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Caldari Plot to Undermine Minmatar Militia! Slave Trading Accusations!
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Ston Momaki
Disciples of Ston
#21 - 2012-04-14 18:05:25 UTC
Kikia Truzhari wrote:
I am in fact aware of this, hence why I don't do it too often. I'd much rather just rescue the slaves outright. But when they're right in front of me like that, and I know I could buy and free them so easily, or let them get sold to who knows what sort of vile person, its hard to just ignore them. It was a spur of the moment thing that generally I reserve for child slaves I find, and though at the end of the day, it doesn't really effectively do anything about the slave trade, its something I can't just sit by and watch happen while I can do something about it.


Sometimes, the heart must rule the moment. Sometimes, all practical objections must be set aside. Sometimes, that one human being must be valued as if they represented all of humanity. This was a good act of the heart. The person freed will sing of the blessings of that "spur of the moment" act for all time. Bless you for letting your heart rule that moment.

The Disciples of Ston bid you peace
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#22 - 2012-04-14 18:17:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Caellach Marellus
Ston Momaki wrote:
Kikia Truzhari wrote:
I am in fact aware of this, hence why I don't do it too often. I'd much rather just rescue the slaves outright. But when they're right in front of me like that, and I know I could buy and free them so easily, or let them get sold to who knows what sort of vile person, its hard to just ignore them. It was a spur of the moment thing that generally I reserve for child slaves I find, and though at the end of the day, it doesn't really effectively do anything about the slave trade, its something I can't just sit by and watch happen while I can do something about it.


Sometimes, the heart must rule the moment. Sometimes, all practical objections must be set aside. Sometimes, that one human being must be valued as if they represented all of humanity. This was a good act of the heart. The person freed will sing of the blessings of that "spur of the moment" act for all time. Bless you for letting your heart rule that moment.



Short term solutions are never going to resolve things in the long run, inability to keep one's emotions in check and losing sight of perspective did more harm than good to the anti slavery cause.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.
T-B0NE
Doomheim
#23 - 2012-04-14 20:05:43 UTC
Thing is when you buy a slave their freedom their's still the issue of the slaver, in the end why save a single slave when you can make sure thousands more are never enslaved in the first place? Not to mention autocannon rounds are usually cheaper than slaves anyways so their's also the economic aspect of it.

“Death and destruction are necessary to the health of the world, and therefore as natural, and lovable, as birth and life. Only priests and born cowards moan and weep over dying. Brave men face it with approving nonchalance." - Ragnar Redbeard
Luna Mori
AmmuNacionale
#24 - 2012-04-14 23:03:01 UTC
Remove the market for slaves and there will be no slave trade
Ban the trading of slaves*, and there will be no market**
As Ms Farel points out, it's down to CONCORD

Cease the slave trade


*Not all empires would sign up to such a ban, of course.
**There would always be illegal activity which is often intercepted by capsuleers undertaking work for station agents

General Secretary, Ani Tribal Assembly
Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#25 - 2012-04-14 23:12:38 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:

The more you increase demand, the more prices will skyrocket, and the more people will get interested in slave business. And there is virtually no limit to their potential number, except maybe the limit of people that can be enslaved. I am pretty sure, however, that anyone trying to end slavery is not going to see how far that limit is.


And, on top of that, skyrocketing prices will make people interested in more and more illegal slave trades as well.
Certainly a way to lessen the suffering.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#26 - 2012-04-14 23:13:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyn Farel
Luna Mori wrote:
Remove the market for slaves and there will be no slave trade
Ban the trading of slaves*, and there will be no market**
As Ms Farel points out, it's down to CONCORD

Cease the slave trade


*Not all empires would sign up to such a ban, of course.
**There would always be illegal activity which is often intercepted by capsuleers undertaking work for station agents



Does CONCORD rules the market, though ? The SCC (Secure Commerce Commission) and the CAD (Commerce Assessment Department) respectively oversee the security of all certified trading exchanges and the assessment of said transactions and thus provide to capsuleers an universal trading tool : the market. But I am not sure what is actually sold in every station in empire space falls under their jurisdiction, but rather under the ruling local faction. Eventually, I think it is the empires themselves that fail to enforce their own rules on their own territory.

Do not put the blame on CONCORD with too much haste.
Ston Momaki
Disciples of Ston
#27 - 2012-04-15 01:11:53 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:
Luna Mori wrote:
Remove the market for slaves and there will be no slave trade
Ban the trading of slaves*, and there will be no market**
As Ms Farel points out, it's down to CONCORD

Cease the slave trade


*Not all empires would sign up to such a ban, of course.
**There would always be illegal activity which is often intercepted by capsuleers undertaking work for station agents



Does CONCORD rules the market, though ? The SCC (Secure Commerce Commission) and the CAD (Commerce Assessment Department) respectively oversee the security of all certified trading exchanges and the assessment of said transactions and thus provide to capsuleers an universal trading tool : the market. But I am not sure what is actually sold in every station in empire space falls under their jurisdiction, but rather under the ruling local faction. Eventually, I think it is the empires themselves that fail to enforce their own rules on their own territory.

Do not put the blame on CONCORD with too much haste.


Indeed, who does have control of the slave market? For example, right now in the Region of Essence there are for sale the following:
13 slaves in the SOE Bureau in Arnon
50 slave in the Quafe station in Allamotte
283 slaves in the Federation Navy Assembly plant in Luminaire
10 slaves in the Republic Security Services Logistic Support plant in Adrel

Sisters of Eve, The Gallente Federation, and The Republic, all in Gallente space, all with slaves bought and sold by capsuleers. Who has control of the slave market? The Empires indeed have failed to enforce their own rules in their own territory. This is just one small example of what can be found in most every region, in or outside of slave holding space.

The Disciples of Ston bid you peace
Kelevra Menardi
Yesterday is History Today is a Gift
#28 - 2012-04-15 01:42:49 UTC
Luna Mori wrote:

As Ms Farel points out, it's down to CONCORD


Luna you know that on most issues I will follow in your wake, you are a personal inspiration to me, However CONCORD has no right to be involved in the legalization or illegalization of slaves, the slave trade unless these slaves are being transported, or gathered, by immortals. CONCORDS one and only reason to exist is to hold the capsuleer population in check.
Graelyn
Aeternus Command Academy
#29 - 2012-04-15 03:02:55 UTC
Caellach Marellus wrote:
If they weren't making a profit they wouldn't do it at all.


*cough*

Okay....

Cardinal Graelyn

Amarr Loyalist of the Year - YC113
Gosakumori Noh
Coven of One
#30 - 2012-04-15 03:39:34 UTC
Ston Momaki wrote:


Indeed, who does have control of the slave market? For example, right now in the Region of Essence there are for sale the following:
13 slaves in the SOE Bureau in Arnon
50 slave in the Quafe station in Allamotte
283 slaves in the Federation Navy Assembly plant in Luminaire
10 slaves in the Republic Security Services Logistic Support plant in Adrel


"Laborers" out of Gallente space tend to be Inky melancholics who have spilled all the beans they've got to spill. Good at growing stuff, fishing, and other earthy things, they are quite handy, but always have big brown puppy eyes whenever the slightest little thing goes wrong: "my life, it is a symphony of despair and unrequited longing!" My goodness!
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#31 - 2012-04-15 05:43:30 UTC
Graelyn wrote:
Caellach Marellus wrote:
If they weren't making a profit they wouldn't do it at all.


*cough*

Okay....


Referring to slave traders on the markets Cardinal, the ones who make their living from Human trafficking?

Yeah if they weren't making a profit they'd quit.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.
Luna Mori
AmmuNacionale
#32 - 2012-04-15 10:37:07 UTC
Ms Farel and Mr Menardi are both right of course. It is the responsibility of the authorities in those empires where slavery is forbidden to reinforce their own statutes. Yet the Minmatar Republic, at least, chooses not to enforce it's own legislation.
Which 'authority' will represent those in illegal slavery? Who will reinforce the existing laws in those empires? If not those who are supposed to, then who? Please, please tell me.

To add to Mr Momaki's list in this thread:
1200 slaves for sale in Metro in Hjoramold. Whether placed there by capsuleers or by Amarrian corporation Joint Harvesting, I cannot tell. I have often thought of buying them, but I know that will just fuel demand. They will be replaced. Brought in through Minmatar space by slavers with the blessing of the 'authorities'.


General Secretary, Ani Tribal Assembly
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#33 - 2012-04-15 11:36:56 UTC
Then your main issue might lie with the non-interference laws (or non-existing laws) regarding the powers that have local authorities to inquire inside capsuleer hangars in space stations, considering that local navy customs do their job in space.
Ava Starfire
Khushakor Clan
#34 - 2012-04-15 11:56:08 UTC
Kikia did what she thought was right. No issue with that.

As far as "buying slaves keeping the market fresh", well, you're absolutely right. Ill go a different route.

I will happily pay 30000 isk per slaver. And no, not the damn dogs.

"There is no strength in numbers; have no such misconception." -Jayka Vofur, "Warfare in the North"
Ragnar STS
Arcane Odyssey
Electus Matari
#35 - 2012-04-15 18:06:24 UTC
Was there any intelligence that might lead to the source of the slaves he was trading?

The Ushra'Khan have been working around Geminate, quite close to Caldari space, and witnessing Bricksquad [BR1CK] pilots shuttling children around. Some are even rumored to be their own children, being given into slavery so that the parent(s) can continue leading a nomadic and honorless life gatecamping. Seems they can't bear the responsibility of child rearing and would rather sell them into slavery or shuttle other people's children into Caldari space to be sold as Amarr slaves.

The Ushra'Khan will continue looking into this. Perhaps we can stop this individual's slave trading by drying up the supply and bringing freedom to all of Eve.
Hooch Flux
Flux Unlimited
#36 - 2012-04-21 11:02:35 UTC
Gallente media tool spouts Fedo droppings, film at 11!
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#37 - 2012-04-21 16:03:33 UTC
I happened to speak with the Sebiestor in question the other night in the Summit, and although she may 'technically' be free, I was delighted to find she had retained all of her reverence and respect for proper authority. Delightful.

Interestingly enough she seems to have transferred her... feelings of servitude towards her new master, the Matari whom purchased her.

It was quite amusing, a bit like a lost puppy who still needed someone to take care of it.



Sabik now, Sabik forever
Istvaan Shogaatsu
Guiding Hand Social Club
#38 - 2012-04-21 16:15:17 UTC
Thirty grand for a single slave?
Synthetic Cultist
Church of The Crimson Saviour
#39 - 2012-04-25 19:12:21 UTC
Istvaan Shogaatsu wrote:
Thirty grand for a single slave?


The Slave Selling Itself Appears to also be a Capsuleer. Although concept of Slave Capsuleer is Baffling.

Synthia 1, Empress of Kaztropol.

It is Written.
Scherezad
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#40 - 2012-04-26 14:41:23 UTC
I'd like to request the collected Capsuleers of the IGS to respect Taryn's privacy in this regard. She has been through a lot and could use a little peace.
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