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Warfare & Tactics

 
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Destroyer vs 325mil is balanced.
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Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#81 - 2012-04-10 00:14:39 UTC
Dbars Grinding wrote:
This is clearly fair.


fair?

FAIR?!

THIS IS EVE *boot into the hole of death*

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.
Sir Marksalot
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#82 - 2012-04-10 00:17:20 UTC
Dbars Grinding wrote:
This is clearly fair.

But.... but my hulk costs alot so it should have lots and lots of guns!!!!!
Dbars Grinding
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#83 - 2012-04-10 00:25:03 UTC
you guys r too easy. :(

I have more space likes than you. 
Annie Anomie
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#84 - 2012-04-10 00:36:01 UTC
Ship happens.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#85 - 2012-04-10 00:39:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Ranger 1 wrote:
I agree that hiring mercs isn't likely to save you from a suicide gank.

Trying to mine while at war is another topic entirely.

First, if you are under a war dec worrisome enough to hire merc's you shouldn't be mining to begin with. You should be prepared to assist your merc's in ending the war dec.

Second, if your mercs assure you that their scouts can alert you before any war targets enter system, and IF they don't mind you playing target, that's fine. Get assurances. Then fit your Hulks to ensure you can get your butt out of the belt when the scout alerts you. Even then you need to be aware that the people at war with you are perfectly capable of suicide ganking you with neutral alts.

Again, merc use vs suicide gank and merc use vs war dec are two completely different things. Either way, you should be prepared to participate on your own behalf as best you can unless your mercs request otherwise.


Well in a wardec the attackers would not even need to suicide gank. They'd just need to do their job (call it suicide) before the mercs bring them down, if they do.

See, I reason by objectives.

Wardec from competitor corp means they want to disrupt my income / production / cycle / whatever.
If I don't spend a nickel, they will succeed at that. Till now it's all linear.

Now enter the new wardec mechanic. It should kinda be a "version 2" of the current system, i.e. have less open holes and more effectiveness at what covers.

What happens is that with the new wardec mechanic, I would be unable to dec shield (which is OK) but even using the new mechanic and paying a merc corp for me, the attackers STILL disrupt the income, production, cycle and whatever.

I mean, what's the point of a new mechanic if it does not introduce a new dimension of gameplay?

I want to be able to pay well and be defended in my interests. I mean, the PvP will happen so both attackers and defending mercs are happy (which is all nice and dandy) but I just paid for others to have fun (less nice but still OK) while I don't reap a single benefit (the part that I am not OK with).

Imagine what would happen in RL if you pay mercs to defend your camps / your cargo ships (vs sea pirates), the mercs shoot and "win" yet you lose both your camps and your ships. How longer would anybody care to still hire mercs if they lose all anyway?

Translated into EvE terms, how longer till industry corps (the huge majority of war targets) realize it's pointless to get defenders and thus make the whole new mechanic sit unused, while the industry corpies still stay docked for the wardec duration like now?

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Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#86 - 2012-04-10 00:45:08 UTC
ya, in RL
cause there are mystical energies that kill anyone that shoots first here too

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.
Shaampoo
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#87 - 2012-04-10 00:45:57 UTC
Dbars Grinding wrote:
This is clearly fair.



I am using a my Oracle now to bring balance back

Every thing is fine it seems

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=12988740
Bane Necran
Appono Astos
#88 - 2012-04-10 00:57:50 UTC
The only thing considered unfair in EVE is when you can't be killed for some reason.

"In the void is virtue, and no evil. Wisdom has existence, principle has existence, the Way has existence, spirit is nothingness." ~Miyamoto Musashi
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#89 - 2012-04-10 00:59:02 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Ranger 1 wrote:
I agree that hiring mercs isn't likely to save you from a suicide gank.

Trying to mine while at war is another topic entirely.

First, if you are under a war dec worrisome enough to hire merc's you shouldn't be mining to begin with. You should be prepared to assist your merc's in ending the war dec.

Second, if your mercs assure you that their scouts can alert you before any war targets enter system, and IF they don't mind you playing target, that's fine. Get assurances. Then fit your Hulks to ensure you can get your butt out of the belt when the scout alerts you. Even then you need to be aware that the people at war with you are perfectly capable of suicide ganking you with neutral alts.

Again, merc use vs suicide gank and merc use vs war dec are two completely different things. Either way, you should be prepared to participate on your own behalf as best you can unless your mercs request otherwise.


Well in a wardec the attackers would not even need to suicide gank. They'd just need to do their job (call it suicide) before the mercs bring them down, if they do.

See, I reason by objectives.

Wardec from competitor corp means they want to disrupt my income / production / cycle / whatever.
If I don't spend a nickel, they will succeed at that. Till now it's all linear.

Now enter the new wardec mechanic. It should kinda be a "version 2" of the current system, i.e. have less open holes and more effectiveness at what covers.

What happens is that with the new wardec mechanic, I would be unable to dec shield (which is OK) but even using the new mechanic and paying a merc corp for me, the attackers STILL disrupt the income, production, cycle and whatever.

I mean, what's the point of a new mechanic if it does not introduce a new dimension of gameplay?

I want to be able to pay well and be defended in my interests. I mean, the PvP will happen so both attackers and defending mercs are happy (which is all nice and dandy) but I just paid for others to have fun (less nice but still OK) while I don't reap a single benefit (the part that I am not OK with).

Imagine what would happen in RL if you pay mercs to defend your camps / your cargo ships (vs sea pirates), the mercs shoot and "win" yet you lose both your camps and your ships. How longer would anybody care to still hire mercs if they lose all anyway?

Translated into EvE terms, how longer till industry corps (the huge majority of war targets) realize it's pointless to get defenders and thus make the whole new mechanic sit unused, while the industry corpies still stay docked for the wardec duration like now?


As I pointed out to you in another thread, the ability to hire mercs (if needed) is to allow YOU to win/end the war.

It is not intended to allow you to ignore the war.

If your only interest is in maximizing profit, pay the surrender fee and get back to business.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Grumpymunky
Monkey Steals The Peach
#90 - 2012-04-10 01:21:46 UTC
Dbars Grinding wrote:
you guys r too easy. :(

I can't believe you still had everyone after these posts:
Dbars Grinding wrote:
i just had to spend my last 20 dollars to buy a plex for a new hulk. Now i will have to go hungry for a few days. Thx CCP for making a terrible game.
Dbars Grinding wrote:
a different fit to make even less isk than i make right now? Think i might keep this account open to post daily about how bad this game is.

Post with your monkey.

Thread locked due to lack of pants.
Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#91 - 2012-04-10 01:27:03 UTC
Bane Necran wrote:
The only thing considered unfair in EVE is when you can't be killed for some reason.


or apparently if you arent killed by CONCORD

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.
Siva Surya Kshatriya
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#92 - 2012-04-10 02:27:50 UTC
Ioci wrote:
Metal Icarus wrote:
I could buy an old geo (old p.o.s sad excuse for a vehicle) that barely runs, put a brick on the gas pedal, point it at the closest Ferrari dealer and let it go.

is that fair to the dealer?





And the Police would declare you a bad man and ignore you the next time they saw you down town with a shotgun because you hadn't really done anything, yet.
Using RL fails for a reason.


Oh yea? How's this: a 160 HP Mazda Miata driven by a professional will routinely beat a Honda NSX or Ferrari 360 driven by an amateur. I've seen situations like that happen on the track. Point is, you can't expect the cost of the ship to make up for a lack of piloting skill (unless you're flying a R35 GTR, that is). I know that's more applicable to traditional PVP but the point about ISK cost and player skill stands.
Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#93 - 2012-04-10 02:36:36 UTC
Why the hell would you pay 325 mill for a Hulk?
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#94 - 2012-04-10 03:01:32 UTC
Dbars Grinding wrote:
This is clearly fair.



hulks mine better than titans. By your logic that's clearly unfair as well.



https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#95 - 2012-04-10 05:55:40 UTC
Listen, I put expensive ******* implants in that pod, it shouldn't be killable by a six cent Rifter.

Belligerent Undesirables Selling Griefer Immunity
Darthewok
Perkone
Caldari State
#96 - 2012-04-10 06:24:10 UTC
Why are Hulks so @#!#!@ing expensive.
ORE must manufacture Hulks by welding ISK together.

CAVEAT RICHARDUS VOLVERE - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0
Rel'k Bloodlor
Federation Front Line Report
Federation Front Line
#97 - 2012-04-10 11:46:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Rel'k Bloodlor
just mine in out of the way lowsec. my alts do and they have yet to be killed, well minning.

Hell most of teh time they get called "bait" or "haha nice try noob" or "maulers are more convincing"

I wanted to paint my space ship red, but I couldn't find enough goats. 
Iria Ahrens
Space Perverts and Forum Pirates
#98 - 2012-04-10 12:29:19 UTC
Arzaiuc wrote:
Metal Icarus wrote:
I could buy an old geo (old p.o.s sad excuse for a vehicle) that barely runs, put a brick on the gas pedal, point it at the closest Ferrari dealer and let it go.

is that fair to the dealer?





Because real life is like EVE in that acts of terrorism have no consequences Roll


Please don't use the word terrorism so frivolously.

My choice of pronouns is based on your avatar. Even if I know what is behind the avatar.
Mr Bigwinky
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#99 - 2012-04-10 13:07:23 UTC
Can't we just have a "I died and want to cry about it" forum?

Oh you're right, it's the one I'm in. Thanks.
Welcome to EVE online, here's your rubix cube, go F*** yourself ♥
Lady Spank
Get Out Nasty Face
#100 - 2012-04-10 13:09:59 UTC
Another spastic blocked.

(ಠ_ృ) ~ It Takes a Million Years to Become Diamonds So Lets Just Burn Like Coal Until the Sky's Black ~ (ಠ_ృ)