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Announcing the Officers of CSM 7

First post
Author
Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#81 - 2012-04-05 19:15:53 UTC
Orisa Medeem wrote:
I'd like to understand how the candidates for each position were selected.

For instance, for the chairman position I would expect that the eligible members would be either:
- 2nd and 3rd, that is, Two Step and Elise
- 2nd to 7th, that is, Two Step, Elise, Greene Lee, Trebor, Kelduum, Seleene

I just don't understand why it was restricted to Two Step and Seleene. The same goes for the other positions.


Only some people were interested in running for some of the positions. Those are the only people that are listed.

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog

Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#82 - 2012-04-05 19:23:02 UTC
Orisa Medeem wrote:
I'd like to understand how the candidates for each position were selected.

For instance, for the chairman position I would expect that the eligible members would be either:
- 2nd and 3rd, that is, Two Step and Elise
- 2nd to 7th, that is, Two Step, Elise, Greene Lee, Trebor, Kelduum, Seleene

I just don't understand why it was restricted to Two Step and Seleene. The same goes for the other positions.

Based on the discussions about CSM structure at the winter summit, the concept of "alt delegate" was eliminated starting with CSM7. So all members were eligible for all offices, and all members could vote on them. However, only a few delegates indicated their interest in each office.

Additionally, it was generally understood that for practical reasons, the chairman should be selected from one of the top 7 vote-getters, simply because he/she would be expected to attend the summits.

CSM procedures have evolved considerably since the initial white paper, and it is generally agreed that there will have to be further discussions inside CSM and between CSM and CCP regarding revising the "law of the land". We will, of course, keep the community fully informed about any proposed changes.

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery

Orisa Medeem
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#83 - 2012-04-05 19:49:33 UTC
Thanks for the clarification.

:sand:  over  :awesome:

Hroya
#84 - 2012-04-05 21:33:46 UTC
After some dusts settles the CSM is now in place.

Who does what in what capacity within the CSM is not important at all. You guys/girls/entities are there to work together and represent the playerbase when interacting with CCP.

Your actions this year will be in the spotlight due to the results of the elections. The burden is on you to do the right thing.
Mind you that you represent the entire playerbase and that includes the players that amassed 10,058 votes aswell.

Seeing as how Mittens played a role in solving unpleasant events in the previous year, it wouldnt be a waste to keep in touch with him in some form or fashion and discuss various idea's with him aswell. ( provided it doesnt interfere with any nda's of course).

This year will be the decided wether the csm will be a valid entity or go down in flames for many people out there.




You go your corridor but.

Elise Randolph
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#85 - 2012-04-05 22:04:55 UTC
Hroya wrote:
After some dusts settles the CSM is now in place.

Who does what in what capacity within the CSM is not important at all. You guys/girls/entities are there to work together and represent the playerbase when interacting with CCP.

Your actions this year will be in the spotlight due to the results of the elections. The burden is on you to do the right thing.
Mind you that you represent the entire playerbase and that includes the players that amassed 10,058 votes aswell.

Seeing as how Mittens played a role in solving unpleasant events in the previous year, it wouldnt be a waste to keep in touch with him in some form or fashion and discuss various idea's with him aswell. ( provided it doesnt interfere with any nda's of course).

This year will be the decided wether the csm will be a valid entity or go down in flames for many people out there.




The CSM should be under scrutiny every term, there should never exist a CSM body that is content to do nothing.

Regarding the 10,058 duders who have no CSM rep, I do have good news. In CSM 6 Mittani and I agreed on practically everything. So I gotchu~

~

Lanasak
Doomheim
#86 - 2012-04-05 22:55:10 UTC
Elise Randolph wrote:
Regarding the 10,058 duders who have no CSM rep, I do have good news. In CSM 6 Mittani and I agreed on practically everything. So I gotchu~


and you even log in ~heh~
HELIC0N ONE
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#87 - 2012-04-05 23:24:06 UTC
Elise Randolph wrote:
Regarding the 10,058 duders who have no CSM rep, I do have good news. In CSM 6 Mittani and I agreed on practically everything. So I gotchu~


So that means you'll be advocating ~death2allsupercaps~, right?
Hroya
#88 - 2012-04-06 01:05:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Hroya
Supers are fine aslong as they have a proper counter apart from more supers thrown against them.
If that isnt the case then they arent fitting well within the concept in eve as everything has a counter.

But solve one problem and you get 2 new ones. Every change should be looked at from all angles and make sure they dont disrupt another fabric of eve.
Like an elite titan building a bridge between reall space and wh's would require more thought as it does indeed disrupt some parts of eve.

There are quite a few small and big issue's in eve that need to be looked at, supers may be one of them and making a stance on any of them from the csm's point of vieuw right now would mean that none have been discussed yet from all angles.

CSM shouldnt make add hoc statements but ensure that player feedback and opinions from the pro and neg are all taken into accaunt without bias.

You signed up for it, campaigns never mattered, you should be neutral and respect the input given, from the rightious and the villians alike, to ensure eve is the game to play.

If it means you have to give up what you yourself wanted most in eve then that is what it should take.

You go your corridor but.

Elise Randolph
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#89 - 2012-04-06 05:48:42 UTC
HELIC0N ONE wrote:
Elise Randolph wrote:
Regarding the 10,058 duders who have no CSM rep, I do have good news. In CSM 6 Mittani and I agreed on practically everything. So I gotchu~


So that means you'll be advocating ~death2allsupercaps~, right?


Unironically, yes. Both Mittani and Vile Rat were professionally awesome bros amongst bros on the CSM and our views on the game line up pretty close believe it or not. If you have an idea/issue/whatever that you'd otherwise bring up to one of them, you can feel free to hit me up. Or you can hit them up and they can hit me up, w/e yo

~

Killer Gandry
Fabritech Engineering
Spectrum Alliance
#90 - 2012-04-06 21:53:23 UTC
I haz me eyes on ya anyways.

So CSM do the right CSM dance or else Shiver me Timbers, we gonna make ya'll walk da Plank.

Venus Rinah
Arcanum Industry
#91 - 2012-04-07 01:59:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Venus Rinah
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:

CSM procedures have evolved considerably since the initial white paper, and it is generally agreed that there will have to be further discussions inside CSM and between CSM and CCP regarding revising the "law of the land". We will, of course, keep the community fully informed about any proposed changes.


Novel suggestion, but why don't you involve the electorate in discussions regarding constitutional changes? After all the "law of the land" I'm assuming is designed to help best serve the players not the CSM?

I don't want to just be informed of what you propose to change.

As such I simply hope CCP isn't allowing the CSM to rewrite the constitution as per their own interests. Especially without player involvement or appropriate referendum? Whilst I recgonise some things could do with improving, the allowance of the CSM to rewrite the law needs to ensure player/electorate involvement.

For instance if CCP and CSM advocate lobbying as the only official method of communicating with CCP through the CSM, then the process of public discussion, collections of as many views and public accountability will simply go out the window. And whilst I recognise that some antiquated systems might not be fully utilised at present, e.g. AH it doesn't mean that the players shouldnt have official open discussions on development with CCP. The idea of the blog discussions could be promoted further to ensure as much voiced opinion on the matter is collected whilst still affording decision or advocacy on those views as appropriate, without the CSM being weighed down by antiquated policies. This especially after the CSM had made efforts to encourage more of these open discussions with CCP following the incarna issues.

Please consider these political motivations carefully, as it could be seen to make the CSM ineffectual from peoples perspective if they forget who put them there or include them effectively in the political process.
Frying Doom
#92 - 2012-04-07 07:15:37 UTC
Venus Rinah wrote:
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:

CSM procedures have evolved considerably since the initial white paper, and it is generally agreed that there will have to be further discussions inside CSM and between CSM and CCP regarding revising the "law of the land". We will, of course, keep the community fully informed about any proposed changes.


Novel suggestion, but why don't you involve the electorate in discussions regarding constitutional changes?

What constitution? Its just a bunch of basic rules, so it doesn't have all the legalities involved with constitutional amendments.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Indahmawar Fazmarai
#93 - 2012-04-07 08:45:46 UTC
(off topic)

When will the new CSM get their CSM badges?
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#94 - 2012-04-07 17:38:36 UTC  |  Edited by: MeBiatch
well since i voted for selene with this char i am happy to see an initial disapointing turnout lead to this victory...

congrats too all the other CSM peeps... and heres hoping to many tears and popcorns threads this year!

interesting enough but mittenz will never run for csm again... so here is for vile rat fellow canadian for csm 8?

though if you guys do a good enough job i might reactivte my 3 other chars... so that one vote for selene one for meissa then two left... probs one for trebor and one for ??? (even though hes a goon he is canadian...)

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.

Marsan
#95 - 2012-04-08 22:44:28 UTC
Seleene wrote:

Yeah, that was the T3 Super Titans. Since they are modular, you can configure them specifically to do different things (combat, industry, exploration, etc...). Each configuration is very versitile seeing as how there are seven sub-systems. One of the exploration configurations allows you to place a 'Mass Generator' at each end of a Super Titan. You then fly the Super Titan into a wormhole and use the mid-ship sub-system to 'anchor' the ship in transit. Once this is done, you essentially have half of the Super Titan in the wormhole and outside of it in normal space. You then activate the mass generators on each end of the titan, thus creating a stabilization effect that keeps the wormhole from collapsing.


The problem with this idea is it takes the isolated small holding nature of wspace into the suck that is Null Sec. Most w-space folks are in w-space because they don't want to live in NS. This would put all of wspace at the mercy of the various NS alliances, and drive a lot of people out of the game. All in the name of being able to crack the handful of fortress C6 systems which are nearly impenetrable.

Former forum cheerleader CCP, now just a grumpy small portion of the community.

MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#96 - 2012-04-08 23:43:51 UTC
Marsan wrote:
Seleene wrote:

Yeah, that was the T3 Super Titans. Since they are modular, you can configure them specifically to do different things (combat, industry, exploration, etc...). Each configuration is very versitile seeing as how there are seven sub-systems. One of the exploration configurations allows you to place a 'Mass Generator' at each end of a Super Titan. You then fly the Super Titan into a wormhole and use the mid-ship sub-system to 'anchor' the ship in transit. Once this is done, you essentially have half of the Super Titan in the wormhole and outside of it in normal space. You then activate the mass generators on each end of the titan, thus creating a stabilization effect that keeps the wormhole from collapsing.


The problem with this idea is it takes the isolated small holding nature of wspace into the suck that is Null Sec. Most w-space folks are in w-space because they don't want to live in NS. This would put all of wspace at the mercy of the various NS alliances, and drive a lot of people out of the game. All in the name of being able to crack the handful of fortress C6 systems which are nearly impenetrable.


or you could make it so it only works in c5 and higher?

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.

Starbuck Raider
Perkone
Caldari State
#97 - 2012-04-09 21:59:32 UTC
In light of Jester's blog , which, if those concerned aren't aware of they should take the time to read, I would like to invite those CSM members who have yet to do so, or who would like to say more, to go on record here to candidly explain their reasons for casting their votes as they did.

Two Step tells us that "one of the major changes CSM 7 will be making is to try to communicate with the player base in more depth and more often." The controversy surrounding the results of the internal officer election has primarily been fuelled by a failure of those involved to consider that the electorate may deserve an added degree of transparency in relation to this process and its outcome, which could only come through each of the delegates taking the time to post here, in the appropriate place, as to the reasons for their voting decision, specifically in regard to the position of Chairman and Vice Chairman. Only this can allay the existing concerns about possible backroom deals, coercion and go at least some way to helping everyone understand how you each made the decision to ignore the popular vote (which has a precedent for determining the right to the chair and was for a candidate who to appears to be held in nothing short of the highest regard by all) in spite of the discussed implications of this.

The dissent echoed by many of us who care deeply about this has received what amounts to rather patronising and ignorant handling by some of the CSM in recent days, having been labelled as "nonsense", "stupid drama", "a big bloody deal" and "tin-foiling" in apparant lack of respect for the legimatacy of the concern, which was given a very articulate and reasoned voice by Jester, one of this community's widely respected commentators. This hasn't done the CSM as a whole any favours and has only fuelled a boomerang of increasing anger in response.

As I am largely responsible for the blog being written, due to writing to Jester with my concerns about the 'whitewash' that I perceived, I feel it is only right to take the time to invite the necessary communication here, that, only which, can serve to resolve this issue without it dangerously undermining the CSM should it continue to be treated with flippancy and disregard.
Adalun Dey
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#98 - 2012-04-09 22:48:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Adalun Dey
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
So? I made the argument that because Alex resigned before he was a seated member of CSM7, he was never a member of CSM7, so Two step was the top vote-getter, and the chair was his if he wanted it. I preferred this because it eliminated stupid drama like this thread.

CCP disagreed, saying that he was a member of CSM7 as soon as he was elected. Thus we had to have an election.

That being the case, I now had to decide who was best suited to each role. Choosing between Seleene and Two step was an edge decision, but given the declared goals of the various people, and especially Two step's desire to increase transparency and do more communications work, I felt that Seleene as chairman and Two step as secretary was the best combination.

I stepped down from secretary to make that possible.

Was The Mittani elected to become chairman of CSM7 or were those elections still to be held among the CSM?


It seems like a contradictio in terminis to determine that the chairman of the CSM is elected by the number of votes from the community each member receives during the elections, then decide that those votes are no longer applicable if the original chairman is removed for any kind of reason and that the position of chairman needs to be decided through a different process.

This begs the question wether The Mittani was to become the chairman of CSM 7 to begin with or wether it had still to be voted as such by the CSM members. There seems to be a lack of continuity between these different subsets of rules.

[i]" Take my love, take my land, take me where I can not stand, I don't care, I'm still free. You can't take the sky from me. "[/i]

Asuri Kinnes
Perkone
Caldari State
#99 - 2012-04-16 17:53:28 UTC
Seleene wrote:
Yeah, that was the T3 Super Titans. Since they are modular, you can configure them specifically to do different things (combat, industry, exploration, etc...). Each configuration is very versitile seeing as how there are seven sub-systems. One of the exploration configurations allows you to place a 'Mass Generator' at each end of a Super Titan. You then fly the Super Titan into a wormhole and use the mid-ship sub-system to 'anchor' the ship in transit. Once this is done, you essentially have half of the Super Titan in the wormhole and outside of it in normal space. You then activate the mass generators on each end of the titan, thus creating a stabilization effect that keeps the wormhole from collapsing.

It's a very expensive solution but quite involved and awesome. Smile

There, now you have a name for it. Enjoy!

Nice troll, with the added benefit of avoiding the question.... In your blog, you stated that you had pretty strong feelings about this.



Have you, in fact, given up on the idea of introducing broken null-sec mechanics into WH's?

Thanks.

Bob is the god of Wormholes.

That's all you need to know.

Lenni Lennipe
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#100 - 2012-04-18 07:01:09 UTC
Rules 11, 18, and 19

'nuff said...