce your dps alot.

For missiles, which you tried. first, missile do only one kind of damage, so if you pick teh wriong one the target will have to good resist.

Independen of if you will continue to use missiel or lasers, you should get the support skills up a few levels it will make a big difference, the same for drones.

If you are really young the differencers between unable to break a tank on a rat and killing it very fast can be one or 2 levels of a skill that take a few h each or less.

Thanks, this does raise a question for me. How strong are weaknesses to different damage types, if you don't mind my asking? Since a caracal has a bonus to kinetic missiles, I was mostly using those.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. -- Ephesians 6:12

Demonicly Posessed
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2012-04-18 09:25:04 UTC
Caldari cruiser lev 3 should make u do more damage withk kinetic missiles then with em missiles against this shansha frig
Joran Dravius
Doomheim
#17 - 2012-04-18 16:21:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Joran Dravius
Count of MonteCylon wrote:
I also had an energy neutralizer on it, so I'm pretty sure that it had no capacitator energy to work with. But, my attacks even under those conditions seemed to be doing no damage.

NPC's have infinite cap....

Edit: And mixing ranges makes baby Jesus cry.

Abbadon21 wrote:
it sounds to me like you need to web them and make sure you are tracking them.

Missiles don't have tracking.
Yatama Kautsuo
Tencus
#18 - 2012-04-18 16:29:19 UTC
Corina Jarr wrote:
Along with what others have said, be aware that Nuets have 0 effect on rats.


not quite true i believe. i read that when you neut/vamp them the chance of active shield/armor boosting of the rat is decreased. but yeah, it's a very small impact.
Katja Faith
Doomheim
#19 - 2012-04-19 01:18:11 UTC
Drones. Nuff said.
Sentry 10
Escape Velocity
#20 - 2012-04-19 20:14:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Sentry 10
[quote=Count of MonteCylon
At one point I was in my Caracal (I learned how to use Caldari ships), and I had a target painter, a webifier, two drones, two rockets and two light missiles on a single one of the frigates, which was only moving at 89 m/s. I also had an energy neutralizer on it, so I'm pretty sure that it had no capacitator energy to work with. But, my attacks even under those conditions seemed to be doing no damage.

[/quote]

post your caracal fitting here. i know everyone suggests training your skills, but i think the problem lies with your fitting.
are you mixing weapon types on your ship? from your post it seems like you were using both rockets and light missiles.

stick to all missiles, thats what the caracal is designed for

edit: also make sure you were firing your missiles in range (flight time X missile velocity)
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