These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

If you haven't got anything good to say....

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Theodemir
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#21 - 2011-09-12 12:26:48 UTC
The only criticism needed for EvE is that it lacks any form of competitor. If EvE had that, the higher echelons of CCP management may for once get off sitting on their thumbs and sweep up the bugs plaguing EvE that some say have been around for years. I've only been playing for one and a half years so relatively new to them. I feel for those that have been playing for a lot longer.

Also whine is good. Especially with cheese and when one wants a Khanid Abaddon varient. WHINE!!!!
VaMei
Meafi Corp
#22 - 2011-09-12 12:39:13 UTC  |  Edited by: VaMei
Vyl Vit wrote:
...and as someone said just yesterday, "It's the game I hate to love."

It's definitely a love/hate relationship. No doubt there.

This is a sandbox game, the Devs provide us with the toys, and we make what we will with them. The problem is that no two players want to make exactly the same thing in the sandbox, so getting a consensus on what should be changed, fixed, or added is like herding cats. Some players want more theme park activities. Some players want avatars. Some players want more world shaping activities. Some players want bigger battles and some want smaller ones. Some want Eve to become a broader game, others want CCP to refine what made Eve great. For most players, Eve would be so much better if CCP would just do [this].

In the end, when anyone sees that CCP is spending development funding on something that doesn't improve their gameplay, they feel they have something to comment on, or outright ***** about (myself included). When enough players have enough things they want to ***** about, you have **** storms on the forums just like we've been seeing.

It's not because we hate the game. If we hated the game, we'd simply walk away. It's because we love the game, but for each of us it could be so much better if only CCP would change/fix/implement [this] instead of working on [that].
Written Word
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2011-09-12 12:42:42 UTC
I'm pretty sure EVE General exists for trolls, rants, rage and whines
Vyl Vit
#24 - 2011-09-12 12:50:10 UTC
I was merely repeating something my mom (and a lot of your moms) told me so I'd know why she boxed my ears...now and again. The point isn't "don't criticize." That was said nowhere in the post. But, a bit of perspective and proportion is in order, as always. I had something nice to say. It isn't a stab in the back. There is already plenty of text laying out what legitimate criticism there is.

However, I do recall reading in another "warrior" post, that an objective of this minority of wannabee activists is to step on everyone's post to redirect them to the avenue of discontent...should the post say something nice. Well. There you go. The names are listed here. Thanks for responding. But, of course, by now, we all know who you are.

Paradise is like where you are right now, only much, much better.
Tuggboat
Oneida Inc.
#25 - 2011-09-12 12:50:44 UTC
What gets me is how adamant people are that their criticism is need, valued, pertinent or useful. Criticism just hurts people, it does not change them. Look around at your own lives, how many people that you have criticized have evolved into people you now think are perfect? How many of them keep hanging around at all? The real source of the problem is the person criticizing. Old saying goes when you got one finger pointing at someone else, look at your hand and you'll see three pointing back at you.

Anything you don't like can be an obstacle to overcome. The answer isn't to make the game different, its to play it different. As long as you look to other people to fix your problems, they have power to run your life. Used to be another saying around here. Adapt or die. What I hear are a bunch of poor losers looking to blame some one else. Try Try again, set some goals, make some plans, execute and measure your results.

What are all you whiners trying to accomplish that you can't accomplish? What part of yourself can you change to accomplish that? Use the game to find your own weaknesses and overcome them.
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#26 - 2011-09-12 13:01:49 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
...don't say anything at all. This forum is already groaning under the weight of rampant and acerbic criticism. To read along one might get the idea this game sucks so badly it's amazing all the critics have played it at all, let alone as long as they have. Yet, we have, and there must be some reason why. Mea culpa. I've been in there tossing my BS-filled wit around with everyone else, but now I'd like to try to retrieve the baby before it goes out the window with the bathwater.


The situation has gotten pretty grim with Eve Online is why the mood is like this. When people start seeing abandonment and neglect of the core game damaging the communities of players they have built and enjoyed here then of course they get verbal and angry. In New Eden what you have is no more than what you fight for and that goes double for the game we enjoy that now needs rescuing from evil suits and corrupt money-men trying to nickle and dime this universe to oblivion while catering to the next butterfly infatuation with MT profiteering.

Quote:
This is the best game, hands down, the best and you can deny it all you want you know it's true. CCP has designed something here, the artists, computer whizzes down to the stock clerk, that will stand in digital history regardless of how much the high and mighty "I can do better than this" screamers claim it's full of junk. The plain fact is, it isn't. It's a game with good integrity, unsurpassed graphics, thought provoking content, and artwork that is head and shoulders above the vast majority of other digital offerings.


If the game wasn't worth it there'd be no outcry of passion from those interested in saving it. You can bet the Age of Conan / Warhammer Online devs WISHED they had a community that cared as much about those products as the Eve community care about this one.

Quote:
After all the uproar on this forum about Incarna I began feeling like I was logging onto this horrendous waste of my hard earned dollar. I was looking for rapscallion ripoffs over both my shoulders and not really looking at what I was doing at all. So, I took another look with a fresh set of eyes. And, it's still there; the EVE that's grabbed my imagination since '07. It's beautiful. It's responsive. It's challenging. It's demanding, and rewarding, and as someone said just yesterday, "It's the game I hate to love." Regardless of all the spiteful, hateful and downright ill-considered verbiage that has passed the past few months, in the main CCP you've done a stellar job, and I have every confidence you'll continue to do the best you can with our baby EVE. Yes, most of us whether we'll admit it or not, have adopted your creation as our own. It's our child. May its future be bright and expansive.


Yep Eve is our child. So its right to get angry when some gold-monocle-sporting human-traffic-profiteer tries to sell our child to an eastern european vice ring for 3600 aurum notes.

CCP "did" a stellar job in producing this game and delivering the epic early expansions. But for the last few years its been poor and they have made some spectacularly bad decisions about how to spend the money they raised from our continuing support through subscriptions. CCP have been a holdout in the industry by inviting a partnership with the player community to help guide this game universe and prevent them making horrible mistakes. All this outcry and passion is about preventing those mistakes and getting the universe of Eve Online back on track to greatness.

I wouldn't be so passionate myself if I didn't think that Eve Online could be saved. I would like to think that the many many comrades and fellow players I've known who have quit this game in despair at the neglect could still be won back if CCP commit to a sequence of full expansions and return their focus to this game front and centre.

I want that community to live again. I want CCP to end the neglect and start developing Eve again. I'd like them to acknowledge that diverting so much resource to Dust/Incarna/WOD was a mistake and to correct that - but even if pride doesn't allow that recourse then just making the correction and starting to plan future Exodus scale expansions again would be enough to restore my faith in the game developers and start feeling good about the game once again.

So to the op. While I can understand your sentiments please understand mine. I care about this game and community and if I didn't I'd have walked away long ago. But if you care about a friend of yours truly you don't let them sit in a basement smoking rock for 3 years and letting their health slip away till they are shadow of their former self as a living dead remnant. You do something while its still soon enough to make a difference.

Eve forums right now are fully of people trying to do something to make that difference.

And I for one applaud them.

The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom
Ifly Uwalk
Perkone
Caldari State
#27 - 2011-09-12 13:22:22 UTC
A few days ago a bought a new car. The very next day one of the wheels fell off.

Now, I could have immediately called Volkswagen to complain and fix it, but I didn't because, well, it's a Bugatti Veyron!

I mean, sure, it's a bumpy ride but - you know...

Uh...
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#28 - 2011-09-12 13:26:00 UTC
You can't even be serious? They put the ignore feature on the new forums...

If someone is constantly bitching ignore them.

Its not like there's nothing wrong with the game. Many of the points made are valid.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Trolls Troll
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#29 - 2011-09-12 13:29:32 UTC
I love when people make whine threads about people whining. Warms me cockles

Op, for every person that you think is whining there are 2 that think you are too.

EVERYONE ENTITLED TO THEIR OWN SAY, THAT'S WHY SEESEEPEE GAVE YOU IGNORE BUTTON.

fake edit: caps
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#30 - 2011-09-12 13:32:18 UTC
Trolls Troll wrote:
THAT'S WHY SEESEEPEE GAVE YOU IGNORE BUTTON.



Ah, thank you for mentioning that. I hadn't noticed it until now.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Niko Takahashi
Yoshitomi Group
#31 - 2011-09-12 13:32:59 UTC
I just wrote maybe too lengthy of a post trying to fairly judge CCP.

Praising the concept of the game but bit bashing the technical execution fo the coding.

The forums ate my post not going to write it again. SEE Big smile
Tabatha Ravenclaw
Doomheim
#32 - 2011-09-12 13:35:48 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
...don't say anything at all. This forum is already groaning under the weight of rampant and acerbic criticism. To read along one might get the idea this game sucks so badly it's amazing all the critics have played it at all, let alone as long as they have. Yet, we have, and there must be some reason why. Mea culpa. I've been in there tossing my BS-filled wit around with everyone else, but now I'd like to try to retrieve the baby before it goes out the window with the bathwater.

This is the best game, hands down, the best and you can deny it all you want you know it's true. CCP has designed something here, the artists, computer whizzes down to the stock clerk, that will stand in digital history regardless of how much the high and mighty "I can do better than this" screamers claim it's full of junk. The plain fact is, it isn't. It's a game with good integrity, unsurpassed graphics, thought provoking content, and artwork that is head and shoulders above the vast majority of other digital offerings.

After all the uproar on this forum about Incarna I began feeling like I was logging onto this horrendous waste of my hard earned dollar. I was looking for rapscallion ripoffs over both my shoulders and not really looking at what I was doing at all. So, I took another look with a fresh set of eyes. And, it's still there; the EVE that's grabbed my imagination since '07. It's beautiful. It's responsive. It's challenging. It's demanding, and rewarding, and as someone said just yesterday, "It's the game I hate to love."

Regardless of all the spiteful, hateful and downright ill-considered verbiage that has passed the past few months, in the main CCP you've done a stellar job, and I have every confidence you'll continue to do the best you can with our baby EVE. Yes, most of us whether we'll admit it or not, have adopted your creation as our own. It's our child. May its future be bright and expansive.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL1lfSzgcAw
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#33 - 2011-09-12 13:37:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
Tippia wrote:
Without criticism, there is no moving forward.

If you haven't got anything good to say, say it — it needs to be said.


There is a yawning gulf separating constructive criticism and the sh*t-flinging that many people around here do

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders
Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2011-09-12 13:40:56 UTC
Stitcher wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Without criticism, there is no moving forward.

If you haven't got anything good to say, say it — it needs to be said.


There is a yawning gulf separating constructive criticism and the sh*t-flinging that many people around here do


Yeah...what he said.

Criticising something and providing and alternative idea to resolve your complaint is one thing. Crying, bitching, and moaning about something just because you don't like it and throwing a little tantrum because it isn't done your way is something else entirely.

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821
Mag's
Azn Empire
#35 - 2011-09-12 13:43:20 UTC
Yes there is a lot of complaining atm and I can't remember it ever being so bad. But if you don't like to read it, then don't, you do after all have free will in the regard.

Personally I really don't like the route CCP is taking atm, it's doing far more harm than good imho. But that doesn't mean everyone will agree and I accept that is the case. But this means reading opposing views, whether I like it or not.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Richard Aiel
The Merchants of War
#36 - 2011-09-12 13:45:54 UTC
CCP Fallout wrote:
While I understand your sentiment, I don't necessarily agree with your method. A thread like this one will usually, if not always, come away with a lot of trolling :D

One of the best things any user can do, if they have issue or concerns with a particular thread, is to use the report button and provide a detailed reason as to why the thread should be reviewed and/or moderated. This will help us on the Community team spot problematic threads much more quickly.


unless apparently, the poster is part of the CSM or Goons. Ive been reporting them for the better part of a week and watching the mods not take action.

this thread

the above if you look through it is pretty much filled with trolling goons ans CSMs (Two Step and The Mittani - like its unusual for mittans to troll).

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r188/buddahcjcc/SOA-3-2.jpg
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#37 - 2011-09-12 13:51:56 UTC
Chribba wrote:
Vyl Vit wrote:
This is the best game, hands down, the best and you can deny it all you want you know it's true.
I agree.

/c



You know eve isn't just competing with other computer games.
After it has been around for 500 years I might consider that it is better than chess.

EVE is the best MMO, but saying that doesn't amount to very much. I would never play most mmos at all, let alone for over 6 months. Even eve is likely not to be able to compete with other things that I can spend free time on.

Anyway there are numerous ways eve can be made better. But it takes continued work. CCP is not assigning anyone to do that work. That is why there are so many threads.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#38 - 2011-09-12 13:53:55 UTC
Richard Aiel wrote:
CCP Fallout wrote:
While I understand your sentiment, I don't necessarily agree with your method. A thread like this one will usually, if not always, come away with a lot of trolling :D

One of the best things any user can do, if they have issue or concerns with a particular thread, is to use the report button and provide a detailed reason as to why the thread should be reviewed and/or moderated. This will help us on the Community team spot problematic threads much more quickly.


unless apparently, the poster is part of the CSM or Goons. Ive been reporting them for the better part of a week and watching the mods not take action.

this thread

the above if you look through it is pretty much filled with trolling goons ans CSMs (Two Step and The Mittani - like its unusual for mittans to troll).


You seem to be making an error very common to these forums, which is to assume that someone who disagrees with you is trolling.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Reeno Coleman
#39 - 2011-09-12 15:53:29 UTC
CCP Fallout wrote:
While I understand your sentiment, I don't necessarily agree with your method. A thread like this one will usually, if not always, come away with a lot of trolling :D

One of the best things any user can do, if they have issue or concerns with a particular thread, is to use the report button and provide a detailed reason as to why the thread should be reviewed and/or moderated. This will help us on the Community team spot problematic threads much more quickly.


The report button, right, which rep.... oh there! Well that is hidden pretty well. Also bad icon choice. A flag? What's the correlation between a flag and reporting?

sorry, bit offtopic here, but it just came to mind. (:
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2011-09-12 15:54:56 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
Skippermonkey wrote:
yes, lets never critisize anything in the game that we dislike and hope that they get magically fixed

...grow up


Well, "Skipper." If you don't think there's enough criticism on this forum already...and you're saying I should grow up...sonny boy, you got a long way to go.


I ll add

Criticize is good.

Angry mob/hate rabble is not.